Is one in which Kelly at LSU got paid an extra 1 million bucks last yr that he didn't have coming due to a clerical error of somekind. They caught it themselves through an audit and are going to correct it but man... How's he himself not call that out. Oh hey there's an extra Milly in my account... Must be nice.
The world we live in...
- Thread starter Hawkfnntn
- Start date
Fryowa
Administrator
Sounds like he has his own LLC (common with rich people for liability and tax purposes) and his contract was for his pay to be split between the two. The university accidentally made some double payments to both, and I'd bet my house that he has a different personal accountant than his LLC. Neither likely knew what the other was getting.
Where I work I interact with some 8 and 9 figure farmers/landowners, and it might sound crazy but those dudes don't ever check balances of anything. They also don't use debit cards, checking accounts are for poor folk. These guys just use credit cards with no limits and the bill just gets sent to their accountants for payment every month.
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HawkGold
Well-Known Member
OK Fry,
In small towns, I will grant you that farmers are now the new rich. Yes, he likely has 2 accountants. I imagine Kelly is a coach through and through and doesn't know much about life beyond football.
Unless it's someone like Bob Van Diest or Tom Rosen or Jimmy John Liautaud, there aren't many 9 figure farmer/owners out there as individuals, especially in a small geographic area. Jimmy John you rarely see in business without his business manager by his side. Even at that, there aren't many farmers who make that much (maybe diversified or including asset value) I can guarantee you that Bob and Tom (both I have met) would know if an extra million showed up. And those guys I can bet the house use checks for business purposes and know pretty minute details. They may have accounts with a high minimum or are set up for transfers for withdrawals.
Now, thx to USDA in the past and a former administration (not to be named) there are more than you'd think farmers making mid 6 figures to low 7s that don't have a clue but they aren't good business people and why they could make such a mistake. Jimmy John, you would never pick out as a really rich dude at a farm auction if you didn't know who he was.
I'm not surprised about Kelly making an error. What is surprising is that it got past a university.
Maybe Iowa farmers are richer and dumber than Illinois farmers (joke).
Fryowa
Administrator
I can name as many as you want just in Sioux County alone. You're apparently out of touch with the demographic which isn't good in your line of work. Maybe you've been out of the area too long.
Iowa is not Illinois. Not in crops, land value, or animals. Not even close.
Sioux, O'Brien, Plymouth, and Lyon counties are quite literally packed with people holding 8 figures in land. Right outside Sheldon ground sold for $30,000 a couple months ago. A huge tract for $26,250. And guess what, both of those sales were cash. I can rattle off a huge list of names of guys with 1,000 acres around this area with no loans against it. just owning 1,000 acres here makes you worth at least $25M and that's without your operation, your livestock, your other investment/properties, etc. You can call that illiquid assets if you want, but you'd be wrong, because if it went up for sale today they'd have the cash in their account tomorrow. Banks back these guys without a single question exactly because their assets are so liquid. They're literally everywhere around here. The reason you don't see it is because a huge portion of them are driving 5 year old pickups and wearing Wrangler jeans and Hanes t-shirts.
Bar K has over a hundred thousand head on paper at any given time in Iowa, Colorado, and Texas, and they have even more in Brazil. There are 10+ similar sized operations within a 30 minute drive to me. Iowa produces over 3 times as much pork as the next closest state and each hog building prints money faster than they can spend it.
Meadowvale in Rock Valley is capped at 20,000 head right now and looking to expand. Single family owner.
Roorda in Paullina is putting out 45,000 gallons of milk a day on 4,200 head and expanding next summer. Single family owned.
Hickory Hill in Newkirk is same size as above and this summer doubled capacity, filling it by spring. Single owner.
All of those places are less than a half hour from where I'm sitting and I could go on and on.
I know you don't understand, but Iowa has 6.67% millionaires as a percentage of total households. California is 6.61%… Iowa's percent change in millionaires since 2016 is 6.3% which is the 4th fastest growing subset in the country.
Try and keep up.
HawkGold
Well-Known Member
you crack me up. Love the little digs. I'll try and keep up. 1000 acres I get and quite common and yes it's a lot. Land value does not equal income. Actually except in livestock, IL and Iowa are almost identical except 2022, IL blew Iowa out of the water on yields. 9 digits is a bit far and few between. Managed thousands of acres of a billionaire from London. Darn right he knew his numbers. 5 year old pickups around here are for the teenage sons. I was talking midwest row crops. Colorado and the west are for sure different. Have worked with Ukrainian and Philippines farms. Hog production in the latter can be extremely sophisticated and the hogs live better than the workers. Ukraine, farms of a million acres is not uncommon.
Anyway good fun..
Fryowa
Administrator
Smart guy you are
Wells, Harkers, Vogels……….a few have done OK I guess. I’d be fishing if I included the Berkleys.
Fryowa
Administrator
Incorrect. It’s not about income, it’s about spending power. That’s a distinction you should make.
It’s about income when you’re an average guy with 160 acres, or 50 head of cattle, or 2 hog barns. But those are an almost dead breed here.
Land is no different than cash in the bank and yearly revenues you make from the land once you hit that scale are just the icing on the cake. This isn’t 1994 anymore.
Fryowa
Administrator
A whole lot more than a few. Have you ever met a more secretive person than a farmer when you ask them what they own and operate? I haven’t.
There’s no way to hide an ice cream plant or fishing gear factory, but all it takes to hide your ground and animals is an LLC, or in the case of most big operators, ten or fifteen LLCs in your kids’ and grandkids’ names, or better yet LLCs that are owned by other LLCs.
Fryowa
Administrator
I feel bad for you.
okeefe4prez
Well-Known Member
My granddad died over 20 years ago and my grandma and dad still aren't sure they know what he owned at death. The only thing they knew about was his egg farm and one of the parcels he bought in his individual name because my grandma had to sign the deed.
Just as an FYI for anyone who owns a holding company - the government has amended the laws around anti-money laundering and this new corporate transparency act will require many holding companies to make a filing with FinCEN starting in 2024 or 2025. Failure to file can result in up to 2 years in prison. Just another "show me the man and I'll show you the crime" statute. The IRS can decipher that crap through K-1s issued to owners and this thing is totally unnecessary for US citizens, but we have to criminalize more stuff.
Fryowa
Administrator
In my professional experience it's absolutely astounding the lengths farmers will go to to hide the amount of land and livestock they own. It's just a weird concept, but goes back to the depression era when almost all farmers were struggling and most of them lost everything to the bank. The farmers who were able to acquire more land and had successful operations were looked at like Scrooge McDucks and hated by everyone. Nobody wanted to be that guy, so they kept what they owned a secret all the way to the grave.
Fast forward to today and it's still the same only more so. Guys now keep everything as secret as possible because their dad was taught to be that way by granddad who was taught to keep his mouth shut by great grandad and son on and so on. It's hilarious because most ultra wealthy folks want to broadcast what they own and control to anyone who'll listen .
I know 2 from that area. One is a cousin of my Dads I suppose that makes them 2nd cousins of mine I dunno how that works. They own 10k acres spread out in Cherokee, Ida and Plymouth COs. They custom farm out 10k more. It's just 2 brothers and a couple other hired hands that work for them. They have 1 son that helps but the other two boys one of them has are worthless. Jim has no problem flaunting his $. He drives the fanciest trucks has a big fancy home at the Ozarks in MO with a huge boat. You get the idea.
My dads best buddy though if you met him you wouldn't suspect that he has 2 pairs of boots based on what he drives and how he dresses/conducts himself. His family owns a gravel pit that's made millions over the last 40 plus yrs. He also has close to 200 acres he farms and cattle. Dude is probably worth closer to 5 mil then 2. But he drives a beat up dodge ram thats 10 yrs old at least and still lives in the house he grew up in. Nothing fancy about anything he has except his side by side. He has this old ass cabin on his property by the river that all the boys go to drink for happy hour now that the Quimby bar is closed. The only thing to not like about him is he's an ISU fan....
okeefe4prez
Well-Known Member
No, it's very smart to keep it quiet. The multigenerational ultra wealthy keep it secret other than the kids who get brainwashed into immense guilt or those who have a braggadocious composition. The new ultra wealthy are typically wealthy from an investment in a company that hit the cover off the ball and they are required by securities law to disclose their stake so it is very easy to calculate a ballpark of their net worth.
The ultra wealthy have all sorts of issues to deal with. When people know you are rich you become a target of unscrupulous plaintiff lawyers. You become a target for extortion. Your family is all a target for kidnapping (rich dudes buy ransom insurance). You get all kinds of solicitations. My dad is a financial advisor whose client base is about 90% farmers and they routinely ask him to give a "second look" at certain solicitations they receive and they all wish they were unknown to those solicitors. To quote the incomparable Biggie Smalls, "Mo' Money, Mo' Problems."
If I hit the lottery the only person who would know is my wife. They let you keep it silent down here because the state is so concerned about the dangers the newfound rich run into they want to keep people shielded.
MelroseHawkins
Well-Known Member
What is the average size of acres being farmed now for a private farm (small operation), I remember back in the day 80-100 acres was like a taller bar. I was just wondering what these people are now farming with the technology advances and farm ground hoarding. Is 250 acres common?
MelroseHawkins
Well-Known Member
It's like a fisherman protecting and not broadcasting his lucky lake or fishing spots!
Fryowa
Administrator
Varies wildly from county to county but the statewide average in 2020 was 360 acres. That would be on the smaller end in NW Iowa.
Also, the number is very misleading because the farm census only considered acres owned. The amount of ground in the state that’s being rented is growing exponentially every year. There are lots of people who may own 5-600 acres, but they farm over 1,000 by renting ground from widows and children of farmers who either don’t want to farm or don’t even live in the Midwest.
1,000 acres is about the breaking point where you have to start buying or leasing more equipment to be able to get everything done in the spring and fall. We have a ton of custom farmers around here who don’t own or rent any ground at all, they just lease equipment and do the planting and harvesting for service costs. You’ll find that a lot when guys own a bunch of land but don’t want to dive into leasing two combines/planters/etc. They’ll plant and harvest what they can get done with their equipment, and have a custom guy come in and do the rest and just pay them. Lots of different ways things get done.
MelroseHawkins
Well-Known Member
Interesting.
Has the land got so high now that it is out-pricing the mom and pop farmers and those people shifted to custom farming? Are the big companies only able to afford the land now? I seem to have heard of custom farming in the last several years.
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