JonDMiller
Publisher/Founder
Iowa has averaged above 72.3ppg just three times since Tom Davis left...and never by more than one full point...that was Davis' low mark at Iowa.
Sienna averaged at least 74.4ppg in all five Fran years
- Thread starter JonDMiller
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Agree in part. I do think Iowa will have some players that with more depth could thrive in an uptempo system. Brust, May and Fuller are the three players this change could really help. Even Payne and Gatens if there is another ball-handler on the floor could really improve there FG% by better looks.
I think the keys are one more ball-handler, the improved depth and keeping Fuller.
iowahawkeyes89
Well-Known Member
I'm curious as to what Brommer and Cougs will do.
I'm not sure if either can move well enough for this style of ball? Could be wrong...but Cougs really sticks out.
I'm not sure if either can move well enough for this style of ball? Could be wrong...but Cougs really sticks out.
1977Hawkeye
Well-Known Member
I'm sure it's been mentioned before, but any idea what we averaged per game under Lickliter?
I'm sure Fran's style of ball will be much easier to stomach. I'm looking forward to it.
I'm sure Fran's style of ball will be much easier to stomach. I'm looking forward to it.
I do think it will help Gatens, because Matt will not have three guys between him and the basket all the time.
But, look back at some Siena games. Those guys were real athletes. We have guys that can play more athletic than they play now. But they are not greyhounds.
May has that kind of athleticism. People are throwing Cully in there, but he really isn't THAT kind of athlete.
I will have to see the freshmen play at this level before I really know.
I can say this. I really expect Larson to dominate at PF in this offense. He gets up and down the court really well at can do it with great control.
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FromFry2Ferentz
Well-Known Member
Its gonna be fun to see some high scoring again.
Rawkhawk73
Banned
I think I read somewhere today that Iowa averaged 60.5 points/game over the last 3 year period. This year we averaged something like 57/game which was last in the B10.
imported_ankle23
Well-Known Member
CAAR - maybe you've already done this, but if you haven't, you should do a little research on his first year at Siena, and the cards he was dealt, the players he had, and the results.
you can find several siena fans posting on hawkeyereport.com and they have some pretty good insite on this guy. I am impressed with the hire and his ability to coach given any situation.
I threw Cully and Gatens in there with the qualifier that there is another ball-handler on the floor. Neither are quick enough with the ball in their hands to push the tempo but both are adequate enough that if another player pushed the ball and set them up a bit they could either hit the the open three or get to the basket before the other teams bigs get down the court. I think Diebler for OSU is a prime example of how that can be effective.
Watching Siena play vs. Dayton I think there is a big difference. I think McCaffery's system will be better suited to the current players than if Gregory would have come in. I am not saying one system is better than the other, just there is a difference in amount of control the players showed.
I have. That is why I added the comment about playing in the MAAC. Just not the depth there is in the Big Ten. His first team at Siena would have gotten killed in the Big Ten. As it was, they were middle of the pack in that league.
Things changed when he brought in his first recruiting classes and MOST IMPORTANTLY the Big Three. Problem is that he doesn't have any available scholarships to do the same thing at Iowa.
Now, can he find a Kenny Hasbrouk with Tucker's scholarship? Maybe. But that doesn't allow him to go out and get a Big Three next year.
The Big Three and Hasbrouk took Siena to the MAAC championship game in FM's second year and then dominated from there on out. Unless that same thing happens at Iowa, then his first shot to get that type of class is 2012. Didn't work out for Lick to have his first good class in year 3. If Iowa has three more years of irrelevance, it would be a very hard sell to get a top class in 2012.
FM needs to make a splash in recruiting by next year. That means he needs scholarships.
I agree that Siena had greyhounds,and Iowa does not. But,as someone noted, Siena did not have greyhounds when Fran arrived either, and they showed immediate improvement despite some crippling injuries.
Fran adjusted to what he inherited, played slower at times, used a big post man, and won games that first year.
Then over the course of the next two years he filled the roster with greyhounds,and boom...they started playing very fast.
I think there are players at Iowa who can play...medium speed..like Payne,Gatens,May,Fuller,Cole,Larson,Marble,and Brust. Bring in another pg who plays quick,and Fran can work with it ,I suspect.
Then, starting next year, add greyhounds,like Randle,Paige,Staten and Jok...and Chicago/NYC/NJ?Philly guys...and then we will see Siena-ball.
Fran adjusted to what he inherited, played slower at times, used a big post man, and won games that first year.
Then over the course of the next two years he filled the roster with greyhounds,and boom...they started playing very fast.
I think there are players at Iowa who can play...medium speed..like Payne,Gatens,May,Fuller,Cole,Larson,Marble,and Brust. Bring in another pg who plays quick,and Fran can work with it ,I suspect.
Then, starting next year, add greyhounds,like Randle,Paige,Staten and Jok...and Chicago/NYC/NJ?Philly guys...and then we will see Siena-ball.
This is killing me. All these people talking as though Iowa has a better basketball program than Siena. When was the last time Iowa cracked the top 100 in RPI? #210 this year, which was worse than all but two MAAC teams.
The MAAC may not be a great league, but Iowa ( and Indiana, and Penn State ) would fit right in. At the bottom.
Iowa basketball has basically one thing going for it. $5.5 million from the football team.
Run Francis! Run!
HawkinGoferLand
Well-Known Member
Scoring Ave per game in Tom Davis era:
1986-87 Iowa: 87.3 - Opponents: 74.4
1987-88: 93.6 - 81.4
1988: 89.6 - 81.2
1989: 75.4 - 80.1
1990: 76.8 - 72.1
1991: 81.1 - 72.0
1992: 78.3 - 65.4
1993: 83.5 - 81.7
1994: 83.6 - 74.6
1995: 79.6 - 67.9
1996: 72.3 - 63.7
1997: 80.2 - 67.5
1998: 73.9 - 70.0
if my math is correct, we scored 33,278 pts over Tom Davis' 413 game career for an 80.6 ppg ave.
Hillman: You are misunderstanding me. My point is that FM's first team at Siena would have fared worse if it was in the Big Ten. I am not saying Iowa is better than that team. However, I think FM will have more to work with than he had with his first team at Siena with the incoming recruits.
However, as it currently stands, I don't think his Iowa team would match his Siena teams from year 2 and on, because of the Big Three and Hasbrouk.
That is why I think he needs to clear some scholarships.
JehovahShalom
Well-Known Member
I'm willing to say that FM will do better next year than Lick did this year... 10 wins, given our nonconference slate, is BAD... I would think 15+ wins next year is gonna happen...
"Clearing scholarships" is a bit of slippery slope. You don't want to be Bobby Huggins here. I understand your points but some caution is needed. Coach indicated he wanted to rerecruit every player. Now I must admit that I was frustrated by the distribution of scholarships under Lick. Specifically using two scholarships for basically the same type of player in Brommer and Archie. Both have limited offensive skills and for the foreseeable future will be at most front court depth to come in and provide defensive help when the starters have foul trouble. What is worse, they are in the same class now that Lick redshirted Archie. If Archie hadn't redshirted then he would be a senior next year and problem solved.
It is always a hard call because coach will basically have to go off of third person reporting to evaluate the players, determine how he thinks they will play in a completely different system, how they will fit with the team and give input about their future based off of that.
It is always a hard call because coach will basically have to go off of third person reporting to evaluate the players, determine how he thinks they will play in a completely different system, how they will fit with the team and give input about their future based off of that.
Jehovah.
Consider this, until we hear that Fuller is staying, that is up in the air. Also, Lick's system, although boring as **** did keep Iowa in striking distance and allowed the team to play without a center, not overly athletic players, fewer contributors, and one PG.
Change the system with the current roster to a more running system and these limitations have more impact.
Again, FM may go out and get the PG, which would help. Fuller might be back, which would really help, or he might be able to use Fuller's scholly for another contributor. But, it is not a foregone conclusion that FM will fare a whole lot better at this point.
Consider this, until we hear that Fuller is staying, that is up in the air. Also, Lick's system, although boring as **** did keep Iowa in striking distance and allowed the team to play without a center, not overly athletic players, fewer contributors, and one PG.
Change the system with the current roster to a more running system and these limitations have more impact.
Again, FM may go out and get the PG, which would help. Fuller might be back, which would really help, or he might be able to use Fuller's scholly for another contributor. But, it is not a foregone conclusion that FM will fare a whole lot better at this point.
Not really sure if "slippery slope" is the right term. That means doing one thing will lead to doing more of it. I think you could do a one-time roster adjustment. However, I would not suggest coming in and cleaning house. But, I would suggest helping players make the best decisions they can with respect to finding the right level at which to play. And if it is deemed that a player is better suited to play at a different level, I would work really, really hard to find the right place for that student.
Actually, a good example of this happened with Barry Switzer and Troy Aikman. When Aikman was at OU, Switzer decided to go back to the modified wishbone. He knew Aikman would not survive in that offense, so he called UCLA directly and discussed the chances of Aikman transferring. The rest is history. Don't just kick the kid to the curb.
