Is Matt Painter all that special?

JonDMiller

JonDMiller

Publisher/Founder
I give the guy props for the success he has had at Purdue...but I am not sure he is some wunderkind or if that success will translate out of his home state.

He is from Muncie, Indiana. Played basketball at Purdue for Gene Keady. Had a nice run at Southern Illinois and has had some good teams at Purdue. However, I think Painter's 'rise' coincides with Indiana's fall.

E'twuan Moore was not a 'MUST GET' player coming out of HS. He turned out to be better than most expected, and he was from Illinois..so good job there. JuJuan Johnson and Robbie Hummel are likely players that as recently as six years ago, they go to Indiana. Hummel for sure.

Those three have been the heart and soul of this great run the past three/four years.

While I give him credit for getting Moore and helping him develop, I think a lot of his success has nothing to do with him, and much to do with the disaster that has befallen the Hoosiers...and I don't think he will all of the sudden make Missouri any better than they were under Mike Anderson. If I could choose between the two, I'd take Mike Anderson.
 
I think you have to give him props, especially given he's lost his teams best player (arguably) two years in a row and has had them compete at an elite level.
 
Yeah, he has done a good job, not saying that...11th place first year no worse than 4th since...not saying the guy is a schmuck...just wondering if he is worth $2mil a year and if he can duplicate his home state success elsewhere.
 
Even if a team in your state is down, you still have to put yourself in position to take advantage of it, and Painter has done that. (Compare Iowa State's inability to take advantage of Iowa's struggles, or vice versa). Painter has a 70% winning percentage at Purdue and he is 59-37 in conference play. That includes a 3-13 record and last place finish his first year. He's never made a deep NCAA run, but he's been to the sweet 16 twice and never lost a first round game. They've been top two in the conference for four years in a row, which is pretty amazing considering this year's injury to Hummel.

I think you make some great points about Painter, but he's definitely doing something right. I don't really see the Mizzou job as a step up, so if he takes it I think it's because he doesn't feel he has the Purdue administration's full commitment.
 
I don't really get this post. It's not like Indiana was a major player recently and then just fell off when he got the job. Indiana has been down since basically the mid 90's, they had a fluke title run in '02 and we're decent in Sampson's last year but that was about it. Indiana had already been missing on almost every big time in state recruit for a long time before Painter got the job. Also you do realize Mike Anderson was not fired right?
 
I agree that I think Painter is a little overrated... He's easily the best Mizzou is going to do if the rumors are true.
 
Yeah, I agree that if it's Mike Anderson or Matt Painter, you would probably take Mike Anderson. But that's not the choice Missouri gets to make.

They get to choose between Matt Painter and ...?

Who would you choose over Matt Painter, if you're Missouri?

Ben Jacobsen? No
Gregg Marshall? No
Steve Alford? No
Chris Collins? They already did the Duke assistant thing. Didn't work out
Brad Stevens? Won't come
Shaka Smart? Too short a resume to justify paying him what it would take

The question should be, what coach could Missouri get that would be better than Matt Painter?
 
JonDMiller said:
I give the guy props for the success he has had at Purdue...but I am not sure he is some wunderkind or if that success will translate out of his home state.

He is from Muncie, Indiana. Played basketball at Purdue for Gene Keady. Had a nice run at Southern Illinois and has had some good teams at Purdue. However, I think Painter's 'rise' coincides with Indiana's fall.

E'twuan Moore was not a 'MUST GET' player coming out of HS. He turned out to be better than most expected, and he was from Illinois..so good job there. JuJuan Johnson and Robbie Hummel are likely players that as recently as six years ago, they go to Indiana. Hummel for sure.

Those three have been the heart and soul of this great run the past three/four years.

While I give him credit for getting Moore and helping him develop, I think a lot of his success has nothing to do with him, and much to do with the disaster that has befallen the Hoosiers...and I don't think he will all of the sudden make Missouri any better than they were under Mike Anderson. If I could choose between the two, I'd take Mike Anderson.
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Dan Dakich has spread this mis-information about that 2007 Purdue class as he has made the case for Painter as COY. He kept saying that that class was not that highly rated.
According to RSCI(Composite rankings using top 6 services0 final rankings for the 2007 class:

Etwaun Moore- #23
Scott Martin- #41
JuJuan Johnson- #47
Robbie Hummel-#62

Moore was a very highly rated player,who I tracked since as a sophmore in HS,he named Iowa as his leader...SA was on him early.

So, Painter did hit the mother lode with this class,and it has carried him for 4 years at Purdue.
Now, that said, his recruiting since then has been underwhelming.
I think that is part of why he might be bailing to mizzou...his cupboard is fairly bare at Purdue. Crean is kicking his arse in Indiana the next two years,and Izzo stole the McDonalds AA forward out of Gary,In.,Dawson this year.
I think Painter is an energetic recruiter,but it is not an easy place to recruit to... tough academics,and not a sexy location or girls.
The trick in this coaching business is to jump at the right time,like Lick did.
If Mizzou is offering 7 years 14 million...and his wife is from St Louis,he will get a nice honeymoon period..plus is inheriting a stocked cupboard,in a new arena.
Is he a great coach? I think he is a very good coach,and can succeed at Missouri...depending on the definition of success. KU is still the gorilla in the league,with Texas always talented...

I think that from Mizzou's standpoint,he is a safe hire,who will get the max outta the talent he does get,and get them to the tourny more often than not.
 
JHHawk said:
Dan Dakich has spread this mis-information about that 2007 Purdue class as he has made the case for Painter as COY. He kept saying that that class was not that highly rated.
According to RSCI(Composite rankings using top 6 services0 final rankings for the 2007 class:

Etwaun Moore- #23
Scott Martin- #41
JuJuan Johnson- #47
Robbie Hummel-#62

Moore was a very highly rated player,who I tracked since as a sophmore in HS,he named Iowa as his leader...SA was on him early.

So, Painter did hit the mother lode with this class,and it has carried him for 4 years at Purdue.
Now, that said, his recruiting since then has been underwhelming.
I think that is part of why he might be bailing to mizzou...his cupboard is fairly bare at Purdue. Crean is kicking his arse in Indiana the next two years,and Izzo stole the McDonalds AA forward out of Gary,In.,Dawson this year.
I think Painter is an energetic recruiter,but it is not an easy place to recruit to... tough academics,and not a sexy location or girls.
The trick in this coaching business is to jump at the right time,like Lick did.
If Mizzou is offering 7 years 14 million...and his wife is from St Louis,he will get a nice honeymoon period..plus is inheriting a stocked cupboard,in a new arena.
Is he a great coach? I think he is a very good coach,and can succeed at Missouri...depending on the definition of success. KU is still the gorilla in the league,with Texas always talented...

I think that from Mizzou's standpoint,he is a safe hire,who will get the max outta the talent he does get,and get them to the tourny more often than not.
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Tremendous post...seriously.
 
This is kind of the Steve Fischer debate IMO. Was Fischer a great coach, or did he reap the benefits of having a freakish starting 5 that got recruited there by Juwan Howard?

The "for Painter" case can be made (IMO) by what he did with his first couple of teams post Keady. He had to start from scratch and although his teams were young and didn't have a ton of talent, they played their butts off and (if memory serves) lost to the even national champs FL with Kramer as a freshman and Landry, etc.

I agree to an extent about IU's decline corresponding with Purdue's rise, but both have been good, average and mediocre in the past. Kind of like saying Louisville and KY can't be good at the same time...lots of talent to go around. Based on the past few years, I certainly think he can keep the Boilermakers rolling, but will no doubt have a dropoff next season. He has the luxury of a home state with lots of D1 players, so it's not like he has to scour the ends of the earth like McCaffrey to round up players.
 
I have watched a lot of Purdue basketball games since my in-laws are from Indiana and are die-hard PU fans.

What he has done for Purdue was great, and also Hummel was always a Purdue fan, he wouldn't have gone to Indiana, even if they were amazing.

Moore was from E. Chicago, which is practically Indiana by the way, and this was Purdue's type of Fab 3 class. They lose Hummel 2 years in a row and still produce. He's a good coach.

Now, he loses his best players next year (though Hummel comes back) but he isn't bare shelved either, Purdue will be in the top half of the B10 next year if Painter stays. They have some good (not great) players.

I think Painter would be a good pickup for Mizzou.
 
JonDMiller said:
I give the guy props for the success he has had at Purdue...but I am not sure he is some wunderkind or if that success will translate out of his home state.

He is from Muncie, Indiana. Played basketball at Purdue for Gene Keady. Had a nice run at Southern Illinois and has had some good teams at Purdue. However, I think Painter's 'rise' coincides with Indiana's fall.

E'twuan Moore was not a 'MUST GET' player coming out of HS. He turned out to be better than most expected, and he was from Illinois..so good job there. JuJuan Johnson and Robbie Hummel are likely players that as recently as six years ago, they go to Indiana. Hummel for sure.

Those three have been the heart and soul of this great run the past three/four years.

While I give him credit for getting Moore and helping him develop, I think a lot of his success has nothing to do with him, and much to do with the disaster that has befallen the Hoosiers...and I don't think he will all of the sudden make Missouri any better than they were under Mike Anderson. If I could choose between the two, I'd take Mike Anderson.
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Wow, I strongly disagree with all of this. I would give anything to get him at Iowa. The dude is a very good coach.
 
ArizonaHawkeye88 said:
IU's decline has helped Butler as well as Purdue.
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Why? Who has Butler recruited that would have went to Indiana? Matt Howard? If anything, the fact that Indiana has declined would hurt Butler as now they would be in on some of the same type of players. Guys that Indiana never would have looked at before.
 
Special, I don't know... I think Painter has a lot on his side that make him an attractive candidate. He has youth on his side, has managed multiple D1 programs, came from a solid coaching tree, ran a clean program and has had relative success in the regular season.

I guess the question is who do you take that is a better candidate and is willing to change universities than Matt Painter?
 
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