Tony Stewart hits, kills on-foot driver

Dirt tracks are usually not lit very well and you ate also looking through tear offs that distorts vision a little depending on what you use. It's really not a good idea to get out of your car wearing a black fire suit and helmet just to try and flip someone off. I've seen some ridiculous things at the races and I hope this never happens again. Thoughts and prayers for his family. Bad bad deal for all involved.
 
JonDMiller said:
You been to many dirt track races?
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Also, you are kind of proving my point for me.

If squeals are not a normal sound for a dirt track race, it is all the more likely that the sound on the video is coming from the accident location, which makes it all the more likely that the engine throttle sound is coming from Stewart's car.
 
read this in another article - i believe this may be the case when things all shake out:

I will offer a possible reason Tony would have turned up the track and gassed the throttle.
He saw Ward closing on his car too late.
Ward ran right at the right side of Tony’s swiftly closing car.
Tony never would expect that any driver would run right at the side of his moving race car and disregard the huge rear tires that would run that guy down just to get at Tony.
Tony clearly sees his rear tires will not miss Ward and he knows he cannot slam on the brakes or his car will run him down.
So Tony tries a last chance manuever by trying to twist the cars rear tires around Ward who is so damn mad that Ward does’nt even realize that he’s run himself right in the path of Tony’s rear tires.
Ward just wants to bash his fist in the face opening of Tony’s helmet.
Tony twists the wheel hard right and gasses the throttle trying to get the rear of his car to slide down to the inside of the track and miss Ward but anyone who knows these dirt tracks,also knows Tony’s move while a last chance try to try and save the young man from getting run over was likely bound to fail because these dirt tracks surface when it gets properly broke in from a race gets sticky as hell and the tires do not want to spin especially when the cars are in a lower gear like Tony’s was.
It is also important to note that the time from the first car missing Ward and Ward running towards Tony and Tony’s car hitting Ward was but a few seconds
 
I saw, on another site, a comment by someone claiming to be a former race driver. I'm paraphrasing here but he said that those cars don't have power steering and Tony hit the throttle to have an easier and more responsive left turn of the wheel to avoid the driver on the track.

If you've ever driven a car without power steering (I have) they are definitely easier to turn and more responsive while moving and/or accelerating. With that in mind then the scenario above is very plausible.
 
it was DARK on a DIMLY lit track and a guy in a BLACK suit is on a track where you would never expect a guy to be.

Heck the lead driver just in front of Tony almost hit him and I'm guessing Tony's view was at least partially impaired by that driver. Tony has a helmet w/visor on with likely glare from what little lighting is there. Not ideal conditions.

Also, those sprint cars basically drive sideways and they use the throttle to help them turn. They do not have power steering.
 
Slow motion of the accident and you can see everything much much better.

Tony hits the throttle and turns left so his back end goes right, as you can see in the video. Once his right rear tire hits Kevin, his back end then goes left until Tony corrects so he wont hit the wall so his back end goes right again and throws Kevin out from under him.

The video does show Tony trying to avoid him.

[video=youtube;1XvhrPu64Co]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1XvhrPu64Co[/video]
 
It's impossible to say he was accelerating. With all those cars circling the track, it's impossible to say the sound of the engine revving is coming from Stewart's car. It could come from any of the cars on the track.

Secondly, the assumption that the only way a car's rear end can come loose (i.e. "fishtail") is due to acceleration is a faulty one. There is something called trailing throttle oversteer - as a driver rapidly lets off the gas/provides braking pressure, all of the weight of the car lurches to the front tires making them grip harder relative to the rears. Throw in some rapid steering input and possible wheel lock up and you have a sure fire recipe for oversteer.

I still think Stewart came around that corner in a poor visibility situation (it was nighttime, the guy was in black, and anyone who has ever sat in a sprint car can tell you they aren't designed for good visibility) and had a "HOLY CRAP THE NUTJOB IS OUT ON THE TRACK!!!" moment with a few tenths of a second to try to avoid contact.

Still, no matter what Stewart did/didn't do, this guy should have never ever been out of the car. From go-karts right up through F1, everyone knows that - unless there is a fire - you sit buckled until the safety crew gets to you and tells you it's ok.
 
Sparky said:
Slow motion of the accident and you can see everything much much better.

Tony hits the throttle and turns left so his back end goes right, as you can see in the video. Once his right rear tire hits Kevin, his back end then goes left until Tony corrects so he wont hit the wall so his back end goes right again and throws Kevin out from under him.

The video does show Tony trying to avoid him.

[video=youtube;1XvhrPu64Co]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1XvhrPu64Co[/video]
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Thanks for posting the slo-mo.

I think the most useful thing the slo-mo does is that it allows you to see just how far down toward the bottom of the track that the deceased went. It is more than I had thought based upon the full speed video. I had previously compared Stewart's line to that of other racers on the caution lap and did not think that Stewart was significantly farther up the track than a number of the cars that you see passing before him, but the slo-mo definitely allows you to see how far out on the track the deceased ventured.

However, after watching it a number of times, I don't understand why you think that it shows Stewart trying to avoid the accident. I'm not seeing that. What are you seeing that I am missing?
 
528646 said:
It's impossible to say he was accelerating. With all those cars circling the track, it's impossible to say the sound of the engine revving is coming from Stewart's car. It could come from any of the cars on the track.

Secondly, the assumption that the only way a car's rear end can come loose (i.e. "fishtail") is due to acceleration is a faulty one. There is something called trailing throttle oversteer - as a driver rapidly lets off the gas/provides braking pressure, all of the weight of the car lurches to the front tires making them grip harder relative to the rears. Throw in some rapid steering input and possible wheel lock up and you have a sure fire recipe for oversteer.

I still think Stewart came around that corner in a poor visibility situation (it was nighttime, the guy was in black, and anyone who has ever sat in a sprint car can tell you they aren't designed for good visibility) and had a "HOLY CRAP THE NUTJOB IS OUT ON THE TRACK!!!" moment with a few tenths of a second to try to avoid contact.

Still, no matter what Stewart did/didn't do, this guy should have never ever been out of the car. From go-karts right up through F1, everyone knows that - unless there is a fire - you sit buckled until the safety crew gets to you and tells you it's ok.
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After viewing the video more times, I really do think that it is Stewart's engine throttling for the reasons I mentioned in my previous post. It cannot be determined conclusively either way based on the video, but I'd say I am well over 50% confident.

The issue isn't whether or not the deceased should have been out on the track--everybody agrees that he should not. The issue is whether Stewart failed to avoid the accident if/when he could have.

If Stewart could have avoided the accident, but chose not to, it doesn't matter how mistaken the deceased was to be on the track--Stewart would be at fault. On the flip side, if Stewart could not have avoided the accident or tried to avoid the accident, but failed, he would have no culpability whatsoever, since he did not create the dangerous situation.

Whether Stewart intentionally failed to mitigate the dangerousness of the situation is the issue that law enforcement is investigating. If all they have is this video to go by, law enforcement would be in error for bringing any charges, in my opinion.
 
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LG210 said:
Thanks for posting the slo-mo.

I think the most useful thing the slo-mo does is that it allows you to see just how far down toward the bottom of the track that the deceased went. It is more than I had thought based upon the full speed video. I had previously compared Stewart's line to that of other racers on the caution lap and did not think that Stewart was significantly farther up the track than a number of the cars that you see passing before him, but the slo-mo definitely allows you to see how far out on the track the deceased ventured.

However, after watching it a number of times, I don't understand why you think that it shows Stewart trying to avoid the accident. I'm not seeing that. What are you seeing that I am missing?
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Watch from :07 - :09 and watch the back end of his car go towards Kevin. It's because he's turning his steering wheel to the left trying to avoid him. At least that's what it looks like to me. It's so hard to tell though.
 
These cars are - by design - incredibly loose. Much more like sliding around on ice than making a late night run to the Hy Vee for Hagen Daz (check out the video below - a lot of the oversteer is definitely throttle-induced, but there are other factors in play, including a strong weight bias towards the rear). The tracks are also remarkably claustrophobic - I still maintain the time window between when Stewart would have gotten a visual on this guy & impact was incredibly narrow (even under yellow flag conditions).

It's also important to keep in mind this is not a car/pedestrian incident - I know it has been said multiple times by myself and other in this thread, but for those of you not experienced with racing, you really need to know how egregious a safety violation it is for a driver to be not just out of his car, but walking into traffic that way.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z3bzyeExDMk

Only Stewart can really know what was going through his mind as he rounded that corner - it's impossible to say that he for sure didn't have an aggressive intent as he headed down that back straight, but by the same token it's also entirely believable Stewart was simply caught unawares by a driver behaving in a very irresponsible, unpredictable fashion. No one should die on an average night at the track, but when you are out of your car walking into traffic, you gotta know you just increased your chances of injury/death by probably a couple orders of magnitude (I'm trying to word it in such a way that it doesn't sound like I'm saying "he deserved to die"...I'm just trying to say he - as someone who chose to strap himself into that car that night - knew the potential consequences of such behavior).
 
528646 said:
Only Stewart can really know what was going through his mind as he rounded that corner - it's impossible to say that he for sure didn't have an aggressive intent as he headed down that back straight, but by the same token it's also entirely believable Stewart was simply caught unawares by a driver behaving in a very irresponsible, unpredictable fashion.
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This pretty much sums it up perfectly. Unless there is further evidence of which we are not aware, nobody knows for sure aside from Stewart.

Are the drivers radioed in these types of races? On-board camera?
 
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