Fab 5

[Iowafarmgirl]

The FAB 5 are interesting subjects because they were such transcendant figures who changed their sport. For instance, Mike Tyson was a fascinating story, although he accomplished very little, and was by any and all accounts, a dangerous sociopath.

Bland personalities who play by the rules do not make good story subjects. No one is interested in watching a movie about how nice Derek Jeter, Paul O'Neill, and Tino Martinez got along while they won the world series, they want to hear about the '86 Mets where Strawberry and Gooden were snorting up in the locker room while Kevin Mitchell was threatening guys with knives.

 

[CAARHawk]

So from now on the only sports documentaries made will be about teams that won the championship. Got it. Can't wait for the movie on last year's Duke team and all the adversity they overcame and how they changed the game.

Okay, you win the award for "Person Caarhawk has to explain how to understand a post" today.

Do you see anywhere where I said that this was not a worthy topic for a documentary? Go back and look, we will wait.........

Okay, No? Well, then what did I say? We will wait.........

Oh, I said the only reason this team is venerated is because they were overhyped by the media and they are all in denial about their importance and that they are as much of the problem as the teammate they scapegoat, Webber.

Get it?

Now go back to your freshman Rhetoric class and try a little harder to learn how to analyze an argument.

 

[HawkeyeMike23]

Okay, you win the award for "Person Caarhawk has to explain how to understand a post" today.

Do you see anywhere where I said that this was not a worthy topic for a documentary? Go back and look, we will wait.........

Okay, No? Well, then what did I say? We will wait.........

Oh, I said the only reason this team is venerated is because they were overhyped by the media and they are all in denial about their importance and that they are as much of the problem as the teammate they scapegoat, Webber.

Get it?

Now go back to your freshman Rhetoric class and try a little harder to learn how to analyze an argument.

Except your argument is completely wrong and they are not in denial about their importance. They played a huge role in college basketball getting to the state that it is in today. Whether or not that is a good thing is debatable, but to say their not important is just wrong.

So yeah keep trying to make this illogical argument that they weren't at all important to the game of college basketball.

 

[IAJay]

I love how everyone that speaks out about the Fab 5 is labeled a racist.

You don't understand why this is?

 

[bud2380]

Quick, who won the Oscar for best actress in 2008? Can't name that person? Oh, but you do know who Kim Kardashian and Paris Hilton are. So they be more important, I guess. Quick, who won the Olympic Gold Medal for figure skating the year Tanya Harding had what's her name's knee capped? Oh, you just remember Tanya?

You are making an argument about media hype, celebrity, and ESPN running amok. This team was annointed before they even played a game. But when it came to climbing the mountain top the fell short. End of story.

You are making an EXTREMELY weak argument that Michigan failed because they made it to 2 national title games in two years and didn't win either. Weak weak argument. You are going to have to do a lot better than that.

 

[CAARHawk]

Except your argument is completely wrong and they are not in denial about their importance. They played a huge role in college basketball getting to the state that it is in today. Whether or not that is a good thing is debatable, but to say their not important is just wrong.

So yeah keep trying to make this illogical argument that they weren't at all important to the game of college basketball.

They are important because they were hyped by the media. Plain and simple. They came in expecting to win a championship and ESPN went overboard with them. They didn't, but they walk around like what they did was more important. They would be the Buffalo Bills if ESPN didn't pimp them.

Really, they are a cultural anomaly that tells us a lot more about the rise of ESPN's influence on American culture than anything these kids did. Seriously, it's Jon and Kate, Jersey Shore, etc. It is about celebrity, not basketball. Did kids wear their shorts longer? Sure. But kids also got their hair cut like Kid' N Play and Vanilla Ice, but that doesn't mean they are more important than Run DMC and the Beastie Boyz in the history of hip hop.

Jalen likes to talk about how nobody will remember who won the NCAA Championship in 3 years. Yeah, but they will be in the record books forever. While you will fade away as soon as a group of children born in the 80's forgets about you.

 

[SDK46]

They played a huge role in college basketball getting to the state that it is in today.

And this is the problem with message boards with people with no sense of history.

The Fab 5 didn't put college BB "where it is today" all by themselves. It's been going on for decades.

UNLV, 1951 City College of NYC, Calipari/Pitino/Floyd/Haskins/O'Brien/Sampson/Jarvis Baylor, William and Mary-1951...........

The Fab-5 caused nothing. They simply perpetuated it.

 

[HawkeyeMike23]

They are important because they were hyped by the media. Plain and simple. They came in expecting to win a championship and ESPN went overboard with them. They didn't, but they walk around like what they did was more important. They would be the Buffalo Bills if ESPN didn't pimp them.

Really, they are a cultural anomaly that tells us a lot more about the rise of ESPN's influence on American culture than anything these kids did. Seriously, it's Jon and Kate, Jersey Shore, etc. It is about celebrity, not basketball. Did kids wear their shorts longer? Sure. But kids also got their hair cut like Kid' N Play and Vanilla Ice, but that doesn't mean they are more important than Run DMC and the Beastie Boyz in the history of hip hop.

Jalen likes to talk about how nobody will remember who won the NCAA Championship in 3 years. Yeah, but they will be in the record books forever. While you will fade away as soon as a group of children born in the 80's forgets about you.

They weren't hyped to win a championship when they came to Michigan. Recruiting was not followed anywhere near as closely as it is today. The average college basketball had no idea who any of these guys were when they came to Michigan. They were hyped because they were good. They took a Duke team that was one of the greatest teams in NCAA history to OT in just their fourth or fifth game. They were a six seed going into the tourney and went all the way to the final - as freshman.

Today it's common that freshman come in and contribute back then it was almost unheard of for freshman, let alone mulitple freshman to come in and start. They were hyped alot before their sophomore year, but as the national runner up and returning all their starters they deserved to be. If anything, they have become more hyped as time passes. And sure their names might not be in the record books, but people are going to remember Chris Webber, Jalen Rose, Juwan Howard a hell of a lot longer than they remember Steve Blake, Juan Dixon or Lonny Baxter.

 

[twinlaker]

I think it is important to remember while you are watching this film that it was largely produced by Jalen Rose. Every story has two(or more)sides to it.... what angle are we getting? Also, I think the fact that CW chose not to participate is interesting.
Entertaining - yes, but to be taken with a grain of salt at times.

 

[HawkeyeMike23]

And this is the problem with message boards with people with no sense of history.

The Fab 5 didn't put college BB "where it is today" all by themselves. It's been going on for decades.

UNLV, 1951 City College of NYC, Calipari/Pitino/Floyd/Haskins/O'Brien/Sampson/Jarvis Baylor, William and Mary-1951...........

The Fab-5 caused nothing. They simply perpetuated it.

I didn't say they put college basketball where it is today all my themselves. I said they played a huge role in it, which is correct. Were there other teams that were more influential? Sure, but not many. 1966 Texas Western is one, but the Fab Five is right up there after that team. So yes in any historical sense they played a huge role in some the changes that came to college basketball soon after.

 

[bud2380]

BUT, THEY CHEATED. Good God man. Do you not understand college athletics? See SDK's comments. Who frickin' cares what they did. They cheated, and they STILL didn't win a title. Why the hell is this on the air? They brought Michigan basketball to it's knees. Destroyed it for a decade. And you defend this? Get a clue.

From watching the documentary it sounds like the players did take some money. "pocket change" as Jalen said for gas, pizza, etc. Probably very similar to what tons of athletes do everyday, they just don't get caught. Does that justify it? No, but you are singling these guys out because they were so good. The fact is Michigan recruited these players fairly and legally.

The reason this documentary aired is because the Fab 5 were a phenom. A revolution. This was one of the best sports documentaries I have ever seen. Very well done. It focused primarily on how the Fab 5 came to be and what they did once they arrived at Michigan. You can hate on them all you want, but these guys changed the game (whether it made the game better or worse is debatable), but they permanently changed college basketball. So that is not worthy of a documentary? Maybe ESPN should consult you first before they make them. Then we can concentrate on Indiana's legendary swimming team or something instead. Maybe that is more to your liking?

 

[twinlaker]

From watching the documentary it sounds like the players did take some money. "pocket change" as Jalen said for gas, pizza, etc. Probably very similar to what tons of athletes do everyday, they just don't get caught. Does that justify it? No, but you are singling these guys out because they were so good. The fact is Michigan recruited these players fairly and legally.

The reason this documentary aired is because the Fab 5 were a phenom. A revolution. This was one of the best sports documentaries I have ever seen. Very well done. It focused primarily on how the Fab 5 came to be and what they did once they arrived at Michigan. You can hate on them all you want, but these guys changed the game (whether it made the game better or worse is debatable), but they permanently changed college basketball. So that is not worthy of a documentary? Maybe ESPN should consult you first before they make them. Then we can concentrate on Indiana's legendary swimming team or something instead. Maybe that is more to your liking?

Not sure I understand what you mean... how did they change the game of basketball, and in particular change it permanently?

 

[ISUhawk]

A little off topic, but today Hurley was on Dan Patrick and they asked how he felt about the doc. He laughed said they were all bitter. He then said he was surprised when they all thought he didn't have any game and goes idk how they thought I had no game when I dropped 26 on them the first time we played hahah awesome
full interview here...worth listening to
http://www.danpatrick.com/

 

[Hawkeye11en1]

Not sure I understand what you mean... how did they change the game of basketball, and in particular change it permanently?

If I were to guess, I would say he was talking about freshman being forces in college basketball. It wasn't like that before they went to Michigan. Freshman just didn't come in and dominate college basketball like they do today.

 

[hawkfarmer]

From watching the documentary it sounds like the players did take some money. "pocket change" as Jalen said for gas, pizza, etc. Probably very similar to what tons of athletes do everyday, they just don't get caught. Does that justify it? No, but you are singling these guys out because they were so good. The fact is Michigan recruited these players fairly and legally.

The reason this documentary aired is because the Fab 5 were a phenom. A revolution. This was one of the best sports documentaries I have ever seen. Very well done. It focused primarily on how the Fab 5 came to be and what they did once they arrived at Michigan. You can hate on them all you want, but these guys changed the game (whether it made the game better or worse is debatable), but they permanently changed college basketball. So that is not worthy of a documentary? Maybe ESPN should consult you first before they make them. Then we can concentrate on Indiana's legendary swimming team or something instead. Maybe that is more to your liking?

That's what was said. I know it was probably investigated, but who knows if it was legit or not. Nobody but those directly involved.

 

[olivecourt]

A little off topic, but today Hurley was on Dan Patrick and they asked how he felt about the doc. He laughed said they were all bitter. He then said he was surprised when they all thought he didn't have any game and goes idk how they thought I had no game when I dropped 26 on them the first time we played hahah awesome
full interview here...worth listening to
Dan Patrick

I don't think Hurley was mentioned specifically, but Rose said he thought Laettner sucked and was soft UNTIL they stepped on the court with him. Then they realized he was every bit as good as his rep.

As to bitterness-- Jalen Rose explicitly said he was bitter because of all the things Grant Hill had that he didn't, and obviously they were all still bitter about losing. I don't think you'll get too much of an argument from them on that topic-- they are still angry that they lost both of those games. That's how sports are.

I found it fascinating that a bunch of kids from the inner city felt the same way about Duke that a bunch of Iowans do, as expressed in the "sociological experiment" thread. Does anyone like Duke?

 

[Iowafarmgirl]

I don't think Hurley was mentioned specifically, but Rose said he thought Laettner sucked and was soft UNTIL they stepped on the court with him. Then they realized he was every bit as good as his rep.

As to bitterness-- Jalen Rose explicitly said he was bitter because of all the things Grant Hill had that he didn't, and obviously they were all still bitter about losing. I don't think you'll get too much of an argument from them on that topic-- they are still angry that they lost both of those games. That's how sports are.

I found it fascinating that a bunch of kids from the inner city felt the same way about Duke that a bunch of Iowans do, as expressed in the "sociological experiment" thread. Does anyone like Duke?

I like Duke. My life has been much better since I stopped hating on people for being good.

 

[ibahawkeye]

I don't think Hurley was mentioned specifically, but Rose said he thought Laettner sucked and was soft UNTIL they stepped on the court with him. Then they realized he was every bit as good as his rep.

As to bitterness-- Jalen Rose explicitly said he was bitter because of all the things Grant Hill had that he didn't, and obviously they were all still bitter about losing. I don't think you'll get too much of an argument from them on that topic-- they are still angry that they lost both of those games. That's how sports are.

I found it fascinating that a bunch of kids from the inner city felt the same way about Duke that a bunch of Iowans do, as expressed in the "sociological experiment" thread. Does anyone like Duke?

He also said that they lost to a better team when speaking of Duke. He felt they were a better team than UNC.

 

[nickhawk]

I watched the Fab 5 program and thought it was very entertaining.

I was 10-12 year old when these guys were playing and it was very cool to see some behind the scenes footage of players I knew very well.

It made it even cooler to think that Acie, Val and the gang took down the Fab 5 in Carver shortly after the Chris Street tragedy.

There was also another documentary on HBO last night about the UNLV Runnin Rebels that was very entertaining to watch, as UNLV was BIG just about the same time as the Fab 5 and to this day, Iowa's Elite 8 loss to the Rebels after being up by about 20 at halftime is the most painful loss of any Hawkeye sporting event that I can remember.

I DVR'ed both specials and will definitely go back and re-watch both programs.

 

[DexterMorgan]

You don't understand why this is?

I can see the correlation when they were playing, but I don't really think it's a valid point in this day and age. There are plenty of reasons not to like the Fab Five that have little to do with race.