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HawkKing81 said:
...hasn't beat a team that finished the season ranked since 2001. (Iowa has 13 in that same time frame).

They lost to Iowa State last year, which was one of 4 losses. They lost a number of key defenders including the best defensive player in the country. They return a lot on a offense that wasn't very good.

So why are they being ranked so high this pre-season?

Granted they have one of the easiest schedules in the country, but isn't a reason why they should be ranked so high.

In my mind they are the most over-hyped and over-ranked team in the country.
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As our cyclone friends like to say "What does last year have to do with how we are going to do against you this year. Except if we win - then it does"

It could be based on trends 5-7 to 9-4 (with a couple of bad losses) to 10-4 (with one bad loss and 3 close calls, one to #2 team in country)
 
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I have no problem with the Nebraska love the media is giving out, I have bigger problems with the media that is picking Wisconsin ahead of Iowa in the Big 10. :mad:
 
I'm with JS on this. The Badger rankings are ridiculous. As for Nebraska, I think we want them to have a great season to give the conference more credibility. I'll be cheering them on this week.
 
huKSer said:
As our cyclone friends like to say "What does last year have to do with how we are going to do against you this year. Except if we win - then it does"

It could be based on trends 5-7 to 9-4 (with a couple of bad losses) to 10-4 (with one bad loss and 3 close calls, one to #2 team in country)
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I agree...Nebraska is trending in the right direction. That is good, but until you actually do something (like beat a team that finishes the season ranked), then I don't think you should be in the top 20.
 
The thing about preseason rankings is that they don't necessarily have to be earned to be correct.

If the rest of the defense can show that Suh didn't make them look better then they were, the Huskers will likely have a huge season.

Maybe preseason rankings should reflect which teams you think are truly better, but if I'm running a sports publication, I want my preseasonrankings to be as close to the end of season rankings as possible, so I factor in schedules.
 
Nebraska is definitely a top 20 and they kind of remind me of the Hawks coming into the season last year.

I look at Nebraska to be this years version of Iowa. Lets look back at the Hawks in 2008. They had some issues at QB to begin the year but were able to ride the legs of Shonn Greene Machine and a solid defense to a 9-4 record. They lost a number of close games but finally broke through by beating #3 Penn State and proceeded to win rest of they're games pretty decisively setting up some pretty high expectations for the next season. Or at least I had expectations anyway and pretty much expected Iowa to finish behind Ohio State assuming Hampton replaced some of Greene's production and that Stanzi took another step forward towards being a playmaker knowing that the defense was going to be solid. As it turns out Hampton got hurt, Stanzi took the step, and the defense was better then I could have imagined.

Now lets look at Nebraska's 2009. The rode a solid running game and great defense to a 10-3 record while not asking the new QB to do much. They had a couple tough loses to Virginia Tech (good) and Iowa State (not so good) but were super close to having their own breakthrough game against #2 Texas at the end of the season. Hell, if the pass rush wasn't so good on the last pass, time would have ran out and Nebraska would have won, but close only counts in horse shoes and hand grenades right. They did follow up that disappointment with a beatdown of Arizona which was a 2 or 3 heartbreaking (I'm talking about the Wash game, not Oregon) plays away from winning the PAC 10.

So what do they have this year? A still solid running game with a lot of the OL returning, a QB looking to take another step, and what looks to be a solid defense with an All Conference caliber player at 3 levels. Sounds pretty familiar right?
 
2009 Nebraska offense wasn't as good as the 2008 Iowa offense IMO.
Nebraska total offense 4522 yds vs. Iowa total offense 2008 4815 yds
Nebraska 36 TD's vs Iowa 46 TD's
 
I agree with that. I'm assuming Nebraska's offense takes another step forward and the defense doesn't drop off that much inspite of losing Suh. Kinda the opposite of the Hawks last year where overall the offense took a small step back but the defense took a step foward.
 
Living in NW Iowa we get it pretty bad living next to the Big Red delusion. We here abotu how they are a national power again. Even though they are 5-8 against team with a wiining record under Pelini.
 
Im not gonna say were NC bound this year. But give pelini a break about turning around a team going in the pooper. Maybe other coaches could of done the same maybe they could not of.

And as far if Iowa did what nebraska did last year and got a huge PRE season ranking. I wouldnt care because it will be handled and decided on the football field. Nebraska could tank there first 3 games and be out of the top 25. Case closed. Or could not and prove they belong up there. Iowa could do the same. But then again you could lose to iowa state. Heres the problem, its pre season and were all itchin for some football. It will come
 
BigRedPowrWagon said:
Im not gonna say were NC bound this year. But give pelini a break about turning around a team going in the pooper. Maybe other coaches could of done the same maybe they could not of.

And as far if Iowa did what nebraska did last year and got a huge PRE season ranking. I wouldnt care because it will be handled and decided on the football field. Nebraska could tank there first 3 games and be out of the top 25. Case closed. Or could not and prove they belong up there. Iowa could do the same. But then again you could lose to iowa state. Heres the problem, its pre season and were all itchin for some football. It will come
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If it truly did play itself out on the field 100 then I wouldn't care. But let's not be silly and pretend that preseason rankings don't play into the final rankings.

In past years people have given Boise St no chance of going to the NC game even if they ran the table...why?

If Boise St runs the table this year do you think they'll be in the NC game? Why?

If both Iowa and Texas had finished last season undefeated who would have gone to the NC game? Why?
 
HawkKing81 said:
...hasn't beat a team that finished the season ranked since 2001. (Iowa has 13 in that same time frame).

They lost to Iowa State last year, which was one of 4 losses. They lost a number of key defenders including the best defensive player in the country. They return a lot on a offense that wasn't very good.

So why are they being ranked so high this pre-season?

Granted they have one of the easiest schedules in the country, but isn't a reason why they should be ranked so high.

In my mind they are the most over-hyped and over-ranked team in the country.
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I tend to judge how a team is going to be the next year by looking at their bowl performance. Nebraska looked pretty good, I believe they shut out Arizona. But more than anything I think it's all the conference realignment hype that has them ranked higher than they should be.
 
tcnato93 said:
I tend to judge how a team is going to be the next year by looking at their bowl performance. Nebraska looked pretty good, I believe they shut out Arizona. But more than anything I think it's all the conference realignment hype that has them ranked higher than they should be.
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Mandel talks about how that's one of the reasons why some teams get a little too highly ranked, because of their bowl performances. He says,

"The one common thread you'll find in both cases (as with so many other preseason "flops") is that prognosticators got caught up in their impressive bowl performances the prior year (Georgia's Sugar Bowl demolition of Hawaii, Ole Miss' Cotton Bowl upset of 11-1 Texas Tech). Granted, it's much easier to reach that conclusion with the benefit of hindsight, but I can think of at least one soon-to-be preseason top 10 pick coming off what was, at the time, a very uncharacteristic bowl performance: Nebraska."

Read more: NCAA investigations linger on as season looms; more mail - Stewart Mandel - SI.com
 
HawkKing81 said:
Yes, you have been.

Rankings are to suggest from at the present point in the season. Predictions are how a team will finish a season.

There is a huge difference.
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HMMMM.... Your theory is great, but would make preseason rankings pretty hard, and since thats where all rankings start you have a problem on your hands
 
irvskyle said:
HMMMM.... Your theory is great, but would make preseason rankings pretty hard, and since thats where all rankings start you have a problem on your hands
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I'll try to explain this for you.

Preseason rankings differ from end of season only in that they are released before the season and not after it. The intent of rankings is to judge how good teams in a particular sport are relative to other teams in that same sport.

The criteria that can be used to judge each has to be different because in preseason rankings we don't have any games from that year to use; however, it would be ludicrous to suggest that in any ranking at any time in the season a person should rank a team based on the strength of their upcoming schedule.

Rather than telling me who you think is the better team you are telling me who you think has a better chance of winning future games - not the point.

Could you imagine after the regular season has been played saying - well Nebraska looks like a better team than Michigan St but I think Nebraska will lose to Texas in the Big 12 championship game so I'm going to rank Mich St higher?

It is largely irrelevant except for the fact that preseason rankings can end up determining who makes the National Championship Game and who doesn't...which is crazy considering those rankings are oftentimes predictions based on how easy a team's schedule is and not how good a team is.

As far as how difficult it would be to make this happen...I will suggest this...use the same criteria that is currently considered...but do not look at or consider the strength of schedule of the team.
 
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HawKCP said:
I'll try to explain this for you.

Preseason rankings differ from end of season only in that they are released before the season and not after it. The intent of rankings is to judge how good teams in a particular sport are relative to other teams in that same sport.

The criteria that can be used to judge each has to be different because in preseason rankings we don't have any games from that year to use; however, it would be ludicrous to suggest that in any ranking at any time in the season a person should rank a team based on the strength of their upcoming schedule.

Rather than telling me who you think is the better team you are telling me who you think has a better chance of winning future games - not the point.

Could you imagine after the regular season has been played saying - well Nebraska looks like a better team than Michigan St but I think Nebraska will lose to Texas in the Big 12 championship game so I'm going to rank Mich St higher?

It is largely irrelevant except for the fact that preseason rankings can end up determining who makes the National Championship Game and who doesn't...which is crazy considering those rankings are oftentimes predictions based on how easy a team's schedule is and not how good a team is.

As far as how difficult it would be to make this happen...I will suggest this...use the same criteria that is currently considered...but do not look at or consider the strength of schedule of the team.
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Phew...thanks, I owe you one. I didn't want to have to take the time to explain it, but you nailed it. I don't know that a lot of people understand the difference, even some voters!
 
Here's the thing though guys, you can't pre rank teams without PREDICTING who is better, its not possible
 
irvskyle said:
Here's the thing though guys, you can't pre rank teams without PREDICTING who is better, its not possible
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You're exactly right and missing the point...it's not the predicting that is the problem...it's the criteria that is being used to make the prediction. If you're predicting who is a better team then it would make absolutely no sense to use the schedule as one of your factors...if you're trying to predict who will have a better record then you would absolutely factor in strength of schedule.

So the question is what should preseason polls attempt to predict?
 
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