If we are back, who dies?

If Iowa can be successful the next few years, more talented kids will start looking at Iowa. When Iowa signs some of these kids with the talent we now have, Iowa again becomes a player in the Big 10.

Even if the Big 10 teams that are now currently the top six continue to play good tough ball, adding Iowa and Indiana to that bunch of competitors is very good for the conference. All it does is add to the competition of the conference. Will teams knock each other off...you bet, but that is what makes all of this exciting. When a conference has very good teams, their RPI is high and more teams get invited.
 
DodgerHawki, that was a GREAT post.

Interesting perspective on how the other teams were performing when Iowa was a regular visitor to the tourney.
 
I didn't mean it as doom and gloom...

INTIMIDATORHawk said:
DodgerHawki, that was a GREAT post.

Interesting perspective on how the other teams were performing when Iowa was a regular visitor to the tourney.
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just an assessment of the situation. It is hard to believe how mediocre Michigan State and Ohio State were in the 1980s and how flat-out awful Wisconsin and Northwestern were. From 1968-69 through 1991-92, Wisky had only 4 seasons where they were over .500. And exactly 1, ONE TIME, where they had a record of over .500 in conference play, and that was in 1973-74. For the Wildcats, from 1969 to 1992-93 they had ONE winning season and NEVER had a conference record over .500. Highest conference finish in that time was 7th. From 17 seasons covering 1977 to 1994, NU was last or tied for last 14 times.

The sleeping giants of Wisconsin and OSU were just awaiting to be awoken with the right coaches and support of administration. MSU obviously had a national title under Heathcote, but the '80s for the Spartans were only a bit better than the 2000s were for the Hawkeyes before they turned it around in Heathcote's final years.

Iowa has monstrous obstacles to overcome to compete in the upper half of the B1G consistently. In terms of recruiting base and facilities, we have an advantage over Northwestern, and maybe Penn State. Everyone else is in a state that produces WAY more B1G-caliber players than Iowa does annually.

It doesn't mean that things can't change. Purdue wasn't good in the final Keady years/early Painter years. Wisky has been very good, but is it their program that is that good or is Bo Ryan just that good? We'll find out whenever Ryan calls it quits. MSU is a plum job with great recruiting grounds, but one need to look no further than Indiana to see that a bad coach can tank even a good program. Sparty will be good/very good as long as Izzo is around. But we need to realize that Iowa could field a good team in coming years and finish 7th in a given year.
 
Ohio State and Michigan State are the elite of the Big Ten and you might put Wisconsin in that catagory. I think Iowa could jump over Illinois, Minnesota, Michigan, and possibly Purdue. But unless Crean is really that bad of a coach it will be difficult to keep Indiana down so they might climb up the conference ladder along with Iowa.

Here is what I hope happens:

2012 - 16 to 18 wins (7 or 8 conference) with postseason berth
2013 - Get to 20 wins and bubble NCAA Bid (.500 record in conference)
2014 - Top 4 finish in conference 23-25 wins, NCAA Tournament
2015 - Top 2-4 in conference, NCAA Bid, possible sweet 16
2016 - Competing for Big Ten Championship, regular season and tournament. Deep run in NCAA Tournament.

I think these are realistic expectations assuming Woodbury or Gesell do not leave for the NBA early and can avoid significant injuries.
 
Dodger, I have experienced the past several decades (more than I care to admit) of Big Ten basketball as well and I fully understand what your are preaching. But I have a lot of faith in this coaching staff and have seen what they have been able to accomplish in such a short period of time and it has raised my expectations. Personally, I hope they exceed the goals set by the past Hawkeyes (NCAA tournament: 1st round win/2nd round exit). One factor that you didn't mention when discussing the differences that exist now is the level of HS basketball talent in Iowa, which has exploded this past decade. There is a strong local base to build a program on, plus Coach McCaffery has proven to be a nationwide diviner of talent with a penchant for finding diamonds in the rough. That recruiting acumen coupled with the ability to actually coach these players, both in practice and within the framework of the actual games, just might be a deadly combination that we haven't seen for a long time here at Iowa. At least that is my hope.
 
ssckelley said:
You really think the state of Iowa can keep delivering that kind of talent year over year?
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I think the state could average 2-3 Top 150 types each year. Keep in mind, I said average, not 2-3 every single year. Probably a Top 50 kid every other year and a top 20 occasionally. Keep them in state, with ISU-Iowa splitting them, then adding in out of state kids and there's no reason Iowa couldn't get back to consistent upper division finishes with semi-regular top 2-4 B1G finishes. I also don't see any reason that can't/won't start as soon as next season.
 
We are so back that we will be selected first, then no other teams will be invited. They will do away with automatic qualifiers, except for one team..........WE ARE SO BACK.
 
1hawkeye1 said:
We are so back that we will be selected first, then no other teams will be invited. They will do away with automatic qualifiers, except for one team..........WE ARE SO BACK.
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Crap like this is getting old. It was funny for, maybe, the first couple of hours but now it is getting stupid.
 
ssckelley said:
Crap like this is getting old. It was funny for, maybe, the first couple of hours but now it is getting stupid.
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Agree. One KOK is too many,now we have a dozen.


I think that with MSU and OSU firmly established at the top, and hopefully, PSU,Neb,NW all firmly established at the bottom ,the other 7 in the middle will include Iowa every year. that means at worst,Iowa is 8th,and making the NIT and at best,Iowa is in the top 3 and getting good seeds to the NCAA. Iowa makes the NCAA 2 of every 3 years or at least every other year.

I think fortunes for the teams in the middle will rise and fall year to year,but normally,that top 8-9 will be static.
In good years for the league 7-8 will make the dance.
I do think that IU could break the stranglehold that MSU and OSU have on the top. I think Wisky could drop down,Minny should drop down,and Purdue will not be consistently at the top. There is room for Iowa to get in the middle of that pack,which would be great improvement over recent times.
 
Yes, the Iowa talent is improving...

MisterLucky said:
Dodger, I have experienced the past several decades (more than I care to admit) of Big Ten basketball as well and I fully understand what your are preaching. But I have a lot of faith in this coaching staff and have seen what they have been able to accomplish in such a short period of time and it has raised my expectations. Personally, I hope they exceed the goals set by the past Hawkeyes (NCAA tournament: 1st round win/2nd round exit). One factor that you didn't mention when discussing the differences that exist now is the level of HS basketball talent in Iowa, which has exploded this past decade. There is a strong local base to build a program on, plus Coach McCaffery has proven to be a nationwide diviner of talent with a penchant for finding diamonds in the rough. That recruiting acumen coupled with the ability to actually coach these players, both in practice and within the framework of the actual games, just might be a deadly combination that we haven't seen for a long time here at Iowa. At least that is my hope.
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no doubt. But it's not as if the states with a lot of people have just stopped producing quality players. The Woodbury/Gessell/Paige class is being heralded as its the first Iowa class since Horner/Brunner/Haluska to produce 3 Top 100 guys in the same class. Horner/Brunner/Haluska were in what, 2001? So once every 11 years Iowa produces 3 Top 100 players? That would be a low amount for Illinois, Indiana, Michigan, Ohio on an ANNUAL basis. Those are who we are competing against.

At this point, I would be thrilled to see Iowa in the tournament on a regular basis. If you do that, sooner or late the Hawks will break through with a deep run.
 
Iowa can jump a lot of teams when it comes down to it. There is going to be a ton of experience back when the four freshman hit campus. There will be potentially three starters returning Marble/Basabe/Olaseni, not to mention a solid bench with White/McCabe/Oglesby. Think about the front line combinations Iowa could have with that group. Iowa will have potentially one of the best frontcourts in the BIG, with Basabe primed for a huge season.
PSU/NW/Neb/Minn/Purdue are all teams that Iowa could begin to pass as this class gets to campus with the current returning players and what the 2013 class adds. Iowa still has holes, but no gaping ones as there were heading into this Summer. I don't see Wisconsin slipping so long as Bo Ryan is there. MSU, while they continue to sign top players on paper, are doomed for a fall of some sort. Sparty is beginning to have a lot of roster turmoil that you just didn't see before. For whatever reason, the players at MSU seem to respond less to Izzo's antics of late. OSU will continue to be good, they just have to recruit OH and they will be fine with all the talent in the state. Michigan was the sleeping giant, look at their 2013 class...uh yeah, they are really getting quality players. There is zero reason why Michigan fell to the level they did, even with all the NCAA issues...bad hires have led to that as well. Indiana is going to be a quality program after their 2012 class is added to Cody Zeller. Zeller will not be able to fully show what he is capable of until then, there will need to be more pieces around him and he will be a force.
 
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