the KF salary debate....

[HawkeyeWalker]

is silly. No one had a problem with KF's salary a few years ago so deal with it, it's a contract and why you don't go year-by-year to negociate. Cripes I am tired of all this, we have problems, but KF's salary is not even close to one of them. By the rationale of those that are so bent out of shape of KF's pay vs. performance, you would be completely ok losing to MN and ISU and NW, etc if our coach was making $500k cause that's what that pay gets you.....NO, you wouldn't....and I agree that you shouldn't.

Look, I am reeling from shock, anger, heartache, dissappointment, embarassment, confusion, did I mention anger...over this loss, among a few others in the last 12 months. I also don't believe magically "everything will be alright". I have major anxiety that we are on a slippery slope that could slide us back to the 90's and .500 teams, or worse. The is a bunch of parity in the B1G and teams are getting better as a whole, not to mention we just added a team that by all accounts is on the rise, not the decline.

I do not know the answer, no one on this board does (although you'd never know based on all the experts we have on here). I HATE the undisputable fact that recruiting is such a major factor and we have a significant dissadvantage in that arena. A good example is OSU, it took them all of only 3-4 games to essentially recover, why, cause they have 4*-5* athletes coming out of their ears. If they same situation happened to Iowa, it may take years, if ever, to recover.....we obviously can't even recover from a big graduating class and a couple avg recruiting years.

A bunch of the anger I have comes more from fear, fear of becoming irrelevant again, after having some success.

I, however, am not a fan who expects titles, it's absurd to think we should be a perenial conference title contender without the history to prove it. An occaisional shot is nice, and we've needed some luck to have those...as most do. What I DO expect EVERY year is a shot at 7-9 wins, a bowl game, and the expectation that we win games that we are CLEARLY the better team (thus the rage we all feel for the losses to ISU, MN).

KNOW this, as much as this hurts the fans, the players hurt worse....the difference is they can't take the time to vent...they have to focus. If the coaches and players aren't abolutely beside themselves with anger and motivations....THAT's when changes need to be made. Until then....NOW we Go (we have to believe or what's the point of being a fan!)- yes I agree it's more important for the players and coaches to believe.

Go Hawks....forrrreeeeevvvv--ver.

 

[HawkPrdatr40]

is silly. No one had a problem with KF's salary a few years ago so deal with it, it's a contract and why you don't go year-by-year to negociate. Cripes I am tired of all this, we have problems, but KF's salary is not even close to one of them. By the rationale of those that are so bent out of shape of KF's pay vs. performance, you would be completely ok losing to MN and ISU and NW, etc if our coach was making $500k cause that's what that pay gets you.....NO, you wouldn't....and I agree that you shouldn't.

Is it silly?

Isn't KF the highest paid coach in the Big Ten right now. With that will come attention from not just the fans but everyone.

 

[BlackHawk]

I hate the salary thing, too. It is not KF's fault that the University agreed to overpay him (assuming that the nay-sayers are correct that he is overpaid). What was he supposed to do? Go in with a low-ball offer of $50,000 per year?

Would these losses hurt any less if KF was working for free?

If you think he is overpaid, direct your angst toward the folks that agreed to overpay him, not the guy who did what we all would (or would like to) do--maximize his salary and better his family's position.

 

[1hawkeye1]

 

[HawkPrdatr40]

I hate the salary thing, too. It is not KF's fault that the University agreed to overpay him (assuming that the nay-sayers are correct that he is overpaid). What was he supposed to do? Go in with a low-ball offer of $50,000 per year?

Would these losses hurt any less if KF was working for free?

If you think he is overpaid, direct your angst toward the folks that agreed to overpay him, not the guy who did what we all would (or would like to) do--maximize his salary.

I have no issue with his salary but to say it's silly, that is even more ridiculious. It is what it is this talk will never die. Expectation come with that type of money.

 

[SixAMtailgate]

I don't have a problem with his salary. I have a problem with the Iowa fans, including Jon, saying that we need to remember that we are Iowa. They are right, we are not a national power but then can we stop paying the type of money that makes us look like we should be.

 

[1977Hawkeye]

And people DID have a problem with KF's salary in previous years. Remember 2006 through the first part of 2008? That was a big topic back then, too. The salary debate is not a recent phenomenon.

What is silly, is to expect that with the kind of money KF is making that people aren't going to discuss his being overpaid when his teams lose to the likes of Minnesota (two years in a row no less) and explains it away by saying "That's Football".

I don't hold it against KF for taking the salary (which one of us wouldn't do the same?) but with salary does come expectations, as others have stated.

 

[BlackHawk]

I have no issue with his salary but to say it's silly, that is even more ridiculious. It is what it is this talk will never die. Expectation come with that type of money.

I didn't say it was silly, I said the angst was misdirected.

 

[HawkPrdatr40]

I didn't say it was silly, I said the angst was misdirected.

OP said it was silly not you BlackHawk. His first words say "is silly"

 

[BlackHawk]

OP said it was silly not you BlackHawk. His first words say "is silly"

I know, but you responded to my post, and I wanted to make it clear that I do not think it is silly, but, rather, misdirected.

I don't see it as a legitimate measure to critique KF. It is a legitimate measure to critique Barta, however.

 

[DesMoinesHawki]

I don't care if we pay Kirk $10 million a year ... What fans are saying is that for $3.5 million we should be getting more bang for our buck ... I don't have a problem with him making that type of coin ... if the results on the field support the salary ... If we are going to regularly lose to the likes of Minnesota, Iowa State, Indiana (not this year, but previous years) then we hire a coach and pay him an average salary ...

 

[hawkfan340]

The salary is only partially correlated to wins and losses. He gets paid to keep the football gravy train running smoothly, which he does well. That's the real driving factor.

 

[DesMoinesHawki]

The salary is only partially correlated to wins and losses. He gets paid to keep the football gravy train running smoothly, which he does well. That's the real driving factor.

True... as long as 70,000 butts are in the seats each Saturday then not much can be said or done ...

 

[HaydenHawk56]

The problem is for the type of money he is making, he has not been earning his keep for the last 2 years and probably 05-07 and a little of of 08. That is 6 years of top dollar and not comparable results compared to other coaches making that type of coin and the results they are producing. The perception is we have a "fat cat" coach that is being paid incredibly well for mediocre results.

If own a business and my top consultant is dragging my company down, I may look elsewhere. If things are not getting done with my political representatives, I may vote them out.

Unfortunately, the harsh reality is college athletics is a big business and coaches are paid for their performance (ultimately judged by wins and losses). Sometimes they may get more credit or criticism for the results they produce, but it will come back to them at the end of the day.

People will still not be happy if a guy making 2 million dollars or less lost the game to Minny. However, the point is pay should be consistent with results more or less for what you are expecting to achieve over time. Both the overpaid coach and step 1 (or average market) salary coach will get fired over time if they don't produce.

I think the problem Iowa fans have is that for 6 years, Ferentz has been a near 4 million dollar coach and has only earned that salary for 1.5 years (09 and the second part of 08). The over time effect is making fans on edge because Ferentz is being paid very well and is under-producing. That is where the fan sentiment is coming from in the argument of pay vs results in regards to Ferentz. Fans are paying part of Ferentz's salary when they go to the games.......so they are going to be upset when the team is struggling like they are.

Perception wise, Ferentz has really only looked like a 4 million dollar coach in 02-04, and 09 and half of 08. 4.5 years out of his 13 years here.

 

[busabus114]

I dont understand people who care how much KF makes. He is paid what he is paid because thats what it takes to keep him here

If the only argument is we could hire someone else for half the money why do you care? We arent going to get a cut of that 2 mil in savings.

 

[HaydenHawk56]

You should care.......there may be some hot shot coach out there very motivated to win at Iowa for what Ferentz is being paid.

Also, you are paying high ticket prices to see a mediocre product (well at least Iowa has played better at home....to date). Why keep a fat cat that is not earning his keep and is costing you more in your pocket book to watch mediocre football?

I'm not saying I want Ferentz gone (or should I say fired right now), but I would like to see changes in the assistant ranks. One I think is pretty much a given due to the coach's health. But, if the NFL came all calling for Kirk, I would not be upset if he left at this point in time. Reason is fans will stop coming to the games and the administration will be forced to make tough decisions.

The gravy train is going to run out in the next 1-2 years if this trend continues. Then Ferentz will seriously be in hot water if he can't make changes that are necessary now.

 

[busabus114]

Also, you are paying high ticket prices to see a mediocre product (well at least Iowa has played better at home....to date). Why keep a fat cat that is not earning his keep and is costing you more in your pocket book to watch mediocre football?

So you think if the coach is paid less, ticket prices will go down? You really think that?

 

[NewMexHawk]

Boy would I like to work for the op of this thread. If I don't perform, no big deal, as the owner of the business. And if consumers and the CEO questioned the way things are being done, that manager can just tell everyone, "Deal with it, I will do it my way and my way only, even if it is not being successful."


Of course his business would not be around very long with that attitude.

 

[NewMexHawk]

Even better, let me ask this of the op.

In a business, when you pay someone $4,000,000 a year, what do YOU expect from that CEO/Manager? To be as successful as possible and make decisions that he might not like to make. Ever fired someone before? It is not easy, nor is it fun. In some cases you have worked with that person for years but they simply are not getting the job done. They have been warned to do what they need to do to turn their job around. They continue doing the same thing, unsuccessfully, you fire them or ask for their resignation.

What makes Ferentz so different? He is being paid at the highest level of college football. Do most businesses pay a manager at the top level to perform mediocre? Is that not the case with Ferentz and his staff? It matters NOT what they have done in the past. What matters is what they are doing right now. And right now their job performance is low, very low in several factors of the game. AS manager/CEO, it is up to Ferentz to make the tough decisons. Is this coach REALLY helping Iowa win? Is this coach doing everything he can possibly do, given his personnel, to win? If not, Ferentz should demand that changes be made TO win.

He simply cannot let friendships and loyalty get in the way of the Iowa football program. Being a great friend and being loyal is not what he is being paid to do. He is being paid to win games...PERIOD.

 

[1977Hawkeye]

He is paid what he is paid because thats what it takes to keep him here.

Ferentz is paid what he is paid because of what he accomplished from 2002-04, it's really as simple as that. True, it's partially to keep him here, but if it wasn't for those 3 big years, do you think the university would be paying KF $4 million a year or whatever it is exactly?

The AD can't just give him a paycut. A contract has been signed, and that is that. KF is legally owed what the contract says, no matter what he produces.