Doyle Put on Paid Administrative Leave Pending External Investigation

[Xerxes]

I see what's going on in Iowa City to be the tip of a very big iceberg. Not to minimize whatever Doyle or Brian have done at all. But no way is this confined to Iowa.

What the Clemson assistant said to a player was about as bad as it gets. Dabo seems to have it pretty swept under the rug so far.

 

[proudhawkfan21]

What does due process have to do with anything? He’s not being prosecuted for a crime.

It has everything to do with it in the Twitter universe we live in today. I'd trust that the players are accurate in their concerns. However, there are two sides to every story. Is a lot of the stuff he did in poor taste? Absolutely. Was it ever brought to his attention that his actions or motivational tactics were offensive? It's very possible it was accepted by most players (im not saying its right) because part of his job is to "toughen" them up (again, I disagree with that motivational tactic). It's easy to say "I would have done it this way or that way" but the bottom line is, we don't have to prepare people for battle, motivate them to send people to their destruction play after play and that person in 6'4 325. I completely disagree with all of the actions and conversations that the players brought up as offensive. But there are still two sides to every story. No, this isn't a court of law, but due process in public opinion can be just as important. My guess is you aren't going to pretend to just be ok with people slaughtering you on twitter.

 

[proudhawkfan21]

Iowa is an at-will employment state. You can legally be fired for any reason under the sun as long as it doesn’t fall under a discriminatory category. They could fire Doyle because they didn’t like how he tied his shoes and still be legal. Plus he’s getting paid right now.

Due process is something that’s required when you’re charged with a crime so that your constitutional rights don’t get violated. None of that applies in this case.

Let’s not get all dramatic here and act like Doyle was randomly thrown in prison by the governor or something.

Read my reply to another post. Due process can describe non-legal items. You might call it being a decent human being and not "pre-judging" someone based on opinions or statements from others. But, if you want to get smarty pants and focus on the term I used, congratulations.

 

[proudhawkfan21]

Wrong. Jaleel Johnson said he was called in to the office by KF to ask him where he got his Camaro when there were other white players with more expensive vehicles who never got quizzed.

Another player got the same thing when he drove a BMW.

There have been complaints from players about KF on Twitter. Not as many as Doyle and BF, but there have been.

You have records that no other player was called out for items that are in question and could be "booster" concerns. May I see that document?

 

[proudhawkfan21]

Not sure of your meaning in #4. Are you saying Doyle has been suspended without his due process? Doyle shouldnt be suspended yet? I think private businesses and especially public institutions can suspend someone with cause and I expect there is language in employee employment contracts that covers this type of action.

You didn't read it right. I said he suspended him. I threw in the idea also that he didn't fire him as he will be allowed his opportunity to present his side to the independent investigators, but i didnt type out that entire train of thought. Edit: He suspended a coach who's tactics and behaviors are in question. The guy isnt NOT suspended. Also, said coach will have his opportunity to defend his actions, but he is indeed suspended. Better?

 

[Fryowa]

You have records that no other player was called out for items that are in question and could be "booster" concerns. May I see that document?

The poster I replied to said that KF had not been part of any of the complaints.

That is false. Like I said in my post.

Jaleel Johnson and another player made the statements that I repeated. Maybe you can ask him for whatever “document” you’re looking for. He accessible via twitter but I’m guessing you won’t do that.

 

[Fryowa]

Read my reply to another post. Due process can describe non-legal items. You might call it being a decent human being and not "pre-judging" someone based on opinions or statements from others. But, if you want to get smarty pants and focus on the term I used, congratulations.

He’s getting paid his $800,000 salary while not working. I’d say that’s pretty decent.

Getting paid, and being given an independent investigation to determine if he did what everyone is saying he did. He’s being allowed to respond to the accusations through the university according to Barta and Ferentz.

 

[proudhawkfan21]

Racism, whether intentional, unconscious bias or institutional is wrong. Everyone can agree on that. It is important to hear, recognize and appreciate the concern that minorities have in regard to having fair and equal opportunities to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. To defend or "but" this in any way misses the point. Lets support or minority brothers and sisters and all be part of the change that leads to a better Iowa, a better America.

Fixing the things we love and take pride in is essential. Throwing it on the trash heap is not the solution. We are Iowa. We fight. We need to fight for Iowa. All Iowans. We have the right gentleman ready to do the right thing in leading the Iowa football program. His heart is right and he will fight to fix it. Its ok to fail. Its not ok to accept failure or to continue to fail. The right first steps have been taken. There are too many steps to count to get where this journey needs to end. Let's keep moving forward and keep our eyes focused on the goal of equality for all.

 

[proudhawkfan21]

He’s getting paid his $800,000 salary while not working. I’d say that’s pretty decent.

Getting paid, and being given an independent investigation to determine if he did what everyone is saying he did. He’s being allowed to respond to the accusations through the university according to Barta and Ferentz.

And.........? If it was available to you, you'd pass? In all of your investigation, your files, he sounds guilty it seems. Heaven forbid you ever have to defend yourself. Id say it doesn't look good but God didn't give me the right to crucify people or assume anything I want about them. Divine power...you ARE impressive.

 

[proudhawkfan21]

The poster I replied to said that KF had not been part of any of the complaints.

That is false. Like I said in my post.

Jaleel Johnson and another player made the statements that I repeated. Maybe you can ask him for whatever “document” you’re looking for. He accessible via twitter but I’m guessing you won’t do that.

He said " coach's office." And, it was about dress code? That's a right of the program to put in the code of conduct. Its not a race issue its a "expression" issue. Is the USMC up for slaughter next? Any business that requires business attire?

 

[proudhawkfan21]

The poster I replied to said that KF had not been part of any of the complaints.

That is false. Like I said in my post.

Jaleel Johnson and another player made the statements that I repeated. Maybe you can ask him for whatever “document” you’re looking for. He accessible via twitter but I’m guessing you won’t do that.

I've read as many articles about this as I can find in searches. I don't see any that say Coach Kirk Ferentz treated me poorly or acted in a racist manner. Coach's office or coaches. If it's out there I haven't seen it.

 

[Fryowa]

I've read as many articles about this as I can find in searches. I don't see any that say Coach Kirk Ferentz treated me poorly or acted in a racist manner. Coach's office or coaches. If it's out there I haven't seen it.

Jaleel Johnson states that KF called him into his office to quiz him on how he got his Camaro when other white players with more extravagant cars did not.

Another player repeated the same scenario when he had a BMW.

Another player said KF spat in the direction of his car when he pulled into the parking lot playing loud music and told him he wouldn’t last long.

Another player said he spoke up to Doyle about another player getting told he’d be sent back to the ghetto and was suspended by KF.

I’m not a player or coach and wasn’t present to decide if whatever happened was racist. But since you’re not able to read at a high enough level I’ll spell this out again.

The poster I was replying to said there were zero complaints against KF. That is false. There have been. Whether you personally think they occurred or not or were racist or not is no concern of mine. I could not care less what your opinion of the situation is. Try and keep up. Again for comprehension purposes, I never said Ferentz did or didn’t do anything. I wasn’t there. What I said was that there have been complaints.

I can run through that for the fourth time if you need, just let me know.

 

[Fryowa]

He said " coach's office." And, it was about dress code? That's a right of the program to put in the code of conduct. Its not a race issue its a "expression" issue. Is the USMC up for slaughter next? Any business that requires business attire?

Jaleel Johnson’s posts on twitter said nothing about a dress code. Have you checked your carbon monoxide detector lately?

 

[Fryowa]

And.........? If it was available to you, you'd pass? In all of your investigation, your files, he sounds guilty it seems. Heaven forbid you ever have to defend yourself. Id say it doesn't look good but God didn't give me the right to crucify people or assume anything I want about them. Divine power...you ARE impressive.

All I said was that he’s getting paid while suspended, and that the U is giving him the opportunity to respond to the accusations as well as an independent investigation. I don’t know what else anyone could ask for in that situation.

 

[proudhawkfan21]

Jaleel Johnson states that KF called him into his office to quiz him on how he got his Camaro when other white players with more extravagant cars did not.

Another player repeated the same scenario when he had a BMW.

Another player said KF spat in the direction of his car when he pulled into the parking lot playing loud music and told him he wouldn’t last long.

Another player said he spoke up to Doyle about another player getting told he’d be sent back to the ghetto and was suspended by KF.

I’m not a player or coach and wasn’t present to decide if whatever happened was racist. But since you’re not able to read at a high enough level I’ll spell this out again.

The poster I was replying to said there were zero complaints against KF. That is false. There have been. Whether you personally think they occurred or not or were racist or not is no concern of mine. I could not care less what your opinion of the situation is. Try and keep up. Again for comprehension purposes, I never said Ferentz did or didn’t do anything. I wasn’t there. What I said was that there have been complaints.

I can run through that for the fourth time if you need, just let me know.

None of that is racist.

 

[proudhawkfan21]

Jaleel Johnson’s posts on twitter said nothing about a dress code. Have you checked your carbon monoxide detector lately?

Your need to send the Hawks back to 1970's era levels astounds me.

 

[HawkGold]

None of that is racist.

Therein is the divide of the issues. Some see it as double standards. Was the same but maybe different cultural standard applied.

 

[ModebaSan]

How did the issue of police brutality and the murder of George Floyd turn into whose feelings were hurt? When we all should be concerned with the history of police violence and brutality against all citizens of this country, black people think they are the only ones being persecuted. Whites and Latinos are killed by police at a much higher rate in this country than that of blacks. When I see these protests, I see an awful lot of white people showing the black community a lot of support. And support by the white people has been growing in this country since the civil rights era began. But when I hear of a white man or a Latino man murdered by police I don’t see any protests or cities burning for them! Where are the black people then? Don’t white and Latino lives matter too? Shouldn’t ALL lives matter? Listen, I felt really angry what happened to George Floyd and other black people that are killed unjustly. But I also get angry when whites and Latinos are killed by cops. When a white or Latino gets killed, all I see is the media interviewing the family. And for the former hawk who’s feeling we’re hurt because Coach Doyle said your tattoo looked like shit. Well I’ve seen a lot of tattoos in my day and I have to say, a good portion do look like shit! But if you were a real man, you would of come back with snappy comeback like, “Hey coach, I saw you peeking at me in the shower, and I don’t go for any of that Jerry Sandusky shit!” Now that would have stopped him in his tracks! If they want to dole it out, they better be able to take it. Doubt you would have had any hurt feelings after that kind of exchange. In fact you would probably have a little sense of pride after that! So don’t give any of that hurt feelings bullshit. It’s one thing to empathize will someone because of a tragic loss, but don’t shit around and make all about you. That’s what they call being a narcissist is. Now you probably cost a man his job, good for you. Hope you feel much better now. Awful glad that you cast that stone because everybody knows you would never, ever hurt someone else’s feelings would you? I said my peace.

 

[Northside Hawk]

At this time and place in history, he will not survive. This is not the old ways anymore.

That said, the one where he forced a player to apologize for standing up to racists comments....Yes that is a complaint. It will get worse and then they will look at basketball with all the transfers and lack of black players starting and staying here. That is what will happen.

If they start in on basketball then someone better look about three hours to the northeast where an average men's roster has been comprised of perhaps one fourth African Americans, where the leading African American scorer just transferred, and where THEIR strength and conditioning coach just resigned.

Fran has tried to recruit certain players. He frequently ends up looking like the contending bidder at the 4-H pig and cattle auction that only ends up driving up the price but rarely gets the prize.

This is not just an Iowa problem. And while you didn't say it we need to stop with the Penn State comparisons. Immediately!

 

[CP87]

in my opinion, if people want change, they need to give people the opportunity to change. If Doyle is remorseful and becomes an advocate for change, would that not move the needle more than firing every person who made a racial innuendo or slight in their lifetime? Build bridges don't burn them.

The way I see it, the professional behaior is worth termination. But we shouldn't throw away the person. Yes, he has a chance to change. Hopefully he can reconnect with some of these players and demonstrate that change. That still doesn't mean he should keep the job, though.

@JonDMiller made this point a few years ago about Art Bryles; everyone should be forgiven and provided the chance to become a better human, but that does not mean you get your old job back.