Stick a fork in it

Gotta have a win at Cheeseturds house, it's a must in my opinion, and is doable. Can players and coaches put it together? If you gonna change your trajectory gotta happen now, or confidence will be totally broken.
 
HawkeyeFever said:
BULL...The target(s) never changes.

1) Top four or better in the B1G regular season every year
2) At least one B1G regular season championship every ten years.
3) Second round or better in NCAA every year.
4) Sweet sixteen or better every four years

Those are the targets.

How many of those have been attained in the last twenty years?

In 1999, Tom Davis tied for third in the B1G and reached the sweet 16 (three targets met)

Alford reached the second round of the NCAA's once in 2000 - 2001 season, but finished tied for 6th in the B1G that year. In seven seasons, he finished in the top four of the B1G three times with no regular season championships (four targets met in seven years).

Lickliter...do I even need to say?

How many has Fran attained in nine years? Two ties for third in the B1G in 2015 and 2016, the same years the Hawks reached the second round (four targets met).

So, in twenty years, Iowa has met 11 targets of a possible 47.
In nine years, Fran has met 4 targets of a possible 22.

Maybe my targets are a little pie in the sky, but shouldn't Iowa be able to attain at least one fourth of those targets?
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I’m glad you set your targets. #2-4 I can get on board with.

Target #1 isn’t really realistic, although Wisconsin did it under Bo for a pretty long span (prior to expansion mostly). Maybe top four 3 out of every 5 years would be a more realistic target.
 
HawkeyeFever said:
BULL...The target(s) never changes.

1) Top four or better in the B1G regular season every year
2) At least one B1G regular season championship every ten years.
3) Second round or better in NCAA every year.
4) Sweet sixteen or better every four years

Those are the targets.

How many of those have been attained in the last twenty years?

In 1999, Tom Davis tied for third in the B1G and reached the sweet 16 (three targets met)

Alford reached the second round of the NCAA's once in 2000 - 2001 season, but finished tied for 6th in the B1G that year. In seven seasons, he finished in the top four of the B1G three times with no regular season championships (four targets met in seven years).

Lickliter...do I even need to say?

How many has Fran attained in nine years? Two ties for third in the B1G in 2015 and 2016, the same years the Hawks reached the second round (four targets met).

So, in twenty years, Iowa has met 11 targets of a possible 47.
In nine years, Fran has met 4 targets of a possible 22.

Maybe my targets are a little pie in the sky, but shouldn't Iowa be able to attain at least one fourth of those targets?
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I'm fine with your targets and your expectations, you fan how you want to fan. I have high expectations as well, I just don't think meeting an unrealistic goal should require blowing up your program and starting over. We have years of data to look at. How many years has Iowa ever met them regardless of coach? Not often. That doesn't sound like a Fran problem and IMO it points out the reality of Iowa and where you're expectations and bar should be at. I would like to see Iowa make the NCAA in 4 out of 5 seasons routinely. If they don't, I want a good explanation - as in a huge class graduates, a injury or something extreme. 2 years ago they had a huge class graduate and missed the dance by a game. I was ok with it. Last year I was not ok with. But, I wanted to afford a good coach the opportunity to right his wrong. He's done that for me already. The target for this program after last season was to get back to the NCAA. How could it not be after last year? Now that looks like a certain & people are changing the target....that way you can always be disappointed
 
TheIowaHawkGuy said:
This is Iowa. Narrative ain’t changing, this program under Fran is awful in February and March.
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I thought so too, but the stats don't really spell that out.

Feb-March regular season
2017-2018: 1-6 (we sucked all year)
2016-17: 5-3
2015-16: 4-5
2014-15: 8-2
2013-14: 4-6
2012-13: 6-4
2011-12: 5-4

32-24 if you throw out last year. 33-30 if you want to include last year.

The postseason is a different animal altogether though, especially the BTT
 
Another game like the last two and I'll be ready to stick a fork in it. Must win one of the last two. I never thought they would get to 10 wins after 0-3 start and was wrong. Hopefully they turn it around Thursday. Losing at Wisconsin isn't end of the world, but want to see more fight. Put Happ to the foul line if you have to.

I'm back to remembering more of last year again. Make it stop!!!
 
mopkins said:
I thought so too, but the stats don't really spell that out.

Feb-March regular season
2017-2018: 1-6 (we sucked all year)
2016-17: 5-3
2015-16: 4-5
2014-15: 8-2
2013-14: 4-6
2012-13: 6-4
2011-12: 5-4

32-24 if you throw out last year. 33-30 if you want to include last year.

The postseason is a different animal altogether though, especially the BTT
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Jeez, I thought it had to be much worse than those #'s. So you are saying that Fran is basically a little above .500 down the stretch of the conference. Weird - that's when most teams play all their hard games and the stakes go higher. Backs are against the wall and teams feel pressure. Iowa is definitely a program that is going to be in that position more than most who have a better spot on the totem pole. I want Fran to have more success as well and I need it to keep supporting him as our coach, but teams fade down the stretch. That's not unique to Iowa. A lot of teams just need to get to the dance to face someone out of their conference..... my thing is it's disheartening to have fans shovel dirt on the team based on imaginary records down the stretch. I don't think firing him and starting over does the program any good long term unless there is real reason to do it. Who's waiting in the wings? Iowa has tended to get off to hot starts, get our hopes up and then kind of regress to the means...but every season is different, every year is a new match up and dynamic. You say (not you Mopkins) we accept mediocre - I say you have a losers mentality to give up on the team before the games are even played.
 
InGoodCo said:
Jeez, I thought it had to be much worse than those #'s. So you are saying that Fran is basically a little above .500 down the stretch of the conference. Weird - that's when most teams play all their hard games and the stakes go higher. Backs are against the wall and teams feel pressure. Iowa is definitely a program that is going to be in that position more than most who have a better spot on the totem pole. I want Fran to have more success as well and I need it to keep supporting him as our coach, but teams fade down the stretch. That's not unique to Iowa. A lot of teams just need to get to the dance to face someone out of their conference..... my thing is it's disheartening to have fans shovel dirt on the team based on imaginary records down the stretch. I don't think firing him and starting over does the program any good long term unless there is real reason to do it. Who's waiting in the wings? Iowa has tended to get off to hot starts, get our hopes up and then kind of regress to the means...but every season is different, every year is a new match up and dynamic. You say (not you Mopkins) we accept mediocre - I say you have a losers mentality to give up on the team before the games are even played.
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I think we just remember a couple distinct collapses followed by a lot of early exits from the BTT and then a few earlier exits from the NCAA and we tie them all together...that is my guess. Because yeah I was confused too after looking at the data.
 
InGoodCo said:
Jeez, I thought it had to be much worse than those #'s. So you are saying that Fran is basically a little above .500 down the stretch of the conference. Weird - that's when most teams play all their hard games and the stakes go higher. Backs are against the wall and teams feel pressure. Iowa is definitely a program that is going to be in that position more than most who have a better spot on the totem pole. I want Fran to have more success as well and I need it to keep supporting him as our coach, but teams fade down the stretch. That's not unique to Iowa. A lot of teams just need to get to the dance to face someone out of their conference..... my thing is it's disheartening to have fans shovel dirt on the team based on imaginary records down the stretch. I don't think firing him and starting over does the program any good long term unless there is real reason to do it. Who's waiting in the wings? Iowa has tended to get off to hot starts, get our hopes up and then kind of regress to the means...but every season is different, every year is a new match up and dynamic. You say (not you Mopkins) we accept mediocre - I say you have a losers mentality to give up on the team before the games are even played.
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It is pretty funny how many talk about competitiveness being a reason they can't stand mediocrity (like they are actually competing) but being competitive means you dont give up. I know someone who won't play something they suck at because they're "too competitive to lose". I say I'm too competitive to not keep playing and trying to get better.
 
mopkins said:
I think we just remember a couple distinct collapses followed by a lot of early exits from the BTT and then a few earlier exits from the NCAA and we tie them all together...that is my guess. Because yeah I was confused too after looking at the data.
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I never got confused because I distinctly remember how it was always talked about how much Fran's teams improve every year as the year went on until Marble's senior year. That was the first time we weren't playing our best at the end of the year. Then the very next year was back to playing their best at the end of the year. The year after that they fell apart again. Those were the only 2 years under Fran, but they were huge years so it stuck out.

The thing that concerns me is if this year finishes bad, he will he 0-3 for finishing strong when he had a good team before the home stretch.
 
I guess what bothers me the most about what's currently going on isn't the fact that we are losing. It's the fact that the last 2 games we've been blown out. You see really good teams have a few off nights during a certain stretch, all the time and then they seem to pump the breaks and refocus. My concern is the last two games haven't been just bumps in the road, but absolutely beat downs. Sure it may be fixable, but what I've seen on the court recently has me very concerned that they can quickly flip the script in time for the post season. I hope I'm wrong and they do right the ship, but that's no easy task based on our last two games.
 
NikeHawk21 said:
When asked nobody will ever answer what their legitimate expectations for the Iowa program are.

In reality four tournaments is six years historically is pretty good for the Iowa program.

Do I want more (better seeds, longer tournament runs, big ten title contention)? Absolutely.

The reality is one or two players could significantly change the trajectory of this program. That first wave of players (Marble, JU, Woody, MG) got us back to NCAA level. Maybe Wieskamp can take us a step higher.
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And Patrick and Joe T. and the redshirts.
 
PCHawk said:
It only matters if you make the tournament on years we don't make it. If we make it but lose the first game, that's when wins matter. If we win the first game and lose the second game, you have to make the sweet 16. Gotta keep that bar moving just out of reach so you never have to be happy.
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What is wrong with You? The bar is right around the corner, open the door and walk right in! Always makes me happy.
 
kicker22 said:
I guess what bothers me the most about what's currently going on isn't the fact that we are losing. It's the fact that the last 2 games we've been blown out. You see really good teams have a few off nights during a certain stretch, all the time and then they seem to pump the breaks and refocus. My concern is the last two games haven't been just bumps in the road, but absolutely beat downs. Sure it may be fixable, but what I've seen on the court recently has me very concerned that they can quickly flip the script in time for the post season. I hope I'm wrong and they do right the ship, but that's no easy task based on our last two games.
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Remember how bad they were last year? They flipped the switch for the post season after the switch was off for the entire year. I share your concerns about turning it around for these last two games. But not for the post season. My concerns for the post season are we simply aren't a good enough team and even if we are and have a good showing, we may lose and be done anyway.
 
PCHawk said:
I never got confused because I distinctly remember how it was always talked about how much Fran's teams improve every year as the year went on until Marble's senior year. That was the first time we weren't playing our best at the end of the year. Then the very next year was back to playing their best at the end of the year. The year after that they fell apart again. Those were the only 2 years under Fran, but they were huge years so it stuck out.

The thing that concerns me is if this year finishes bad, he will he 0-3 for finishing strong when he had a good team before the home stretch.
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I still can't get over the fact that right now Iowa is 3 *****MIRACLE***** finishes from being 0 for their past 6. It literally took 3 f'ing miracles for us to win 3 of our last 6 games.
 
mopkins said:
I still can't get over the fact that right now Iowa is 3 *****MIRACLE***** finishes from being 0 for their past 6. It literally took 3 f'ing miracles for us to win 3 of our last 6 games.
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But if we lose the Rutgers game because you take away our miracle, we could at least say "without that miracle by Rutgers, we would have won that game". Indiana wasn't a miracle either really. We hit one big shot by a player who hits big shots. That's far from a miracle. Northwestern was tho, I will give you that.
 
PCHawk said:
But if we lose the Rutgers game because you take away our miracle, we could at least say "without that miracle by Rutgers, we would have won that game". Indiana wasn't a miracle either really. We hit one big shot by a player who hits big shots. That's far from a miracle. Northwestern was tho, I will give you that.
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Rutgers and NW were both miracles. Indiana yeah not a miracle necessarily but a clutch clutch few shots
 
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