Morehouse Story On Unconscious Bias

[Ree4]

I would agree with the general consensus here regarding Dolph and that a simple apology would have been sufficient, if there had been a public outrage. From my understanding there wasn't - it feels like somebody was just looking for a reason to get rid of him (we all know who it was) and jumped on this opportunity.

 

[Fryowa]

Not trying to be the spelling police but it was actually "secession". But you're exactly right about the cause of the Civil War. Lincoln's election in 1860 was what was the spark for secession as they feared he would put an end to their slave-dominated culture and economy.

My bad.

 

[Robowe]

I like a lot of 80s movies. The quality goes noticeably down before that. If its black and white, I'm out.

70s movies you should try and watch:

- Godfather (1 and 2) (1972 and 1974)
- Dog Day Afternoon (1975)
- Kramer vs Kramer (1979)
- Jaws (1975) - my personal favorite
- One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest (1975)
- All The President's Men (1976)

There's more, but that will get you started.

 

[#1DieHardHawk]

I like a lot of 80s movies. The quality goes noticeably down before that. If its black and white, I'm out.

Not sure I see the logic of equating a movie's entertainment value with its age (good and bad movies are always being made, so that's a bit of a non sequitur), but, your welcome to your opinion.

In the context of this discussion, though, I would highly, and I mean HIGHLY recommend this movie:

 

[dirtwrap]

When you analyze the declaration of causes from each state, Slavery is the number one reason mentioned. In South Carolina for example, people claimed that cessation was because of taxes and tariffs when their declaration of causes didn't mention these at all. I'm not sifting through the other states but I know that many others are similar.

The "money" reason you mention is mainly regarding financial difficulty that people would incur if slavery is abolished. The reasons the war started hasn't been "changed", people just don't care enough to look beyond the surface. Hell I bet at least half the country doesn't even know when or what the Civil War was. We live in an uneducated society, people. While it wasn't the only reason for it, slavery and its' impact was easily the biggest reason.

To be clear, with respect to my #3 on page 1, I never said the slavery didn't have anything to do with the cause of the civil war. It absolutely is intertwined among all the reasons why the war started, such as states rights, taxation, etc. The reasons are very complex, has a lot to do with the cotton (which was much akin to today's oil) as it was the largest export for the United States and was the basis for the textile trade, the invention of the cotton gin, etc.

My point was that there are many, many reasons why the bloodiest war on our soil was fought and not just one idealistic reason that it was about slavery and that was it. I just want to see the textbooks reflect that, like they used to, not teaching our kids that there was only one reason. Otherwise, you have to answer the question when asked if the north and the british were both morally superior to the south and slavery, why did they buy the cotton that was picked by slaves when they knew full well it was. And why were their economies largely based off of the this blood product?

That was history. That was the day and time. Our landscape and technology which largely replaced the need for slaves is better today. I just dont agree with re-writing it.

 

[PCHawk]

Not sure I see the logic of equating a movie's entertainment value with its age (good and bad movies are always being made, so that's a bit of a non sequitur), but, your welcome to your opinion.

In the context of this discussion, though, I would highly, and I mean HIGHLY recommend this movie:

Movies have just gotten better over time with special effects and all that. I'm not saying old movies cant be good, but I just think it's far less likely they will be. They're produced differently too. I cant put my finger on it, but I know it when I see it. They pretty much look like low budget films I guess. I've never seen blazing saddles start to finish, but I know I would love it.

 

[Hawkfnntn]

From the article: "You go back to slavery times"

Sorry to break it to you Mr. Drustrup, but slavery still exists.

Mr Kraft could confirm that.

 

[Fryowa]

My point was that there are many, many reasons why the bloodiest war on our soil was fought and not just one idealistic reason that it was about slavery and that was it. I just want to see the textbooks reflect that, like they used to, not teaching our kids that there was only one reason.

Still no.

I asked you to give me one "reason" not tied to slavery to support your point and you haven't. You mentioned cotton and the invention of the cotton gin. You want to know what the cotton gin did? It increased the demand for slaves because it made production go through the roof. I'd like to hear your justifications for the CW that somehoe aren't because of the slave trade.

What you're failing to see here is that secession and the CW would have never happened if one of two things took place:

1) Slavery was abolished by both the North and South

2) Slavery was tolerated by the North.

I can't comprehend how you're so dense as to not see how the entire thing was based solely and purely on the existence of slavery and the threat of abolition. Jesus Christ.

Otherwise, you have to answer the question when asked if the north and the british were both morally superior to the south and slavery, why did they buy the cotton that was picked by slaves when they knew full well it was.

This one is just hilarious.

You're wearing a shirt and pants right now made by someone in a factory in Asia with no OSHA, no insurance or ability to buy it, working for hundredths of a penny on the American dollar. You have a phone in your pocket made by the same pseudo-slaves. The car you drive has gas in it, that came from oil that was sold by countries in the middle east where they kill people for being atheist or gay or female. Things were no different back then if we're going to use a moral yardstick. So would you say we should just accept those things going forward because they already happen?

Don't pull that weak ass argument out and try to fool anyone with it. What you did was say that "Since the North bought cotton from slave states, it's just as guilty as the South for promoting slavery." You're speaking in hyperbole and absolutes, and none of it holds any water.

The more you talk, the more you're letting on that you're either an apologist or you're not capable of critical thinking.

I'll still wait for your answer to my question.

 

[atomicblue224]

This has nothing to do with slavery, it has something to do with people acting superior to the disabled people. That's just my opinion. Let's go Hawks!

 

[dirtwrap]

Still no.

I asked you to give me one "reason" not tied to slavery to support your point and you haven't. You mentioned cotton and the invention of the cotton gin. You want to know what the cotton gin did? It increased the demand for slaves because it made production go through the roof. I'd like to hear your justifications for the CW that somehoe aren't because of the slave trade.

What you're failing to see here is that secession and the CW would have never happened if one of two things took place:

1) Slavery was abolished by both the North and South

2) Slavery was tolerated by the North.

I can't comprehend how you're so dense as to not see how the entire thing was based solely and purely on the existence of slavery and the threat of abolition. Jesus Christ.

This one is just hilarious.

You're wearing a shirt and pants right now made by someone in a factory in Asia with no OSHA, no insurance or ability to buy it, working for hundredths of a penny on the American dollar. You have a phone in your pocket made by the same pseudo-slaves. The car you drive has gas in it, that came from oil that was sold by countries in the middle east where they kill people for being atheist or gay or female. Things were no different back then if we're going to use a moral yardstick. So would you say we should just accept those things going forward because they already happen?

Don't pull that weak ass argument out and try to fool anyone with it. What you did was say that "Since the North bought cotton from slave states, it's just as guilty as the South for promoting slavery." You're speaking in hyperbole and absolutes, and none of it holds any water.

The more you talk, the more you're letting on that you're either an apologist or you're not capable of critical thinking.

I'll still wait for your answer to my question.

If you would read what I wrote you would understand I was agreeing with you. This is what I said:

It absolutely is intertwined among all the reasons why the war started,

However, at this time you seem to be extremely emotional about this subject and I do not have the interest in engaging with you like that. I could counter your statements like you are countering mine, but in the end we will get no where. So take away my #3, you win, and I am out. Feel better now?

 

[revkev73]

Yes, it's a good discussion, for the most part. It allows people to exchange viewpoints on a subject that is not cut and dried. Talking about things in a respectful manner is good. We learn things. We think.

I have not heard or read from one person that Dolphin should be fired for this. And if he is, it's bullshit.

I think there is a 1 in 5 chance he is back or perhaps worse, and if he is back he will have to make some tearful, brokedown confession and pledge to work for the NAACP for free for the rest of his life, or something. The goal is to shame him into leaving, I would guess. It is a type of public lynching. It is "understandable" and "unavoidable" unless it is you in the noose of course.

 

[skinnykilmer17]

Is it a "good thing"? IMO, it's only "good" when it's honest, forthright, factual, objective, and UNbiased. When we start inventing terms and code like "unconscious bias", we've pretty much lost honesty and objectivity, to say nothing of factual or forthright.

My guess is Doloh is done at U of I. As Jon and Deace's podcast title implied, the "wrong" Gary is gone.

Are you being serious? You believe unconscious bias is just a ficticious term? Fake news Bob?

Do you also believe we never landed on the moon and the earth is flat?

 

[WestCoastHawk]

This thread is making me lose faith in humanity.

Unconscious bias is real. It does not mean the person is racist, hates black people, etc. You just can't compare a black person to a gorilla even if it's a compliment. There is a lot of history there you just can't erase.

This was a great opportunity to start an open dialog and for people who have opinions either way to hear someone else's perspective. Instead Gary Barta suspended a guy and made this a way bigger deal than it needs to be and now that dialogue is lost and is all about someone's livelihood.

 

[hawkeyebob62]

Good movie but don't watch it if you're Italian. You might be offended.

To say nothing of Irish...

 

[hawkeyebob62]

Are you being serious? You believe unconscious bias is just a ficticious term? Fake news Bob?

Do you also believe we never landed on the moon and the earth is flat?

I know we landed on the moon. I also know "Unconscious Bias" is about as legit as "global warming...er...climate change!", especially of the "man-made variety".

Quit showing us how you're so "woke". It ain't a good look.

 

[hawkeyebob62]

This whole thing has been rather exhausting. I bet it's been even more exhausting for Fran & Barta. I say we just give them raises/extensions and call it a day.

^^ Gets it ^^

 

[Bigtenchamp]

Unconscious/implicit racism really equates to unconscious/implicit stereotypes. And this is a very real thing. A lot of our images of different cultures come from our media representation of cultures. Of course these representations have basis in reality but they are continually reinforced by the images we see every day. A lot of comedy, entertainment, literature is based of these cultural stereotypes.. I.E when Dave Chappelle is cracking our ass up with a lot of stereo typical racial characters. We often are not aware of these things because consciously we know they are incorrect.
Do I think GD should have gotten in trouble for what he said? F no... and our society actually at times reinforces the negative stereo types when they it thinks is protecting them. However I also find it funny when white people in this country try to equate comments made about them as being as worthy of offense as other ethnic groups. Again I think as a culture we are much to sensitive and the twittersphere is only making it worse, but racism is about power. A person could call me honky or cracker all day long and it would never bother me and it wouldn't bother 95% of anyone else either (if you are really being honest) because people that look like me have controlled everything that truly matters in this country and most likely will until the day if finally collapses. I had a cousin who couldn't get a job as a police officer in Los Angeles because he is white - does that feel uncomfortable as a society when that happens? Yes, but does it truly change anything with the power structure and who really, truly controls what matters? Hell no it doesn't. People with the power will never give it up, don't be fooled by those little games.

Anyways I'm starting to rant - Gary didn't mean anything offensive by his comment, but having a job where your voice projects so far - well if you say something that someone coudl take a certain way, you better have the foresight to know how your words could be used against you. Especially when Fran and Barta want to can your ass. I feel bad for Gary, but can't give those fuckers what they are looking for brother.

 

[Bigtenchamp]

I know we landed on the moon. I also know "Unconscious Bias" is about as legit as "global warming...er...climate change!", especially of the "man-made variety".

Quit showing us how you're so "woke". It ain't a good look.

/facepalm

 

[hawkeyebob62]

/facepalm

You a "woke" guy, too? Cool.

 

[TheIowaHawkGuy]

Here are Tweets in reply to Marc’s article from the father of ‘20 Oskaloosa big man Xavier Foster and his AAU program:

So long Xavier. Just don’t go to Iowa State please. The rich don’t need to get richer. That would be painful. That would be another blow to Fran.