Nick Toon before McNutt????

[hogeye]

Reading comprehension fail.

I said "the following players drafted ahead of him had the same or slower 40 times..."

I didn't fail, I know exactly what it said and that's exactly my point. You are coming off as being critical about guys that had the SAME 40 time, that's ridiculous.

I then went on to point out that not all guys did all of the drills either and that in general it wasn't a fair overall response you were giving.

 

[olivecourt]

If you go read any of McNutt's evaluations without black and gold glasses on, it's pretty clear why he fell. Teams don't see him as a number 1, stretch the field-type receiver. They don't see him as a shifty slot guy. They don't see him as a second/third receiver that can also return kicks. Those all seem like reasonable evaluations to me.

So the knock on Marvin isn't that he's a bad receiver, by any stretch. It's just that he doesn't necessarily fit what teams see as their prototypical receiver needs. They're going to take chances on guys who they think could develop into those roles even if that didn't produce what McNutt did in college.

There's no conspiracy, anti-Iowa bias, or anti-Big Ten bias. I hope McNutt outplays his draft position, as many receivers have done before him. But I understand why he fell to where he did.

 

[DuffMan]

Reading comprehension fail.I said "the following players drafted ahead of him had the same or slower 40 times..."

I didn't fail, I know exactly what it said and that's exactly my point. You are coming off as being critical about guys that had the SAME 40 time, that's ridiculous. I then went on to point out that not all guys did all of the drills either and that in general it wasn't a fair overall response you were giving.

he's not comming off that way at all.

 

[hogeye]

he's not comming off that way at all.

You're right, calling players slower is a compliment.

 

[HomerChampless]

Comparing Toon's and McNutt's stats would be legitimate if they were being drafted for the same position..
Toon will be a TE and McNutt will be a slot receiver. Heck, to be successful in the NFL, maybe McNutt will eventually become a TE.

Using the stat comparison, Toon is an elite TE and McNutt is more of an average WR.

McNutt's stone fingers might have adversely effected his draft position. I say might have because Clayborn didn't drop after a poor sack season in 2010.

 

[Billso]

I didn't fail, I know exactly what it said and that's exactly my point. You are coming off as being critical about guys that had the SAME 40 time, that's ridiculous.

No, you totally failed, and now compound your fail by entirely missing the point of my post. Which was to point out McNutt IS NOT SLOWER than many of the draftees in front of him, and therefore speed was not the primary problem with his draft order, as claimed. I criticized no player, quite the opposite.

I then went on to point out that not all guys did all of the drills either and that in general it wasn't a fair overall response you were giving.

Irrelevant to my point that McNutt IS NOT SLOWER than many of the draftees in front of him. Still true even if the handful of guys who didn't do drills turned out to be faster.

 

[hogeye]

No, you totally failed, and now compound your fail by entirely missing the point of my post. Which was to point out McNutt IS NOT SLOWER than many of the draftees in front of him, and therefore speed was not the primary problem with his draft order, as claimed. I criticized no player, quite the opposite.

Fail, fail, fail...keep using this as a crutch. Again, I know what your point was, and my point was that it's being a bit disingenuous by not disclosing the fact that many athletes didn't participate in numerous drills. It's an incomplete result set and you utilized the word "all" when not all of them ran those drills. All probably ran the 40, that's about it.

Continue to deny this and you'll embody the word fail.

Irrelevant to my point that McNutt IS NOT SLOWER than many of the draftees in front of him. Still true even if the handful of guys who didn't do drills turned out to be faster.

I agree with you on the point that McNutt isn't significantly slower than the others drafted before him. Which gets back to my main point:

People have to remember that the draft isn't just about measurables, so taking the stats from the Combine and lining them up based on where people got drafted is a narrow-minded approach to evaluating it.

 

[Billso]

Yes, I would have been more precise to say "all of them who ran the shuttle had slower 20-yd-shuttle times (McNutt's was among the best at the combine)". But again, it's a secondary point that doesn't change the primary. You're just being an a-hole at this point, too proud or stupid to admit you're wrong.

I'll type this real slow so you can keep up:

I wrote ""the following players drafted ahead of him had the same or slower 40 times..."

You wrote "Toon and McNutt had the same 40 time, so that's being a bit disingenuous."

By the way, I completely agree measurables are overused. Not relevant to my post, but a nice attempt to change the topic away from your fail.

 

[hogeye]

Play the cut and paste game. Followed by the posting pictured quit being cool before it ever was game.

You were being disingenuous with stats and representation of the issue. And you deliberately avoid the main rebuttal, so I'll let all that stand on its own merits.

 

[Billso]

 

[hawkeyebob62]

If you go read any of McNutt's evaluations without black and gold glasses on, it's pretty clear why he fell. Teams don't see him as a number 1, stretch the field-type receiver. They don't see him as a shifty slot guy. They don't see him as a second/third receiver that can also return kicks. Those all seem like reasonable evaluations to me.

So the knock on Marvin isn't that he's a bad receiver, by any stretch. It's just that he doesn't necessarily fit what teams see as their prototypical receiver needs. They're going to take chances on guys who they think could develop into those roles even if that didn't produce what McNutt did in college.

There's no conspiracy, anti-Iowa bias, or anti-Big Ten bias. I hope McNutt outplays his draft position, as many receivers have done before him. But I understand why he fell to where he did.

Return kicks?! Who does THAT any more?

 

[clicheusername3]

Toon McNutt Butter