WVU QB Will Grier Skipping Bowl Game

Idk why a “development” program like Iowa doesn’t/hasn’t utilized the valuable game experience for the younger players.

I mean at least half a game to the players whom have risen up the depth chart/worked just as hard as the starters all year and should be rewarded this game(which means jack shit, let’s be real) you can see what players you think your counting on next year and beyond can do in an actual game time experience.

PERFECT game to play the backup QB whom get next to no run in a “real” game time action as they usually only in when game out of hand. Beyond me why this isn’t/hasn’t been done always.
 
Here's the only place I could find a mock draft deep enough for him. Had him in the late 3rd:

"In 2018, Grier has completed 67 percent of his passes for 3,864 yards with 37 touchdowns and eight interceptions. Multiple team sources who have seen Grier (6-2, 221) in person say he has just average arm strength and when he can't set his feet, he has a hard time driving the ball.

For 2017, Grier completed 64 percent of his passes for 3,490 yards with 34 touchdowns and 12 interceptions. In 2015 while playing for Florida, Grier completed 66 percent of his passes for 1,204 yards with 10 touchdowns and three interceptions. He was impressive for the Gators before testing positive for steroids. That led to him transferring to West Virginia. Sources say that Grier and his family can be high-maintenance personalities who some teams are going to shy away from."
 
I think starting in the next two years you will begin to see players bowing out of regular season games as well.
And then a couple seasons after that a school or two will point out that these students are getting a full ride scholarship to play football. Breach of contract-esque
 
Isn’t that kinda what Bosa did?
Yes it already happened this year with Bosa and that is one we know of for sure. Look at the grief Gary at Michigan got for missing games. There were people saying he was just sitting out to get ready for the NFL but unlike Bosa he stayed with the team. If I remember from Bosa's injury it was not supposed to sideline him all year but he weighed the risks of coming back and decided against it. This whole thing is getting really bizarre.

The thing that sickens me is the quality of all the sports is going downhill because you have over saturation in the NBA and NFL which makes the product less than it was 10 years ago and then you have kids leaving for the pros when they are not ready, which hurts the overall quality of college sports. NFL example is you have maybe 15 good quarterbacks in the NFL which makes these kids want to leave early because the so called need is there and then they get drafted and forced into action before they are ready and they never live up to their full potential and the cycle continues. Football isn't as bad but the overall product of college basketball is garbage compared to what it was 10-15 years ago. Too many kids leaving early that never see the floor of a pro game.

The time has come to pay the college athlete or at least let them promote their own brand and be entrepreneurs.
 
We don't see college basketball players bailing on the NCAA tournament for the draft. The NCAA better expand the playoffs to protect it's product and give these guys something to play for besides a shitty bloomin' onion.
 
We don't see college basketball players bailing on the NCAA tournament for the draft. The NCAA better expand the playoffs to protect it's product and give these guys something to play for besides a shitty bloomin' onion.
Huge difference in the physicality of CFB and CBB. The NCAA profits tremendously off student athletes. Why risk anything when the bowl games don’t mean shit if not in the CF Playoff?

This is a violent sport and most players make money/roster by performance at combine or schools Pro day. Why not take that extra time to get healthy from a long season of beating the body down and rest/preform at optimum level for the biggest interview of their lives?

How many of you quit on your jobs and take a week off to regroup before taking new job? Let it go and embrace support these athletes who’s product has made the NCAA and coaches/AD shit tons of money.

I mean coaches change jobs and leave before bowls for a while now. The players that were recruited by said coach/system are the only ones who get “penalized” and have to sit a year when this happens.

This is a very wise move and if a parent of someone who can go Pro id damn sure advise them to do the same and give self the chance to perform/make the absolute most money from the jump as NFL is not for long so get as much as you can as soon as you can.

Embrace this and encourage these kids to get fucking paid they have laid their bodies and long term health on the line for your viewing entertainment and risked lifelong injuries and potential CTE. I couldn’t be anymore behind anyone whom chooses to do this today/tomorrow/forever.
 
This country is going to hell in a hand basket. A QB skipping a bowl game.

At what point does this become an issue for the bowls themselves?

Through various channels the Dudley Do-Right Meaningless Bowl signs agreements with Mediocre Team A and Underperforming Team B to appear in their late December game. For marketing purposes, Mediocre Team A has a decent run/pass QB who has some name recognition. Underperforming Team B led the league in pass defense.

Weeks before the game, Team A’s QB announces he’s skipping it to prepare for the NFL draft. Days later a heralded CB and equally talented safety from Team B also announce they’re skipping the bowl.

For the bowl organizers, the products they contracted and were ready to market are suddenly diminished. It is not the same competition they bought. What recourse do they have? Will bowls seek language more or less guaranteeing the rosters? Should they?
 
@RobHowe is messing with you guys, he has been pretty clear about where he comes down on the players' right to choose whether or not they participate in bowls.

I am pretty conflicted on the whole thing: while I recognize a player's right to choose what is best for them, I don't think it is the best "teammate move", and I think it is faulty reasoning to think that a 1st round lock has more to risk than a mid-round prospect. In fact, I would argue someone like Grier from WVU is the type who might not ever get a chance if he got injured, so he is the type with the most to lose. A projected top-10 pick (think the Jaylon Smith from a few years back) lost up to $30 million due to his injury, but he had a $9 million insurance fallback, and even with the injury, was selected at the start of the 2nd round and will earn tens of millions in his career. Jake Butt was projected as a 2nd round pick; even with his injury, he was taken in the 5th (and had a $2 million insurance fall back). Such a guarantee is not in place for someone like Grier (or Render, or Reynolds, or Drew Ott, or Jake Duzey, etc.).

What the discussions on here the past week or so have helped me to realize is that the Bowls are part of a really messed up system. Because of their history, many (players, fans) are convinced they have some special meaning, a meaning that has long since been diluted and lost. Also, because of players' intrinsic desire to compete and to want to be there for their teammates who are also competing, the default choice is going to be for players to participate in bowls (very few players have sat out bowls compared to those that have competed, although there is an obvious trend in the opposite direction). So everyone goes out to play, putting much on the line, and ultimately they aren't even given the possibility of a championship to compete for. Players are basically assuming this risk solely for the reason of making a lot of money for everyone but themselves (I highly recommend reading this opinion piece on Bowls from last December: College Football Bowl Games are a Grotesque Money Grab).

As @deanvogs and others pointed out, this could potentially bleed into the regular season games as well. As a team is mathematically eliminated from championship contention, do players start weighing risk vs. benefit? Realistically, 80% of teams are probably eliminated before the very first snap of the season, so why even start? So then we have to start examining the intrinsic value offered from sports and competition, that is, what value does it offer to the participant and fan that goes beyond the ability to determine which team is best? As someone who has long championed the lessons and memories derived from sports competition, I don't think these aspects should be undersold.

I don't know what the answer to all of these dilemmas is. But I am starting to feel strongly that a game with contrived meaning that takes place after a month layoff is pretty immoral. If the game is scheduled, I am pretty certain I would still plays due to a sense of obligation to my teammates and school, but there would be a sense of injustice that the game was scheduled in the first place.
 
@RobHowe is messing with you guys, he has been pretty clear about where he comes down on the players' right to choose whether or not they participate in bowls.

I am pretty conflicted on the whole thing: while I recognize a player's right to choose what is best for them, I don't think it is the best "teammate move", and I think it is faulty reasoning to think that a 1st round lock has more to risk than a mid-round prospect. In fact, I would argue someone like Grier from WVU is the type who might not ever get a chance if he got injured, so he is the type with the most to lose. A projected top-10 pick (think the Jaylon Smith from a few years back) lost up to $30 million due to his injury, but he had a $9 million insurance fallback, and even with the injury, was selected at the start of the 2nd round and will earn tens of millions in his career. Jake Butt was projected as a 2nd round pick; even with his injury, he was taken in the 5th (and had a $2 million insurance fall back). Such a guarantee is not in place for someone like Grier (or Render, or Reynolds, or Drew Ott, or Jake Duzey, etc.).

What the discussions on here the past week or so have helped me to realize is that the Bowls are part of a really messed up system. Because of their history, many (players, fans) are convinced they have some special meaning, a meaning that has long since been diluted and lost. Also, because of players' intrinsic desire to compete and to want to be there for their teammates who are also competing, the default choice is going to be for players to participate in bowls (very few players have sat out bowls compared to those that have competed, although there is an obvious trend in the opposite direction). So everyone goes out to play, putting much on the line, and ultimately they aren't even given the possibility of a championship to compete for. Players are basically assuming this risk solely for the reason of making a lot of money for everyone but themselves (I highly recommend reading this opinion piece on Bowls from last December: College Football Bowl Games are a Grotesque Money Grab).

As @deanvogs and others pointed out, this could potentially bleed into the regular season games as well. As a team is mathematically eliminated from championship contention, do players start weighing risk vs. benefit? Realistically, 80% of teams are probably eliminated before the very first snap of the season, so why even start? So then we have to start examining the intrinsic value offered from sports and competition, that is, what value does it offer to the participant and fan that goes beyond the ability to determine which team is best? As someone who has long championed the lessons and memories derived from sports competition, I don't think these aspects should be undersold.

I don't know what the answer to all of these dilemmas is. But I am starting to feel strongly that a game with contrived meaning that takes place after a month layoff is pretty immoral. If the game is scheduled, I am pretty certain I would still plays due to a sense of obligation to my teammates and school, but there would be a sense of injustice that the game was scheduled in the first place.


Yeah, I get Rob's sarcasm now, like 9 years later. It sorta clicked with the 'leather helmets and smelling salts' comment and after reading through this thread a few times I get it now.
 
Oh to be back to be back in the day when players and coaches were more about team and thought less about chasing the almighty $.... It's just a new era. Bowl games used to matter and coaches records and how they were looked at were often measured just by that. Now their meaningless exhibitions (except the playoffs which this system we have now has some to do with this as well)
What incentive do WVA fans have to be invested in that game at all now? Do they have a QB in he wings behind him or are they in a similar situation we would be in if Stanley didn't play for any reason? We just don't know for sure what we have really. So It's just a different time. We don't have to like it but there's literally only a couple things we can do about it and that's not spend our $ and time on it....
 
If you think bowls are "meaningless exhibitions" and you don't care whether teams play their best players and present the best game possible, then by all means support these players quitting their teams before the bowl to prep for the NFL.

But don't come crying to me when bowl season becomes a competitive joke, the way that the Pro Bowl has become a competitive joke. Think there are too many bowls? Too many games to watch? Wait 20 years. You'll have your 8 team playoff and no bowls at all, and Iowa's last game will almost always be against Nebraska on Thanksgiving weekend--and maybe not everyone will even suit up for that one, either.

Maybe you have to be a little older to recognize a slippery slope like this one (having seen other slippery slopes before*), but to you youngsters out there: this is a slippery slope.

*college BB players leaving after a single season, the expansion of bowl season, decline of Pro Bowl participation/quality, unrestricted free agency in MLB, NCAA FB coaching salaries, NCAA FB ticket prices, etc
 
If you think bowls are "meaningless exhibitions" and you don't care whether teams play their best players and present the best game possible, then by all means support these players quitting their teams before the bowl to prep for the NFL.

But don't come crying to me when bowl season becomes a competitive joke, the way that the Pro Bowl has become a competitive joke. Think there are too many bowls? Too many games to watch? Wait 20 years. You'll have your 8 team playoff and no bowls at all, and Iowa's last game will almost always be against Nebraska on Thanksgiving weekend--and maybe not everyone will even suit up for that one, either.

Maybe you have to be a little older to recognize a slippery slope like this one (having seen other slippery slopes before*), but to you youngsters out there: this is a slippery slope.

*college BB players leaving after a single season, the expansion of bowl season, decline of Pro Bowl participation/quality, unrestricted free agency in MLB, NCAA FB coaching salaries, NCAA FB ticket prices, etc
How would it become a “competitive joke”? So the backups/younger players would be out there “just having fun” as they aren’t competing/showing on tape what they can do in live game situations for starting spots the following year? Little lost on this stance
 
Football is a dangerous, physical sport that could possibly disable you permanently on the first snap you play. It could also take a toll long term and disable you later on down the road. If you are worried about the health and safety of the players, don't let them play football, period. If someone chooses to play football, they accept the risk involved with playing football. So let's put that whole player safety argument against expanded playoffs to bed.

So with the increasing number of players not taking the risk of injury playing in their bowl game, the bowl game talent pool is getting watered down. Fans may think twice about traveling and buying tickets to something that amounts to a spring game with backup players taking center stage. If you were a West Virginia fan, how excited would you be right now coughing up money to travel to the bowl game and watch your backup QB play?

Of the four current CFP teams, how many players on those teams are skipping out of the CFP to get ready for the draft? Probably none of them, since they have a NC to play for and that is worth the risk of injury. You can bet your ass that QB from West Virginia would be all gung ho about playing two more games if he was in the CFP. Instead, he decided that playing in the Camping World pitch-a-tent bowl wasn't worth the free sleeping bag and portable propane stove he was going to receive for participating. So it would appear that the remedy to this is to sprinkle some CFP on these guys, and then that whole "save myself for the draft" thing goes right out the window. Hell, even the one and done basketball players wait to leave AFTER their tournament run is over.

Playoff expansion makes the most sense to counter this, and it will resolve other issues with the current system as well. The lower football divisions are already doing this and it works. You know it works because the only time you see Mount Union or Montana on ESPN is when they are showing playoff games.
 
How would it become a “competitive joke”? So the backups/younger players would be out there “just having fun” as they aren’t competing/showing on tape what they can do in live game situations for starting spots the following year? Little lost on this stance
If you have a QB good enough to go to NFL 1st round, and he doesn't play, nor does your 1st round WR, don't you think that affects the competitive balance of the game? Why would fans of that team want to go to a bowl where the team they are rooting for is different--and much worse--than the one they saw all season? The 2nd teamers can play as hard as they want, but that team isn't the same.

But my biggest concern is that this will start to leak into late-season games, which would really alter the sport as we know it. All I know is that I like bowl games, and I want to see players not quit their team before the bowl game is played, or the ruination of non-playoff bowls is not too far away, and that would be a shame.
 

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