Workouts this week; tryouts?

[FreddyBrown]

I'm curious where everyone is able to evaluate whether Archie has improved or not? If this from people evaluating shoot arounds and such, it doesn't lend to much credibility.

My comment that I hadn't seen the improvement in Archie that Lickliter had referred to in previous public remarks was intended to convey that I haven't had the opportunity to see him play in any meaningful context since he signed with us. I can't say, and I'm not claiming to know one way or another, whether he's improved or not. I can say that based on his juco statistics and the videos I saw of him when he signed with us, it's not out of the realm of possibility that another coach might not have wanted to extend the offer to him in the first place.

If you read farther up in the string, I've also pointed out that one thing Archie may be able to do that no one else on the current roster (with the possible exception of Brommer) has shown an aptitude for is shot blocking, which is a valuable abilitiy to have in a guy playing at the back of a press. Caff reportedly likes to press some.

 

[Husky28]

My comment that I hadn't seen the improvement in Archie that Lickliter had referred to in previous public remarks was intended to convey that I haven't had the opportunity to see him play in any meaningful context since he signed with us. I can't say, and I'm not claiming to know one way or another, whether he's improved or not. I can say that based on his juco statistics and the videos I saw of him when he signed with us, it's not out of the realm of possibility that another coach might not have wanted to extend the offer to him in the first place.

If you read farther up in the string, I've also pointed out that one thing Archie may be able to do that no one else on the current roster (with the possible exception of Brommer) has shown an aptitude for is shot blocking, which is a valuable abilitiy to have in a guy playing at the back of a press. Caff reportedly likes to press some.

I wasn't necessarily referencing your comment alone (probably should have mentioned that accordingly ). My comments were based on the whole thread where several have made references to Archie's abilities and wasn't really sure where these observations were being made...

 

[IAJay]

Isn't it strange how 2 people can see the same thing and come to opposite conclusions. For a fr. of his size, he is very polished in many aspects of the game. His upside is almost unlimited. Losing Coug would be a huge loss, no pun intended.

His upside is unlimited? Really? I would say his upside is very limited by his body.

 

[mwa20000]

to anyone who thinks Cougill can't fit in to an uptempo system doesn't quite understand basketball, how many teams do you know that actually want there 5 man running the break with the PG, none, the primary break is the PG, SG, SF with the PF trailing if you don't score within a few seconds or a couple passes then you have the secondary break which is the C trailing everybody to the top of the key for a shot or ball reversal both of which suit Cougs, defensively he will also be fine, Licks defense was to switch almost everything so many times Cougs was just trying to stick with his man when the other defender had switched, yeah i know he should have known that but i think it was a lack of team communication rather than his fault

 

[tweeterhawk]

I believe the article was Jon's opinion and did not quote Coach. I see no reason why we should think he's changed his mind about anything.

I do agree, however, that if Coach looked at a particular player and felt there was no way the player could contribute, he would tell the kid what to expect and let the kid make his own decision. With the possible exception of Archie (and I say that only because I haven't seen the improvement Lickliter claimed he was making), I don't think that is a likely outcome for any of our current players.

Signed,

The Guys In The Barber Shop Of Hickory, Indiana

Yeah, this:

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J-lt6jDaVnc&feature=related"]YouTube - My team is on the floor[/ame]

 

[Hawk94]

to anyone who thinks Cougill can't fit in to an uptempo system doesn't quite understand basketball, how many teams do you know that actually want there 5 man running the break with the PG, none, the primary break is the PG, SG, SF with the PF trailing if you don't score within a few seconds or a couple passes then you have the secondary break which is the C trailing everybody to the top of the key for a shot or ball reversal both of which suit Cougs, defensively he will also be fine, Licks defense was to switch almost everything so many times Cougs was just trying to stick with his man when the other defender had switched, yeah i know he should have known that but i think it was a lack of team communication rather than his fault

My thoughts exactly. The 5 man leading a break or running a lot is not a necessity. The ability for a big man to trail and hit the secondary break 15-18 foot shoot is a welcome part to any team. There are many freshman post players that struggle on defense and turned out fine. From his AAU coach and other AAU reports he held his own posting up against top tier talent. I would vote to have him stay right where he is on the team and see what another system and a year will look like. He is never going to lose another 30 lbs but with continued work his is going to be a difficult match up for opposing defenses. He has the potential to be a load down low and be able to pull away a shot blocking defender from the basket.

 

[papathawki]

I don't have the link, but 2-3 weeks ago the sports editor of the Sioux City Journal was very critical of the way Lick used Cougill. This is a guy who knows basketball and has seen Cougill play countless times. He felt Coug had many talents not seen the way he was used this year which ties in with the comments from Stormenspank.

 

[Hawk94]

Stormin - I don't understand why you think Cougill COULD make the cut. Granted he was only a freshman, but I saw an extremely slow player who was constantly lost on defense. I saw a play who could not get rebounds unless they fell into his lap.

Just curious on your rebounding claim. I did some quick math and your opinion does not follow the facts.

Player/ Minutes /Rebounds - rebounds/min

Fuller 731 185 - .25
Cole 796 165 - .21
Cougill 460 92 - .20
May 991 147 - .15
Brommer 185 28 - .15
Gatens 1173 138 - .12

He may not have been a dominate rebounder but he had quite a few offensive rebounds and was 3rd on team for rebounds/minutes played. The 2 ahead of him are a sophmore and a Junior. Their averages were likely much worse earlier in their career. If he leaves it won't kill the program but if he stays it is not a bad thing in any way.

 

[johnashawk]

People who don't think Cougill has a what it takes simply don't know how to evaluate a big man. They wouldn't have liked Les Jepsen, Acie Earl or Brad Lohaus as freshmen either. He has terrific hands, a good build, a high basketball IQ and great ball handling for his size. The only reason he didn't score more inside last year or rebound more is because he was grossly misused exclusively on the perimeter. Hard to rebound or score inside when you are stationed 18 feet away from the basket on offense and defense.

Agree....And I'll go so far to include Russ Millard, Chris Street,or Ryan Bowen. One more time......Big men develop slower.....Coug will be one of the better big men to ever play at Iowa, imo.

 

[drew003]

Agree....And I'll go so far to include Russ Millard, Chris Street,or Ryan Bowen. One more time......Big men develop slower.....Coug will be one of the better big men to ever play at Iowa, imo.

All this talk about Cougs, in my opinion he is fine. He might become an alright Big 10 player, a contributor, ect... But I'm doubtful he ever blossoms into an above-average Big 10 post. He just has certain physical limitations that will limit his impact on a game. To borrow a fantasy baseball term, I see Cougs as no better than a replacement player. Almost any Big 10 post will be able to be as effective as Cougs. For example Seth Gorney developed into an okay player, but he wasn't a Big 10 plus-player and he didn't help us win games, he just took up minutes. I think we could recruit a Freshman right now that that would be as useful as Cougs. I just don't think it is a big deal if he leaves.

We need to start getting some above-average Big 10 players in here, and with limited scholarships available that might mean somebody leaves. It is not good to have 3 scholarships tied up with 3 developmental bigs Cougs, Archie, and Brommer who likely can only play one position.

 

[jparmley3]

Agree....And I'll go so far to include Russ Millard, Chris Street,or Ryan Bowen. One more time......Big men develop slower.....Coug will be one of the better big men to ever play at Iowa, imo.

I will bet you $10 trillion to $1 that is one of the more ridiculous predictions in the history of HN.com.

While I hope Cougs proves me wrong, I do not see him being anything more than a 10-15 minute a game 'role' player.

 

[JonDMiller]

To ever play at Iowa? I hope the kid has a great career and he does have some offensive game. But I would wager against him having a better season in his career than Les Jepsen had as a senior. If he could average what Michael Payne averaged over the last three years of his career I would be very pleased with that...get to 8 or 9 a game, 6 boards...that can be a winning contribution. But to say one of the best ever, probly a reach.

 

[HeneryHawk]

Jon, can you add that best ever comment to his sig, so we can monitor it for the next few years? ;o)

 

[johnashawk]

I will bet you $10 trillion to $1 that is one of the more ridiculous predictions in the history of HN.com.

While I hope Cougs proves me wrong, I do not see him being anything more than a 10-15 minute a game 'role' player.

I'll take that bet. If you're going to rely on comparisons of Cougs to Gorney, How about comparing him to Bryant Reeves or maybe Zach Randolph, or Big Baby. The more you people talk, the more evidence you provide of how little you know.

 

[HeneryHawk]

Cougill has some nice skills, he doesnt have a classic basketball body, especially for an up and down tempo. As I have said for months, he seriously needs to get in better condition and needs major strength training too. While Lickliter may not have utilized him the best, there were many times he was under tha basket and his lack of strength, of having a solid base, really challenged him for positioning on D and for rebounding and post up. As for his floor speed, it wasnt impressive, but back issues can really make that worse, as it can negatively effect his strength too. So, it will be interesting to see if he works like a madman to get better, or stays limited.

 

[rockbreaker]

Zach Randolph was one of the most dominant big men in the country as a freshman and then left for the NBA? I can't remember how Big Country was as a freshman. I think Cougs could be good too, but those are awfully big expectations for someone who isn't overly gifted athletically.

 

[jparmley3]

I'll take that bet. If you're going to rely on comparisons of Cougs to Gorney, How about comparing him to Bryant Reeves or maybe Zach Randolph, or Big Baby. The more you people talk, the more evidence you provide of how little you know.

Sorry, you are high on Hawkeye heroin if you believe he will be the best (or even one of the best) big men in the HISTORY of Iowa basketball.

Where can I score some of that stuff?

 

[iowatank55]

I can't believe the people on here that think Coug's doesn't belong and wouldn't mind seeing him go elsewhere. That is absurd. So he might not be in the best conditioned athelete on the Iowa roster. He can work on that. The kid has a ton of talent and possess a soft touch for a big guy. Remember the Indiana game on the road this year? Coug's should flashes of being a great player in a two minute span I had not seen from another Hawkeye freshman in along time for a big guy anyways. He knocked down two big threes, grabbed two big boards and took a charge on consecitive plays.

Coug's was underutilized and It would be a huge mistake to simply let him go. I think coach Fran can turn Coug's into a better player and better utiltize his size and talents.

And remember Iowa always isn't going to be playing uptempo ball, whatever the team there playing will dictate the style of play. Cougs can be a solid player off the bench or someday in the starting five, who knows.

There I said my piece....

 

[Hooper]

I can't believe the people on here that think Coug's doesn't belong and wouldn't mind seeing him go elsewhere. That is absurd. So he might not be in the best conditioned athelete on the Iowa roster. He can work on that. The kid has a ton of talent and possess a soft touch for a big guy. Remember the Indiana game on the road this year? Coug's should flashes of being a great player in a two minute span I had not seen from another Hawkeye freshman in along time for a big guy anyways. He knocked down two big threes, grabbed two big boards and took a charge on consecitive plays.

Coug's was underutilized and It would be a huge mistake to simply let him go. I think coach Fran can turn Coug's into a better player and better utiltize his size and talents.

And remember Iowa always isn't going to be playing uptempo ball, whatever the team there playing will dictate the style of play. Cougs can be a solid player off the bench or someday in the starting five, who knows.

There I said my piece....

I think the jury is still out. We don't really know enough to judge Cougs yet. I think he is better than he showed last year but time will tell. If he gets strong he will be tough.

 

[FreddyBrown]

To ever play at Iowa? I hope the kid has a great career and he does have some offensive game. But I would wager against him having a better season in his career than Les Jepsen had as a senior. If he could average what Michael Payne averaged over the last three years of his career I would be very pleased with that...get to 8 or 9 a game, 6 boards...that can be a winning contribution. But to say one of the best ever, probly a reach.

OK, and you're probably right. But think about what Jepsen looked like as a freshman, and what most people would have predicted for him later in his career: Nothing, or next to nothing.

Brennan Cougill has far better offensive basketball skills as a freshman than Jepsen had at the same stage. He could end up having as good a career or better than Jepsen. Not saying he will, but it's not an absurd prediction.