Dev: I was best B1G guard, not Stauskas

[Knight78]

Why not? Teams in the 80's and 90's, especially the 80's, scored a lot more than they do today. It was much easier to just isolate one on one back then. The scouting was nowhere near what it was today. Plus with all the advances in training and more emphasis on weight lifting the guys nowadays are much bigger than they were back then. Jordan spent a lot of time being guarded by 6'4 190 lb guys, there weren't very many 6'7 210-225 lb wings back then like there are today.

Oh, come on! You do know that Jordan was the #3 player selected in the draft and that BOTH teams that drafted ahead of the Bulls already had a players that were Jordan's size. The Rockets selected Hakeem Olajuwon because they had Lewis Lloyd, Mitchell Wiggins, Craig Ehlo and Rodney McCrea - all of whom were Jordan's size or bigger. The Blazers selected Sam Bowie because they already had Clyde Drexler, Jim Paxson and Kiki Vandeweghe who were all Jordan's size or bigger. There were many guys who played the wing that were Jordan's size - they just didn't have the freedom to shoot pretty much every time down the floor like Jordan did with the Bulls.

 

[Knight78]

By what measure do they play a less physical game today? Players shot more free throw attempts per field goal attempts back then so the notion that they call more fouls today is wrong. There's no statistical evidence that it was harder to score back then, almost all of it actually points to it being harder to score today. It's mostly just former players who think their era was better.

The game began to get less physical due to a single play in Game 4 of the 1984 NBA Finals. Kurt Rambis was going in from the wing for a layup on a fast break and Kevin McHale clotheslined him - made no play for the ball, simply went for the head/neck area. Ever since then they have been (as a coach in the local school system here calls it) sissifying the game. The games in the Jordan era were less physical. The games today are even less physical.

 

[Knight78]

With age comes wisdom! Jordan hand checked and played very physical (it may have been overshadowed by the rest of his game). What's next for the NBA, fouls called for trash talking? Insert 80's player today and they foul out for playing their game, Insert current player in the 80's and watch them ***** that they cannot score because they think they are being constantly fouled.

Look at what they are doing in the NFL....

 

[ArvadaHawk]

I don't get this comment or why everyone is offended by his comments and feels the need to attack a guy who they just cheered on for the last 4 years. Most successful people in competitive environments are successful, in part, because they think are the best. Confidence is a prerequisite for success. Marble just said it out loud. And he made similar comments during the season.

Drew, my comment was sarcasm against this point you made: "So many people are afraid to express high expectations out loud because fear of failure." You are absolutely correct, confidence in highly competitive situations is a prerequisite for success. My sarcastic comment about this not being a football board is related to so many folks being happy with 7 or 8 wins a season. I should know that sarcasm doesn't always come through on the internet.

 

[jacknicholson]

Not sure what's "funny' about it...because it isn't really that close. No Kareem-like center, no Bird-type forward, etc., as a teammate. No fan rallies for a Lebron-type joining him.

Jordan was pretty much it. Pippen was good help, Rodman was a great rebounder but beyond that, Jordan had average supporting cast. And his best asset may just have been his defensive prowess.

I wonder how old the LeBron is better than Jordan addicts were when Jordan was playing at North Carolina, on one the the better college teams of all time, with James Worthy, Sam Perkins and Kenny Smith, on a par with Magic Johnson's MSU team that won the national championship playing with Greg Kelser, Jay Vincent and Mike Brkovich.

The only help Jordan had with the bulls was Scottie Pippin, he didn't have the likes of Wade and Bosh to play with. All he had was Scottie and perhaps the best coach since Red Auerbach, Phil Jackson....

LaBron is up there with the very best, but he is no Jordan....

 

[jacknicholson]

Oh, come on! You do know that Jordan was the #3 player selected in the draft and that BOTH teams that drafted ahead of the Bulls already had a players that were Jordan's size. The Rockets selected Hakeem Olajuwon because they had Lewis Lloyd, Mitchell Wiggins, Craig Ehlo and Rodney McCrea - all of whom were Jordan's size or bigger. The Blazers selected Sam Bowie because they already had Clyde Drexler, Jim Paxson and Kiki Vandeweghe who were all Jordan's size or bigger. There were many guys who played the wing that were Jordan's size - they just didn't have the freedom to shoot pretty much every time down the floor like Jordan did with the Bulls.

You can't seriously be comparing any of those players to Michael Jordan. If you are, you have lost all credibility.....

Get tksirius.....

 

[HawkeyeMike23]

I wonder how old the LeBron is better than Jordan addicts were when Jordan was playing at North Carolina, on one the the better college teams of all time, with James Worthy, Sam Perkins and Kenny Smith, on a par with Magic Johnson's MSU team that won the national championship playing with Greg Kelser, Jay Vincent and Mike Brkovich.The only help Jordan had with the bulls was Scottie Pippin, he didn't have the likes of Wade and Bosh to play with. All he had was Scottie and perhaps the best coach since Red Auerbach, Phil Jackson....LaBron is up there with the very best, but he is no Jordan....

The Jordan didn't have to leave to win a championship is without a doubt the dumbest argument in any comparison between LeBron and Jordan. The bulls built a quality team around him that won 55 games without him. The Cavs second best player was Mo ******* Williams. They won less than 20 games after LeBron left.

 

[jacknicholson]

The Jordan didn't have to leave to win a championship is without a doubt the dumbest argument in any comparison between LeBron and Jordan. The bulls built a quality team around him that won 55 games without him. The Cavs second best player was Mo ******* Williams. They won less than 20 games after LeBron left.

That's why they were known as the Cleveland Cadavers.....

 

[Knight78]

You can't seriously be comparing any of those players to Michael Jordan. If you are, you have lost all credibility.....

Get tksirius.....

At the time, yes. No one knew he would score so much. His ability was held in check during his college career. The pro game is a better fit for his skill set. Every one of the scouts knew this but none of them could have predicted the career he had - none of them. And yes, I'll say Drexler can be compared to him; he had a long career and averaged over 20 pts per game. If Bowie had remained health instead of basically exploding his tibia, the Blazers would have been the team to beat in the west. And Lewis Lloyd (Drake alum) was already a proven scorer in the NBA; his problem was cocaine cut his career short. And all of these guys were proven scorers from the wing at the time. All could handle the ball and run an offense, all could rebound, all could score when called upon.

It's easy to look back and say that the Rockets or the Blazers should have drafted Jordan. But in the NBA you draft for a need, and both teams had 2 guards and swing men. Neither had a strong inside game, so the drafted what they needed.

 

[jacknicholson]

At the time, yes. No one knew he would score so much. His ability was held in check during his college career. The pro game is a better fit for his skill set. Every one of the scouts knew this but none of them could have predicted the career he had - none of them. And yes, I'll say Drexler can be compared to him; he had a long career and averaged over 20 pts per game. If Bowie had remained health instead of basically exploding his tibia, the Blazers would have been the team to beat in the west. And Lewis Lloyd (Drake alum) was already a proven scorer in the NBA; his problem was cocaine cut his career short. And all of these guys were proven scorers from the wing at the time. All could handle the ball and run an offense, all could rebound, all could score when called upon.

It's easy to look back and say that the Rockets or the Blazers should have drafted Jordan. But in the NBA you draft for a need, and both teams had 2 guards and swing men. Neither had a strong inside game, so the drafted what they needed.

Jordan certainly exceeded all expectatiions as his career went on, Knight78....

 

[LASBUR]

Not much doubt MJ is the best ever so far. But interesting to me is that as good of athleat as he was I think it was his will to win that set him apart

 

[JHHawk]

The game began to get less physical due to a single play in Game 4 of the 1984 NBA Finals. Kurt Rambis was going in from the wing for a layup on a fast break and Kevin McHale clotheslined him - made no play for the ball, simply went for the head/neck area. Ever since then they have been (as a coach in the local school system here calls it) sissifying the game. The games in the Jordan era were less physical. The games today are even less physical.

Sorry, but the Bad Boy Pistons were running wild in the NBA in the late 80's, and they had the ''Jordan Rules'' enforcement policy of never letting Jordan go to the hole without getting hammered. In 1989, Lambeer took down Bird by the neck backwards to the floor, with Bird jumping up and punching Lambeer....it was not a wimpy league ...in fact, after the Bad Boys era the NBA started to try to reduce the physicality...in the late-90's...the Knicks and Riley were mugging it up until they finally went away in the late 90's.

 

[Hawkfnntn]

Sorry, but the Bad Boy Pistons were running wild in the NBA in the late 80's, and they had the ''Jordan Rules'' enforcement policy of never letting Jordan go to the hole without getting hammered. In 1989, Lambeer took down Bird by the neck backwards to the floor, with Bird jumping up and punching Lambeer....it was not a wimpy league ...in fact, after the Bad Boys era the NBA started to try to reduce the physicality...in the late-90's...the Knicks and Riley were mugging it up until they finally went away in the late 90's.

Besides the shot clock and 3 point line being put in the hand check rule and taking some of the physicality out of the game was the biggest change from the 80s to the present day NBA. I'm not sure todays players would know how to play against the Pistons and Knicks of those days...

 

[Knight78]

Jordan certainly exceeded all expectatiions as his career went on, Knight78....

Absolutely agree.

 

[Knight78]

Sorry, but the Bad Boy Pistons were running wild in the NBA in the late 80's, and they had the ''Jordan Rules'' enforcement policy of never letting Jordan go to the hole without getting hammered. In 1989, Lambeer took down Bird by the neck backwards to the floor, with Bird jumping up and punching Lambeer....it was not a wimpy league ...in fact, after the Bad Boys era the NBA started to try to reduce the physicality...in the late-90's...the Knicks and Riley were mugging it up until they finally went away in the late 90's.

The "Jordan Rules" are nothing more than an update of the '60s basketball where NO ONE got to the basket for a layup without getting pounded. Jeez, so many think that basketball was invented just after Jordan came into the NBA. Why do you think that guys like Dan Issel had no front teeth? Love pats?

The single play I pointed to led to the rules about flagrant fouls and intentional fouls being created and enforced. Check it out and tell me that anything even close to this happened to Jordan: www.youtube.com/watch?v=X7r6vXeOfyQ

 

[Knight78]

Besides the shot clock and 3 point line being put in the hand check rule and taking some of the physicality out of the game was the biggest change from the 80s to the present day NBA. I'm not sure todays players would know how to play against the Pistons and Knicks of those days...

Shot clock? The shot clock has been in the NBA since 1954. Hell, the NCAA women have had a 30 second shot clock since at least the '70s when my wife played college basketball.

When I played in the '70s we were taught how to effectively use hand checking to guide a dribbler to where we wanted him to go. Then we'd slap a trap on him and look for a steal.

The three point line came into effect because of the ABA. Not certain exactly how awarding more points for farther shots reduces physicality because more of those shots are missed and most of the physical play occurs under the basket when jockeying for position to rebound the miss.

 

[whammer33024]

how do you argue with the players that played in the league at the time and said jordan is the by far the best player?

 

[HawkeyeMike23]

Besides the shot clock and 3 point line being put in the hand check rule and taking some of the physicality out of the game was the biggest change from the 80s to the present day NBA. I'm not sure todays players would know how to play against the Pistons and Knicks of those days...

They would probably love being able to isolate their guy and not have to worry about a big guy hanging out near the rim, the elimination of illegal defense has allowed teams to develop much more complex defensive schemes than teams saw in the 80's or 90's. Plus with all the advances in scouting, defenses today are much more prepared than they ever have been before.

 

[LASBUR]

Wow that was great. Loved those Laker Celtic series

The "Jordan Rules" are nothing more than an update of the '60s basketball where NO ONE got to the basket for a layup without getting pounded. Jeez, so many think that basketball was invented just after Jordan came into the NBA. Why do you think that guys like Dan Issel had no front teeth? Love pats?

The single play I pointed to led to the rules about flagrant fouls and intentional fouls being created and enforced. Check it out and tell me that anything even close to this happened to Jordan: www.youtube.com/watch?v=X7r6vXeOfyQ

 

[WindsorHawk]

Jordan was and still is the best to ever play the game IMO. Dev and Stauskas both need the right team and the right system to be successful in the NBA IMO.