I think they said during the broadcast that he and the other safety were both filling in for injured starters.
State of passing game
- Thread starter Iceman
- Start date
trj
Well-Known Member
I will be the bad guy in this thread. Given the current state of o-line play in general, this o-line is good and Barnett deserves credit for that. This o-line is 2015 good except CJB was much better than CM. Shedeur Sanders would kill to have the Iowa o-line right now.
Iowa is basically rolling out 5 guards as their o-line, which 95% of Power 4 teams and 90% of NFL teams are doing. There are only so many 320 lbs. humans with the athleticism to do this. You guys are nitpicking over bullshit. Is the pass protection perfect? No. Gawd forbid you get a quarterback that can make a play with his arm or legs or maybe both.
#1DieHardHawk
Well-Known Member
Is the line better than the last two seasons? Absolutely. The point is they should be better - meaning that health and experience by itself was destined to translate into better play (ideally). Improvement was bound to happen organically, regardless of the coach.
Don't misunderstand, I'm not hating on the line or the players. Just pointing out that fundamental errors are still happening primarily in pass-pro, which have nothing to do with scheme, and reflect on coaching. Fans are jumping all over McNamara. I get it, but no quarterback is going to have a great stat line when an interior defensive lineman is immediately in his face over and over.
McNamara definitely has his faults, and honestly hasn't shown much, but we have to remember the quarterback doesn't play in a vacuum - Protection, route running, reads in RPO, etc., are all factors in his play. He may well end up not being the answer, but there's a lot to take into account before the torches and pitchforks come out.
trj
Well-Known Member
I dunno, man. In a perfect world Richman and Dunker would be playing inside, but so many teams have to throw guards out there to be tackles, it makes it hard for me to shit on Barnett.
Jones, Colby and Stephens…I think we know what these guys are at this point . I’m not going to get mad at those guys because Cade doesn’t have 5 seconds to throw the football.
Colby is the biggest surprise to me, in a negative way. He came out of h.s. with all the tools to be an exceptional OLineman. To be fair, he was thrust into a starting role at guard, then tackle I believe as a Fr, far before he was ready. But as a 3-4 year starter, the time for excuses is over. It's shocking to see how many times his vision is wrong and guys directly across from him get past him without even being touched. I don't know if the Oline calls are too complex, but in pass protection if guys would just block the guys in front of them, they'd have great success. Multiple experienced guys on Iowa's OLine simply are not able to do that consistently. If they were Fr, it would be understandable. They're not...they want to be playing in the NFL next year. It's baffling.
HuckFinn
Well-Known Member
I don’t get it guys. I have watched my dvr a couple of times and focused on the O line. Needless to say, they completely dominated MN in the second half. Big holes, downfield blocking, very, very physical. Good pulling techniques with solid results. Zone blocking very effective. Huge cut back lanes for RB’s. Result was a ton of yards in the run game And unlike last year, virtually zero negative running plays. Right?
Remember. Richmond is rated by nfl sources as the best pass protection guy in their analysis list. Yes, as a left tackle. Dunker is a road grader. Sometimes he just misses. More often, he needs to be charged with assault. Guards are better by far this year and Jones looks like he has recovered from his injuries. Not a lot of pressure on Cade from the inside, which was awful last season.
Announcers pointed out the 8 and 9 man fronts by MN in the first half and constant blitzes out numbered our O line. They were right, my observations confirmed. They came full blast at our QB because it was obvious when we had to throw the ball. They tried that in the second half to no avail. Chunk run plays were the result as we got to second level and nobody home. Some great play calling and change up blocking schemes made the second half a nightmare for MN.
Now. Can we achieve consistently? And, as KF made clear, we must get going on passing the football.
Remember. Richmond is rated by nfl sources as the best pass protection guy in their analysis list. Yes, as a left tackle. Dunker is a road grader. Sometimes he just misses. More often, he needs to be charged with assault. Guards are better by far this year and Jones looks like he has recovered from his injuries. Not a lot of pressure on Cade from the inside, which was awful last season.
Announcers pointed out the 8 and 9 man fronts by MN in the first half and constant blitzes out numbered our O line. They were right, my observations confirmed. They came full blast at our QB because it was obvious when we had to throw the ball. They tried that in the second half to no avail. Chunk run plays were the result as we got to second level and nobody home. Some great play calling and change up blocking schemes made the second half a nightmare for MN.
Now. Can we achieve consistently? And, as KF made clear, we must get going on passing the football.
Fryowa
Administrator
Normally his statement about that would make me feel better because it would mean the QB's at risk of being benched for a new approach, whether temporarily or permanently, but I won't necessarily put too much stock into it until I see a change.
One thing I don't think gets considered enough is that a major depth chart shakeup, particularly at QB is basically a public admission that you were wrong in your choice of leader for the team. KF seems to hate doing that which I understand...it's not a pleasant thing to admit you missed on someone who was so highly touted. Same thing with an offensive philosophy. Letting Lester have the keys to the car and do things totally different than what's been done the past decade (and produced terrible offensive performances) isn't something KF is willing to do at this point, and I do believe some of that is a get off my lawn, I know what's best type of thing.
And just to spread the load around a little, I've felt the same way in the past about Phil never blitzing, especially as college football has moved away from the run game. But the difference is no matter what he does, Phil has had a ton of success to this point. I think that's the difference. KF is certainly no dummy, but I think each year that passes he gets less and less willing to try new things and admit what he does (on the offensive side) doesn't work well.
NorthKCHawk
Well-Known Member
I gotta push back on some of this. While firing his son was not his idea, he went outside his normal circle and hired a guy he had no real relationship with, and from what I have observed, has let him implement his system and run it the way that he wants to. This offense looks nothing like BF's offense, both in scheme and performance (and for the most part, its the same players). He could have elevated Budmyr and told him to run BF's offense better. He didn't, so there is some change there.
I get your point at QB, and I agree that he is not hinting at a change, but saying what he always says in season, "we just gotta work harder and be better at the same thing." Its maddening. There was a lot of money and reputation that went into bringing CM in as the savior. He fizzled last year with injury and is fizzing this year with a lack of confidence and maybe just a lack of ability.
I still believe that KF is letting Lester do things his way, including the goal line packages for Sully. I also believe that Lester is not being forced to put CM out there by KF. He has no attachment to either QB, and I think is playing the guy that runs the offense best in practice. I don't believe that KF just hands out orders, but like any good leader, has a discussion and builds a consensus. Again, we have no idea if Sully will be any improvement, and CM is not making mistakes. There is a lot to play out here.
This play is illustrative of the problems:
Iowa at Minnesota | Highlights | Big Ten Football | 09/21/2024
00:00:00 - 1st Quarter00:00:56 - 2nd Quarter00:01:52 - 3rd Quarter00:02:31 - 4th Quarter#B1GFootball #iowahawkeyes #minnesotagoldengophers #bigtenfootball Wa...
youtu.be
MN has 4 guys in threatening positions to the offense's left, so presumably we shift protection in that direction (OL fans that way, RB is on that side). Two of those guys back out, and a blitzer comes from the right. So, now there are 3 rushers coming from the right, and we only have 1 guy over there (OG is looking left, and RB has to come all the way across).
I don't know enough about football to know if this is just a case where you tip your cap to the D for a good disguise, if the scheme was flawed, or if Colby needed to do a better job of thinking on his feet. Whatever happened, having one guy blocking 3 rushers is not a winning formula.
#1DieHardHawk
Well-Known Member
Agree. Sometimes the defense just has the right scheme and play-call at the right time. Very hard to hold that against the line or backs. That kind of situation is just going to happen occasionally.This play is illustrative of the problems:
Iowa at Minnesota | Highlights | Big Ten Football | 09/21/2024
00:00:00 - 1st Quarter00:00:56 - 2nd Quarter00:01:52 - 3rd Quarter00:02:31 - 4th Quarter#B1GFootball #iowahawkeyes #minnesotagoldengophers #bigtenfootball Wa...
MN has 4 guys in threatening positions to the offense's left, so presumably we shift protection in that direction (OL fans that way, RB is on that side). Two of those guys back out, and a blitzer comes from the right. So, now there are 3 rushers coming from the right, and we only have 1 guy over there (OG is looking left, and RB has to come all the way across).
I don't know enough about football to know if this is just a case where you tip your cap to the D for a good disguise, if the scheme was flawed, or if Colby needed to do a better job of thinking on his feet. Whatever happened, having one guy blocking 3 rushers is not a winning formula.
My original concern had more to do with inability to sustain blocks from a physical and technique standpoint. When it's "man on man" you want to see experienced offensive linemen win the majority of those battles for at least 3-4 seconds, and frankly our interior guys have been a sieve at times (still, better than last season...). I have decent confidence that it will improve moving forward, especially with Lester in place.
Criticizing the QB is low hanging fruit and often misplaced. For a passing play to be effective, everything has to be in sync, including the protection and route-running. It's not all on Cade.
