hawks263344
Well-Known Member
No, it just isn't fun to watch. I care about more than just wins.
If the result was different, would you like the "system"?
- Thread starter tweeterhawk
- Start date
JonDMiller
Publisher/Founder
A good question
however I don't think we have seen what lickliter wants his system to look like at iowa, yet
so what we have seen is him doing what he feels he needs to do now to give himself the b est chance to win with the talent he has on hand
however, if I believed this were the system and it was as successful ad say Bo Ryan and their methodical, defensive, mistake free swing offense, yes I'd take it
trj
Well-Known Member
Put me in the category of it is about the 'W'(s).
The '05-06' team was a defensive minded team that kept the score in the 50's and 60's. I enjoyed watching them play. I guess the milllion dollar question is: will the likes of payne, cougill, gatens, May.......turnout anything remotely close to Brunner, Horner, Hansen, Haluska and company.
If the answer is yes, then I will buy into the "system".
The '05-06' team was a defensive minded team that kept the score in the 50's and 60's. I enjoyed watching them play. I guess the milllion dollar question is: will the likes of payne, cougill, gatens, May.......turnout anything remotely close to Brunner, Horner, Hansen, Haluska and company.
If the answer is yes, then I will buy into the "system".
HawkeyeNTexas
Well-Known Member
This high block screen with everyone else standing around offense does not give them a chance to win. Answer me this. Why do they continue to try the top of the block/key screen when it doesn't work? It's pointless.
JonDMiller
Publisher/Founder
Perhaps Todd is running the schemes he wants to run when he has more of a complete cupboard....such as Kirk Ferentz not wanting to go the Juco route when he got to Iowa, because he didnt want to do it later in his career. Doing things now that you want to do in the future so that you dont have to change things up for the veteran players when some young kids come in and you gain some continuity
NewMexHawk
Well-Known Member
No, I have said this before. I hate big lick's system even more after today's game.
Big lick plays this style simply because he does not have the athletes to play a team man up and play all aspects of bb, including fast breaks and occasional up tempo game. All one had to do was compare the players between the two teams today. Big lick plays slowww ball because he has to ...THAT is the only way Iowa will ever compete in the Big 10 with big lick at the helm...the only way. That and that is the only way the man knows how because he has never had players to play any other form of bb.
If some of you enjoy this style of slowwww ball, more power to you I guess. But I don't, it is pretty simple. Playing a style of ball where you base your game on shooting half of your shots from the 3-point line is basterdizing the game of bb. BB is meant to be played using all aspects of the game, not stacking it where you are forced to shoot 3's because you have to, because you are unable to recruit the talent necessary to play other teams man up and that is what Lick ball is all about....playing slowwww down possession ball so that more talented teams get less shots.
That is what Iowa bb is these days...it is called keepaway ball in simple terms. And that is exactly what they tried to do with OSU today...keep the ball away from them so they couldn't score. So Iowa tries to keep the scores in the 40s and 50s (similar to the 1950s). If there wasn't a time clock, big lick would hold the ball even longer, minutes at a time if he could. Big lick would never let the other team have the ball if he could...thank god for the time clock.
There were so many times today when Iowa had nice open shots but did not take the shot, instead of opting to hold the ball for another 15 to 20 seconds and then not getting a decent shot, a shot at all, or they turned the ball over. But that is what big lick wants...HOLD THE BALL...keep away bb...keep the possessions down...slowwww the game down....boring boring boring boring bb. So the longer Iowa holds the ball, the other team starts playing tougher defense...they KNOW we are going to hold the ball...that we will not take early shots or big lick will chew out the players. So the opponents play off a little and pick up the players the last 10 or 12 seconds and really play tough making it more difficult to get a good shot...and it works well.
Then when the other team goes on a run and gets up by 10 or 12, Iowa is basically screwed, blued, and tattooed because big lick still wants them to play slowwww ball...they have to. If they try to speed up at that point, they get run out of the gym because big Lick knows they can't man up with the better teams so continue to play slowwww ball. If Iowa tries to pick up the pace, they no longer no how and they get completely out of sync and get really sloppy and the game usually gets completely away from them. That is one of the dangers of playing only ONE style of ball. You better hope you play well the entire game and stay within a few points the entire game because if you have to change your style you can't.
It looks like Iowa is in the game when they are 10 or 12 down but the other team is in control all the way because Iowa cannot catch up because we don't get quick easy baskets....ahhh, but the other teams continue to do so, so they go on more runs than Iowa.
Like I said, I hate this style of ball but it doesn't matter. big lick will never be more than a .500 coach in the Big 10 even with his most experienced players. The guy is so far in over his head it isn't funny. He is a mid major coach trying to coach a Big 10 team like a mid major team in the big 10 conference.
But for some that will be ok I suspect because that will be an improvement and that is all some are asking for....just a competetive Iowa team. If they make the tournament every now and then that will be ok (NIT or NCAA--it doesn't matter), many Iowa fans will be happy as clams because there will always be that wonderful next year that they can count on. Most of you don't even expect Iowa to compete for a Big 10 championship or the top three or four anymore...your expectations are so low that big lick fits the bill perfectly for you guys.
He is the perfect coach...a .500 coach but he does it the right way and everyone else cheats. big lick has lowered your expectations SO MUCH that he can do about anything now and you will love him...
Big lick plays this style simply because he does not have the athletes to play a team man up and play all aspects of bb, including fast breaks and occasional up tempo game. All one had to do was compare the players between the two teams today. Big lick plays slowww ball because he has to ...THAT is the only way Iowa will ever compete in the Big 10 with big lick at the helm...the only way. That and that is the only way the man knows how because he has never had players to play any other form of bb.
If some of you enjoy this style of slowwww ball, more power to you I guess. But I don't, it is pretty simple. Playing a style of ball where you base your game on shooting half of your shots from the 3-point line is basterdizing the game of bb. BB is meant to be played using all aspects of the game, not stacking it where you are forced to shoot 3's because you have to, because you are unable to recruit the talent necessary to play other teams man up and that is what Lick ball is all about....playing slowwww down possession ball so that more talented teams get less shots.
That is what Iowa bb is these days...it is called keepaway ball in simple terms. And that is exactly what they tried to do with OSU today...keep the ball away from them so they couldn't score. So Iowa tries to keep the scores in the 40s and 50s (similar to the 1950s). If there wasn't a time clock, big lick would hold the ball even longer, minutes at a time if he could. Big lick would never let the other team have the ball if he could...thank god for the time clock.
There were so many times today when Iowa had nice open shots but did not take the shot, instead of opting to hold the ball for another 15 to 20 seconds and then not getting a decent shot, a shot at all, or they turned the ball over. But that is what big lick wants...HOLD THE BALL...keep away bb...keep the possessions down...slowwww the game down....boring boring boring boring bb. So the longer Iowa holds the ball, the other team starts playing tougher defense...they KNOW we are going to hold the ball...that we will not take early shots or big lick will chew out the players. So the opponents play off a little and pick up the players the last 10 or 12 seconds and really play tough making it more difficult to get a good shot...and it works well.
Then when the other team goes on a run and gets up by 10 or 12, Iowa is basically screwed, blued, and tattooed because big lick still wants them to play slowwww ball...they have to. If they try to speed up at that point, they get run out of the gym because big Lick knows they can't man up with the better teams so continue to play slowwww ball. If Iowa tries to pick up the pace, they no longer no how and they get completely out of sync and get really sloppy and the game usually gets completely away from them. That is one of the dangers of playing only ONE style of ball. You better hope you play well the entire game and stay within a few points the entire game because if you have to change your style you can't.
It looks like Iowa is in the game when they are 10 or 12 down but the other team is in control all the way because Iowa cannot catch up because we don't get quick easy baskets....ahhh, but the other teams continue to do so, so they go on more runs than Iowa.
Like I said, I hate this style of ball but it doesn't matter. big lick will never be more than a .500 coach in the Big 10 even with his most experienced players. The guy is so far in over his head it isn't funny. He is a mid major coach trying to coach a Big 10 team like a mid major team in the big 10 conference.
But for some that will be ok I suspect because that will be an improvement and that is all some are asking for....just a competetive Iowa team. If they make the tournament every now and then that will be ok (NIT or NCAA--it doesn't matter), many Iowa fans will be happy as clams because there will always be that wonderful next year that they can count on. Most of you don't even expect Iowa to compete for a Big 10 championship or the top three or four anymore...your expectations are so low that big lick fits the bill perfectly for you guys.
He is the perfect coach...a .500 coach but he does it the right way and everyone else cheats. big lick has lowered your expectations SO MUCH that he can do about anything now and you will love him...
clicheusername3
Banned
I have said this many times before. Playing with style matters. Basketball is my favorite sport and I don't like to see it played in a disrespectful way. I don't care if we were undefeated this year I would still want the style changed.
I guess I see the offense get about as many plays out of it as other offenses. We just can't go beyond the offense with opportunity and urgency, rebounding or ball control.
That said, looks to me like we could use some weak side back door cuts or something. Lot of attention on 1/3 to 1/2 the court. Make 'em play the whole court.
That said, looks to me like we could use some weak side back door cuts or something. Lot of attention on 1/3 to 1/2 the court. Make 'em play the whole court.
Frankly I don't get the "boring" thing. When our offense was running reasonably well in the first half of today's game, and we were getting good shots both inside and outside, I was enjoying the game. I figured the second half would be different, and unfortunately it was. But there are not many teams with the talent, inclination, and conditioning to run constantly. I loved watching Jordan and Pippen run the fast break with the Bulls when they were in their prime, but that's not a fair comparison. I hated the constant pressing under Mr. Davis, and found the Alford offense to be more boring by far than what we are seeing today. When the wins start to come, I doubt we'll hear anything at all about how we are getting them. By the way, how about May's dunk from along the right baseline on the breakaway? That was some Jordanesque hang time. Keep this kid healthy, and the future will look a lot brighter. Gatens will be back with a vengance too once his ankle is 100%. Payne did a nice job of getting inside (not to forget Lickliter's sweet reverse layup) today, no small task against a bigger and more experienced OSU team.
Re: If the result was different, would you like the "system"?
Fair enough.
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tm3308
Well-Known Member
Then you've got some serious issues. That comment makes you seem like the type of "fan" who simply lives to b*tch and moan. If we can win with this system (and I really do think that we aren't very far from that), you still wouldn't be excited because we don't play the fast paced game like Kentucky or Carolina? Seriously? Give me a break.
I'll like any system that wins games, and I think this one can. We just need a couple more guys who can execute it.
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I agree with Jon M., we haven't seen Lick's full system yet, he hasn't had the talent. Look at MCDermott at ISU, he used to run a deliberate system at UNI it worked, now he's tried to change to a more uptempo system to attract better recruits, he has more talent this year, but still not winning.
At UNI McDermott ran 95% sets and he has changed his style. Lick needs to adapt to win not try to force a "system". While I think his offense has some merit I don't think you can use it exlusively to win. Especially just using ball screens, because team now a days can defend the high ball screens rather effectively.
With that said, if we were winning I would be tolerable of the system but I wouldn't enjoy it. Winning ugly is better than any loss.
ForeverHawk
Well-Known Member
People can say anything they want when times are bad. But no way there is anyone questioning Lick or the system, or the style if Iowa were winning games and leading the big 10!
clicheusername3
Banned
This may be your lamest post ever. You can't just shift reality to help your arguments. No way you can say that because in reality Iowa is at the bottom, not the top. You can't just ignore a problem and wish and hope that it will get better without really addressing any of the things that are causing the problems.
Not true. We have won a lot in football the past two years but people still want O'Keefe out. When the team wins most people won't get so negative about it but they still have that same opinion. (and I for one am not against O'Keefe).
NewMexHawk
Well-Known Member
And when we were down by 10 or 12 did any of you ever really think that Iowa was going to make a run a catch up? Or did you think as I did, if Iowa makes a run of some kind playing the deliberate offense we play, OSU will make a quick short burst and be back up by 7 or 10 again no problem. We don't fast break or even try...well Payne tried that one time and Gatens did when he was wide open. Other than that Iowa will NOT under any circumstances speed up the game. Teams know that and can play accordingly.
OSU came out and put tremendous pressure on Iowa, went up by 7 to 9 and that is the way the 2nd half remained. Once OSU got up, I never once thought Iowa would or could come back playing the type of ball we play. Not once.
Once OSU was up by 7 to 10 points it was a matter of keeping them at that range and not letting the score get out of hand. That is where Iowa is right now.
Iowa is a one-half team. We are just good enough now to keep the other team from blowing us out by 20 to 25. But once a team has us by 7 to 10 the game is pretty much over although we make the team continue to work. They no longer can put the end of the bench in for 8 minutes.
OSU came out and put tremendous pressure on Iowa, went up by 7 to 9 and that is the way the 2nd half remained. Once OSU got up, I never once thought Iowa would or could come back playing the type of ball we play. Not once.
Once OSU was up by 7 to 10 points it was a matter of keeping them at that range and not letting the score get out of hand. That is where Iowa is right now.
Iowa is a one-half team. We are just good enough now to keep the other team from blowing us out by 20 to 25. But once a team has us by 7 to 10 the game is pretty much over although we make the team continue to work. They no longer can put the end of the bench in for 8 minutes.
