NCAA overstepped their authority:
http://onwardstate.com/2014/11/05/internal-emails-show-ncaa-questioned-jurisdiction-over-penn-state/
http://onwardstate.com/2014/11/05/internal-emails-show-ncaa-questioned-jurisdiction-over-penn-state/
Penn State sanctions
- Thread starter Duke
- Start date
biasedHAWKEYE
Well-Known Member
Ehhh, technically they didn't "overstep" because there was no line...there were no true processes or comparisons.
The NCAA's only mistake was not giving Penn State the death penalty for lack of institutional control involving child endangerment.
The NCAA's only mistake was not giving Penn State the death penalty for lack of institutional control involving child endangerment.
Emmert and the NCAA played to the public and bluffed PSU into submission. Emmert should be fired. The NCAA overstepped their mandate, and clearly know they were wrong, because they have left other culprits alone after the PSU sanctions...like Mizzou who protected a star rb who was a serial rapist, Washington....school and AD and coach all knew about it and covered it up....and kept playing him...but NCAA not interested....they know the PSU scandal was a one time deal for the NCAA...criminal matters belong in criminal court.
biasedHAWKEYE
Well-Known Member
NCAA needs to be more consistent, but schools are members of the NCAA. This gives the NCAA the right punish its members for not upholding its bylaws and the spirit of the organization.
This is equivalent to an individual getting suspended from a private organization for being involved in criminal activities. While the private club cannot prosecute or convict the individual of the crime (that is for the courts), they can punish the individual using their own determination of guilt.
HawkeyeMike23
Banned
The NCAA is a joke, they should have never been involved with this to being with. Not an NCAA issue. Glad these documents show the NCAA knew they had nothing to back up their punishment and were just throwing **** at the wall to appease the dumb public.
kicker22
Well-Known Member
Agreed. I also think that the fact so many higher ups, in authoritative positions, standing by while doing nothing to address the issue had more to do with the punishment then the crime itself. PSU wasn't necessarily about holding the University accountable for the disgusting acts of an individual, but rather a massive cover up in which everyone involved stood by and did nothing to stop it.
I'm not going to reopen the debate about whether the punishment was justifiable/legal or not, but at the same time PSU, but if certain people in positions of power did their duties as mandatory reporters, not to mention human beings, there wouldn't have been any sanctions, because it would have been an isolated incident handled by both the university and the authorities. When Universities fail to do their part I see no reason why another governing body steps in.
HawkeyeMike23
Banned
The best way to punish rapists is to take away football wins from a decade before. The victims of Sandusky can sleep well now that they know the 1999 Outback Bowl win has been vacated. Their ordeal finally has some closure.
The NCAA is punishing PSU's involvement in the cover-up of a crime, not Sandusky. Yes, some will sleep better knowing there is at least some penalty for a cover-up of this magnitude. PSU got off easy, too easy.
HawkeyeMike23
Banned
Good thing that three star LB from Punxsutawney didn't get that scholarship offer because Penn St was down a few scholarships. Loss of depth in your LB core is a punishment that definitely fits the crime of raping children.
Never mind the fact that those involved are all dead or in jail, Penn St not being able to play in the Gator Bowl in 2012 is the real punishment.
guffus
Well-Known Member
Vacating wins was a fitting punishment because everything was about getting Joe Paterno his record for all-time coaching wins.
PSU knew that as soon as it came out that Sundusky was a pedophile, Paterno would be out as coach. The cover-up was all about protecting Paterno and his legacy, which is why it was dragged out for decades. Thats why the football team was punished.
PSU knew that as soon as it came out that Sundusky was a pedophile, Paterno would be out as coach. The cover-up was all about protecting Paterno and his legacy, which is why it was dragged out for decades. Thats why the football team was punished.
kicker22
Well-Known Member
So you lost me with your well thought out response. Care to explain to me how exactly you criminally punish an organization for sittng by while something like this occurs? Or are you in the party that believes because all the university did was sit by and try to cover up what happened they shouldn't be held accountable for their actions or lack there of.
In no way shape or form was I indicating that penalizing the university by stripping wins, scholarships, and fining the university did anything to provide "closure" for the victims. The monster is behind bars an honestly that isn't enough for what he did to those boys. All I'm saying is that I have no problem with a governing body (using the term loosely to as it pertains to the NCAA) handing down punishment and sanctions on a University in which high profile individuals stood by and tried to cover up any wrong doings.
hawkfan340
Well-Known Member
How do the sanctions punish anyone who actually committed any wrongdoing? Years later, that still makes no sense to me.
Edit: the vacated wins make some sense, I'm talking about the fine, scholarship reduction, and bowl ban.
Edit: the vacated wins make some sense, I'm talking about the fine, scholarship reduction, and bowl ban.
HawkeyeMike23
Banned
You let the legal system handle it by punishing the people involved. An organization that worries about how much cream cheese recruits can have on bagels doesn't have any power to get involved in situations like this, their own emails show they knew as much too.
hawkfan340
Well-Known Member
I would punish the people responsible.
There has to be penalties at the institutional level. PSU is being punished for the cover-up of a crime, not the crime itself. If there's no penalty, there's no deterrent. For example, they could hire a guy that's most likely to bend and break the rules and then just fire him if he gets caught. Rinse and repeat.
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kicker22
Well-Known Member
I agree that they may not punish any individual who "actually committed any wrong doing" but at the same time these individuals were not simply faceless individuals at PSU they were figureheads. While it may not do anything to punish them individually it punishes the institution that gave these individuals were the face of. Unfortunately the University as a whole benefitted from this being swept under the rug in terms of publicity and revenue and IMO impacting the future of the program is the only way to punish the institution as a whole.
I like the idea of the fines if it went toward awareness and organizations set up to assist future victims. The bowl and scholarship deduction were simply put in place to damage the program for years to come and establish a precedent.
I like the idea of the fines if it went toward awareness and organizations set up to assist future victims. The bowl and scholarship deduction were simply put in place to damage the program for years to come and establish a precedent.
HawkeyeMike23
Banned
Apparently you're just ignoring the fact that everyone involved in the cover up was fired and is either dead, in jail, or facing a grand jury indictment? That's not much of a deterrent compared to a vacated Alamo Bowl win I know, but it's still something.
