Iowa everywhere

[BigD]

I came across this podcast tonight and found it interesting especially because Jon had the same opinion I expressed last year about APATHY in the fan base and what’s causing it.

Of course some of the “know it alls” on here disagreed with my comments and Pooh poohed it, but what the hell do Jon and I know. Some people under forty think they know the great mysteries of the world.

Then again that’s what makes sports forums what they are. So I try to be fair and consider all views even if mine is always correct, (just kidding). Some of you that have been on here long enough know I am not that way. Any ways here’s the link to there podcast.

Miller & Williams: Big weekend for basketball in Iowa

Chris Williams and Jon Miller break down the weekend's action from the Iowa men's loss to Illinois, Drake men and Iowa women winning conference titles, and t...

www.youtube.com

 

[PCHawk]

I came across this podcast tonight and found it interesting especially because Jon had the same opinion I expressed last year about APATHY in the fan base and what’s causing it.

Of course some of the “know it alls” on here disagreed with my comments and Pooh poohed it, but what the hell do Jon and I know. Some people under forty think they know the great mysteries of the world.

Then again that’s what makes sports forums what they are. So I try to be fair and consider all views even if mine is always correct, (just kidding). Some of you that have been on here long enough know I am not that way. Any ways here’s the link to there podcast.

Miller & Williams: Big weekend for basketball in Iowa

Chris Williams and Jon Miller break down the weekend's action from the Iowa men's loss to Illinois, Drake men and Iowa women winning conference titles, and t...

www.youtube.com

So I guess you found one out of state casual fan with the same opinion as yours.

 

[NorthKCHawk]

Setting aside how precisely accurate this take is, I don't think that it is debatable that attendance is pretty bad right now, NIL money is lagging, and there is not a lot of juice. This MBB board has been dead all year. It picked up over the last two weeks and as soon as we lost the Illinois game there were mostly crickets on here once again. No debating there is a problem.

Goetz needs to appoint a commission in the offseason to look for solutions for fan engagement and better game day experiences at Carver. Include students, coaches, players and boosters and have everyone sit down and come up with ideas for infusing more interest and excitement into the program. At least pretend to try and do something, Beth!

 

[InGoodCo]

I listened to this exact podcast and listen to all the Iowa Everywhere Iowa content. I think the Diesel (Jon) is spot on. No juice, no NIL, no crowd support but like, I don't know how much of that can be put on Fran. He's done his job. He's done it well. He routinely produces a great product with exciting players and good teams. Even in our down and rebuild years, we're a bubble team and there is a TON to be excited about with the future of the program. He's gone into the portal and found gems. I know he gets a lot shit about guard play, but towards the end of this year, Sandfort and Dix might have been one of the most leathel combo's in basketball in the month of February. People think that playing an extra game in March is just going to suddenly fix that, sure it couldn't hurt I guess but there's something way more fundamentally wrong here. If getting a new coach fixes it, I'm all for it...but like, I think the coach is the least of the worry here. We have a good one and frankly I like the team, the players, the coach, the assistant coaches - if I lived closer I'd be at more games, but driving 5 hours for a 2 hour game isn't really an option for me outside of a few times a year.

As Jon said here "If Fran comes back, Ok ....and if Fran moves on.... ok" - it's not really going to fix anything by getting rid of your winning coach. How would that fix Iowa basketball attendance?

 

[Hawkfnntn]

I listened to this exact podcast and listen to all the Iowa Everywhere Iowa content. I think the Diesel (Jon) is spot on. No juice, no NIL, no crowd support but like, I don't know how much of that can be put on Fran. He's done his job. He's done it well. He routinely produces a great product with exciting players and good teams. Even in our down and rebuild years, we're a bubble team and there is a TON to be excited about with the future of the program. He's gone into the portal and found gems. I know he gets a lot shit about guard play, but towards the end of this year, Sandfort and Dix might have been one of the most leathel combo's in basketball in the month of February. People think that playing an extra game in March is just going to suddenly fix that, sure it couldn't hurt I guess but there's something way more fundamentally wrong here. If getting a new coach fixes it, I'm all for it...but like, I think the coach is the least of the worry here. We have a good one and frankly I like the team, the players, the coach, the assistant coaches - if I lived closer I'd be at more games, but driving 5 hours for a 2 hour game isn't really an option for me outside of a few times a year.

As Jon said here "If Fran comes back, Ok ....and if Fran moves on.... ok" - it's not really going to fix anything by getting rid of your winning coach. How would that fix Iowa basketball attendance?

What a good way to put it. I would say I'm pretty much in that same boat. I thought they also said Frans contract goes till 2028 is that true? Obviously he's not going anywhere if he doesn't want to if so

 

[BigD]

I listened to this exact podcast and listen to all the Iowa Everywhere Iowa content. I think the Diesel (Jon) is spot on. No juice, no NIL, no crowd support but like, I don't know how much of that can be put on Fran. He's done his job. He's done it well. He routinely produces a great product with exciting players and good teams. Even in our down and rebuild years, we're a bubble team and there is a TON to be excited about with the future of the program. He's gone into the portal and found gems. I know he gets a lot shit about guard play, but towards the end of this year, Sandfort and Dix might have been one of the most leathel combo's in basketball in the month of February. People think that playing an extra game in March is just going to suddenly fix that, sure it couldn't hurt I guess but there's something way more fundamentally wrong here. If getting a new coach fixes it, I'm all for it...but like, I think the coach is the least of the worry here. We have a good one and frankly I like the team, the players, the coach, the assistant coaches - if I lived closer I'd be at more games, but driving 5 hours for a 2 hour game isn't really an option for me outside of a few times a year.

As Jon said here "If Fran comes back, Ok ....and if Fran moves on.... ok" - it's not really going to fix anything by getting rid of your winning coach. How would that fix Iowa basketball attendance?

There is no simple fix that is for sure. Just the thought of another Lickliter is enough to make anyone pause. However as Jon states there we a couple of teams in the past that should have been able to get past the the top 32 teams.

My only point is that the post season woes may be contributing to fan apathy in regards to game attendance. There have been a couple of posters who seemed to have disappeared on the forum during basketball season also. Others have commented that they are sitting out until something changes.

Two of you guys were right on cue. Predictable so. Apologist police. I was some what being sarcastic in a past post about how Fran could be here for a total of thirty years and never do crap in March that whole time and there would be apologists still supporting him.

There is nothing wrong with fans having expectations during March madness………… as long as it’s realistic. I don’t think one run in fourteen years in anyone’s mind is being unrealistic. Ok, maybe a few on here. Ok Margeret, Sons, and close friends, reveal your identities. Half kidding half not.

 

[NorthKCHawk]

There is not a colorable case to fire Fran. None. The only argument is a lack of Sweet 16 or better, but its not like Iowa had a rich history of that before Fran came. He has run a winning program and even in this, his biggest rebuilding year since Garza was a freshmen, and he is sitting on the bubble going into the conference tourney.

I agree that firing Fran will not fix MBB problems anyway. Imagine what the crowds and interest level were if Iowa had Michigan's record right now? Yikes.

Winning and star players help as we saw with Garza and the Murrays. But, even then, there was nothing compared to what CC's crowds have been. I think folks underestimate how much CC's success has hurt the men's team in terms of fan attendance and NIL. It was not great before she came along, but she has made it worse, and obviously, we are all fine with that seeing what she has done for women's athletics as a whole nationally. She has expanded the pie some, but also stole a few pieces from MBB.

Its not the coach or team or style. Its not even winning. Do you think if we made it to the Sweet 16 the men's home games would all be sold out next year? No way.

The stakeholders have to sit down and strip this down to the basics and figure out some fundamental changes to get the students back in the door and improve fan experience at Carver. Even though fan attendance is only one part of a program's success, it is the most visible part. If Carver was mostly full for most games, we would not be having this discussion. They need to get butts back in the seats and juice and NIL money will follow.

 

[InGoodCo]

The lack of a deep run in March means almost 0 to me, personally. I wouldn't trade the consistency that Iowa has had for the last decade for one more game in March on some rando season. I'd much rather a team that is consistenly getting there and giving themselves shots at making a run. That's my personal thought that I don't think many agree with.

 

[Gander Hawk]

If Fran is let go there's a very good chance all of his recent recruits will be hitting the portal, meaning a complete rebuild. Then the new coach can try to recruit players to a program with no players and no fans.

 

[InGoodCo]

If Fran is let go there's a very good chance all of his recent recruits will be hitting the portal, meaning a complete rebuild. Then the new coach can try to recruit players to a program with no players and no fans.

exactly! I don't think this goes well if Fran is just like suddenly done. There are natural times to make a coaching change, I don't know if that time is particularly now for Iowa, with how things are. We don't pay on the top end as far as coaching salaries, we have a lackluster NIL package, we are at about 6500 fans that 15,500 and have been to the NCAA 4 years in row and still have an outside shot of 5 years in row. Obviously, if you have a guy like Devries and he wants the gig, you'd be dumb not to listen, but if what Fran has done doesn't move the needle, I am guessing a whole rebuild right now isn't what is going to fix this, possibly the opposite.

 

[thedukeofearl]

If Fran is let go there's a very good chance all of his recent recruits will be hitting the portal, meaning a complete rebuild. Then the new coach can try to recruit players to a program with no players and no fans.

Yes a complete rebuild is what is needed

Now I'm gonna have to watch Young Frankenstein tonite

 

[SwirlinLingerie]

Setting aside how precisely accurate this take is, I don't think that it is debatable that attendance is pretty bad right now, NIL money is lagging, and there is not a lot of juice. This MBB board has been dead all year. It picked up over the last two weeks and as soon as we lost the Illinois game there were mostly crickets on here once again. No debating there is a problem.

Goetz needs to appoint a commission in the offseason to look for solutions for fan engagement and better game day experiences at Carver. Include students, coaches, players and boosters and have everyone sit down and come up with ideas for infusing more interest and excitement into the program. At least pretend to try and do something, Beth!

I'd boil it down to just this. Cater to them, get them there, and everything else will follow.

 

[trj]

There is not a colorable case to fire Fran. None. The only argument is a lack of Sweet 16 or better, but its not like Iowa had a rich history of that before Fran came. He has run a winning program and even in this, his biggest rebuilding year since Garza was a freshmen, and he is sitting on the bubble going into the conference tourney.

I agree that firing Fran will not fix MBB problems anyway. Imagine what the crowds and interest level were if Iowa had Michigan's record right now? Yikes.

Winning and star players help as we saw with Garza and the Murrays. But, even then, there was nothing compared to what CC's crowds have been. I think folks underestimate how much CC's success has hurt the men's team in terms of fan attendance and NIL. It was not great before she came along, but she has made it worse, and obviously, we are all fine with that seeing what she has done for women's athletics as a whole nationally. She has expanded the pie some, but also stole a few pieces from MBB.

Its not the coach or team or style. Its not even winning. Do you think if we made it to the Sweet 16 the men's home games would all be sold out next year? No way.

The stakeholders have to sit down and strip this down to the basics and figure out some fundamental changes to get the students back in the door and improve fan experience at Carver. Even though fan attendance is only one part of a program's success, it is the most visible part. If Carver was mostly full for most games, we would not be having this discussion. They need to get butts back in the seats and juice and NIL money will follow.

CC hasn’t taken any NIL money, at least this year. Are we going to cry about Molly Davis, Kate Martin or Gabby Marshall getting paid? Of course not, nor should we. We have had the same discussions over men’s basketball for the last 20+ years…what will change that?

 

[trj]

I'd boil it down to just this. Cater to them, get them there, and everything else will follow.

How do you do that without making it gimmicky? Free pizza slices only goes so far.

 

[#1DieHardHawk]

You can never pin something like this down to one game, but I still believe that the loss to Richmond was a major tipping point for a lot of the fan base. You could almost feel the enthusiasm for the program leak out with that loss. All tourney losses sting, but there was something about that one in particular that was a collective gut-punch, and we haven't recovered.

That said - poor performances in the tourney notwithstanding - Fran is not the sole issue here. Winning can cure a lot of ills, but things could be done to at least jump-start things somewhat, such as bringing the students courtside. Enthusiasm is hard to generate and maintain, especially when postseason success is lacking, but it's hard to envision significant improvement simply by changing the coaching staff. There's not going to be a quick easy fix.

 

[SwirlinLingerie]

How do you do that without making it gimmicky? Free pizza slices only goes so far.

A bunch of market research. Maybe it's the location of Carver. Maybe it's needing a huge student section around the court. Maybe it's a capacity of only half the current venue, with a loud yet intimate feel. Maybe it's all those things to get the students to pack the place.

 

[trj]

A bunch of market research. Maybe it's the location of Carver. Maybe it's needing a huge student section around the court. Maybe it's a capacity of only half the current venue, with a loud yet intimate feel. Maybe it's all those things to get the students to pack the place.

Carver isn’t going anywhere, anytime soon. I wouldn’t be surprised at all in the next 6 months Goetz will announce that a 50-100 million dollar renovation is coming. Capacity gets reduced from 15500 to 12500. Maybe they run back the Hawksnest, with the student section, that Alford tried to get going that fizzled out.

 

[NorthKCHawk]

CC hasn’t taken any NIL money, at least this year. Are we going to cry about Molly Davis, Kate Martin or Gabby Marshall getting paid? Of course not, nor should we. We have had the same discussions over men’s basketball for the last 20+ years…what will change that?

The more pressing thing that the women have siphoned away is general fan support and butts in the seats at games. There are only so many games fans can attend. It used to be WBB drew a 1,000 people. Now they draw 14,000. You will never convince me that this is not hurting men's attendance.

NIL for women has had a much lesser impact, I agree.

To be clear, this is by no means a dig at the ladies. Far from it. They deserve everything they can get in fan support and NIL. They are, in my view, a better product to watch and follow then the men right now. CC is wildly underpaid given what she has done financially for this conference and the NCAA and the TV partners. Wildly. Her teammates are underpaid too I am sure.

 

[trj]

The more pressing thing that the women have siphoned away is general fan support and butts in the seats at games. There are only so many games fans can attend. It used to be WBB drew a 1,000 people. Now they draw 14,000. You will never convince me that this is not hurting men's attendance.

NIL for women has had a much lesser impact, I agree.

To be clear, this is by no means a dig at the ladies. Far from it. They deserve everything they can get in fan support and NIL. They are, in my view, a better product to watch and follow then the men right now. CC is wildly underpaid given what she has done financially for this conference and the NCAA and the TV partners. Wildly. Her teammates are underpaid too I am sure.

It has hurt men’s attendance for about 2 years. The systemic issues with the men’s program have gone on for 20+ years I don’t even factor in the women’s program.

 

[Will C]

You can't explain the men's situation without acknowledging that the women are filling the seats. Win more games, get more attention.