Howe: Big Ten Hoops Power Rankings 1-14

lightning1 said:
I'm not saying that. I'm saying that the BIG is unpredictable, Iowa included. If we keep playing defense like we are, we'll be in most every game. That's the goal, IMO. Coming off of last season, being in every game at the end, is a huge improvement.
That doesn't mean I am backing off of wanting a new coach. I still do. I don't think Fran will ever accomplish anything at Iowa. Gutless Gary has made sure that Fran has ample opportunity to prove me wrong.
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Road teams are actually holding their own. And I thought Wisconsin was going to steal another one at Maryland last night. Wisconsin, in the last two real possessions of the game, had a critical breakdown on the defensive end and couldn't execute on the offensive end and that was the difference. Bo Ryan coached teams usually executed in those spots and usually won those games which is why they were always in the top tier of the conference at the end of the year.
 
WindsorHawk said:
I still don't know why more teams aren't hacking Happ. He should never be allowed to make a shot inside of 5 feet. Barring foul trouble send him to the line 10 times IMO.
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Purdue did in Madison Friday night. Watched the second half. His bricks sent the game to OT where Purdue prevailed.
 
RobHowe said:
Define what not accomplishing anything at Iowa means.
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Speaking for myself this program, over a three decade sample size, has failed to accomplish what the previous three decades did. Start with the Carl Cain/Don Nelson years, proceed to Ralph Miller's 1970 team, Lute from 1979-83, and Davis from 1987-89. There are several peaks listed there that haven't been duplicated since. Conference championships. Final four runs.

This program, based off that history, is capable of occasionally competing for conference championships and making deep tourney runs. It has gone a long time without doing either.
 
Northside Hawk said:
Speaking for myself this program, over a three decade sample size, has failed to accomplish what the previous three decades did. Start with the Carl Cain/Don Nelson years, proceed to Ralph Miller's 1970 team, Lute from 1979-83, and Davis from 1987-89. There are several peaks listed there that haven't been duplicated since. Conference championships. Final four runs.

This program, based off that history, is capable of occasionally competing for conference championships and making deep tourney runs. It has gone a long time without doing either.
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Iowa should be able to compete for conference titles and consistent NCAA appearances, no doubt about it. I just don't like the comparisons of today's culture/environment to the 70s/80s or even 90s. The landscape has changed drastically from those days...see nebraska football.
 
Iowa was 12-6 in the Big Ten for the '14-15 and '15-16 season and tied for third in the league both years. He was at least .500 in the league for five years in a row before last season.

The Hawkeyes last won a regular-season championship 40 years ago! Many on here weren't even born yet.

Has Fran been great? No. But he's much better than Lick and more consistent than Alford, while being a better human, which I guess isn't saying much.

Fran is not great. But he's produced all-Big Ten players from under-recruited players and reached three NCAA Tournaments and was the first team out two years ago.

The buyout Barta gave him was batshit crazy. Same with the one Ferentz got. I'll never understand why Barta did it. He'll probably take it to his grave.

But to say Fran hasn't accomplished anything here is a myopic view. Iowa has made the Sweet 16 once ('99) since '88. It's not like he's coaching at a college basketball power.
 
Interesting fact. Rutgers has as many final four appearances in the past fifty years as Iowa had. Dick Vitale, as he has reminded us approximately 4,000 times, recruited the nucleus of that 1976 Rutgers team when he was an assistant coach there from 1971-73.
 
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RobHowe said:
Iowa was 12-6 in the Big Ten for the '14-15 and '15-16 season and tied for third in the league both years. He was at least .500 in the league for five years in a row before last season.

The Hawkeyes last won a regular-season championship 40 years ago! Many on here weren't even born yet.

Has Fran been great? No. But he's much better than Lick and more consistent than Alford, while being a better human, which I guess isn't saying much.

Fran is not great. But he's produced all-Big Ten players from under-recruited players and reached three NCAA Tournaments and was the first team out two years ago.

The buyout Barta gave him was batshit crazy. Same with the one Ferentz got. I'll never understand why Barta did it. He'll probably take it to his grave.

But to say Fran hasn't accomplished anything here is a myopic view. Iowa has made the Sweet 16 once ('99) since '88. It's not like he's coaching at a college basketball power.
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Yes. 40 years! I want the BIG title. A coach should get no more than 8 years to produce one. If he can't, I want to find one that can. Pointing to past failures as a reason to forego future success is a losers attitude. I want no part of the idea "it can't be done"...because I've seen too many other programs do it.
I don't trust Gutless Gary to mow my lawn, much less find and hire a BIG title capable basketball coach. As to why he did what he did with those buyouts?
A) He's getting some sort of illegal kick back.
B) A fool and his money are soon parted.
 
Just my take:

1. Michigan St.
2. Michigan
3. Maryland
4. Minnesota
5. Iowa (Kiss of Death)
6. Nebraska
7. Indiana
8. Purdue (yeah, I know)
9. Ohio St.
10. Wisconsin
11. Penn St.
12. N'west
13. Rutgers
14. Illinois
 
mopkins said:
Iowa should be able to compete for conference titles and consistent NCAA appearances, no doubt about it. I just don't like the comparisons of today's culture/environment to the 70s/80s or even 90s. The landscape has changed drastically from those days...see nebraska football.
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The Iowa landscape certainly has. I'm going to make an educated guess that the players Ralph, Lute and George Raveling recruited from the sixties through the eighties would not be as easy to get into Iowa today because it's not what the boosters, bluehairs, and administration prefer. When Roy Williams started raiding our state because Davis was too lazy to find places like Monona, Iowa on the map it put major pressure on Bowlsby to take notice.
 
RobHowe said:
Iowa was 12-6 in the Big Ten for the '14-15 and '15-16 season and tied for third in the league both years. He was at least .500 in the league for five years in a row before last season.

The Hawkeyes last won a regular-season championship 40 years ago! Many on here weren't even born yet.

Has Fran been great? No. But he's much better than Lick and more consistent than Alford, while being a better human, which I guess isn't saying much.

Fran is not great. But he's produced all-Big Ten players from under-recruited players and reached three NCAA Tournaments and was the first team out two years ago.

The buyout Barta gave him was batshit crazy. Same with the one Ferentz got. I'll never understand why Barta did it. He'll probably take it to his grave.

But to say Fran hasn't accomplished anything here is a myopic view. Iowa has made the Sweet 16 once ('99) since '88. It's not like he's coaching at a college basketball power.
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I just named three eras when we were a basketball power. It can be done, with the right coach recruiting the right players and being allowed to do his job by the right athletic director.

Iowa will never be a blue blood, but it can have six-eight year stretches where it is a consistent top 20 program and occasionally gets to sweet sixteen-elite eight status.
 
There's a difference between saying Iowa should be better or can be better and saying Fran has accomplished nothing. He took over a shit show from Lickliter. It's dangerous to talk in absolutes like saying someone accomplished NOTHING and he's done NOTHING.

Iowa's facilities are just OK when it comes to the Big Ten competition. The support for basketball is not what it is for football, from donors or fans.

Iowa hasn't been what you want consistently since Lute and Raveling. The landscape has changed quite a bit. And Davis was run out of town because he didn't win enough. Where did that get you?

If Fran leaves tomorrow, he at least rebuilt this program up from where it was before he took over. To say he has accomplished NOTHING is asinine.
 
RobHowe said:
There's a difference between saying Iowa should be better or can be better and saying Fran has accomplished nothing. He took over a shit show from Lickliter. It's dangerous to talk in absolutes like saying someone accomplished NOTHING and he's done NOTHING.

Iowa's facilities are just OK when it comes to the Big Ten competition. The support for basketball is not what it is for football, from donors or fans.

Iowa hasn't been what you want consistently since Lute and Raveling. The landscape has changed quite a bit. And Davis was run out of town because he didn't win enough. Where did that get you?

If Fran leaves tomorrow, he at least rebuilt this program up from where it was before he took over. To say he has accomplished NOTHING is asinine.
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He has accomplished nothing worth keeping him as the head coach of Iowa. That's my opinion. A .466 BIG conference win % is somewhere between nothing and mediocre. Asinine is someone that says "we can't have a BIG conference title at Iowa in the future because we haven't had one in the past 40 years. So, we should stop trying and settle for a coach that obviously isn't good enough to accomplish that task." Asinine probably isn't a stong enough word for this person.
 
lightning1 said:
He has accomplished nothing worth keeping him as the head coach of Iowa. That's my opinion. A .466 BIG conference win % is somewhere between nothing and mediocre. Asinine is someone that says "we can't have a BIG conference title at Iowa in the future because we haven't had one in the past 40 years. So, we should stop trying and settle for a coach that obviously isn't good enough to accomplish that task." Asinine probably isn't a stong enough word for this person.
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Where did I say that you shouldn't expect a Big Ten title? Where did I say you should settle for the current coach?

I said saying that he has accomplished NOTHING is asinine. And it is.

I despise Alford as a human, but I'm not going to sit here and say he accomplished NOTHING as a coach. He won two conference tournament titles.
 
RobHowe said:
Where did I say that you shouldn't expect a Big Ten title? Where did I say you should settle for the current coach?

I said saying that he has accomplished NOTHING is asinine. And it is.

I despise Alford as a human, but I'm not going to sit here and say he accomplished NOTHING as a coach. He won two conference tournament titles.
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There you go. You labeled exactly what he accomplished and they have the words TITLES in them. If Fran had the words TITLES and BIG CONFERENCE associated with his name, I'd have a different opinion. But he doesn't.
 
lightning1 said:
There you go. You labeled exactly what he accomplished and they have the words TITLES in them. If Fran had the words TITLES and BIG CONFERENCE associated with his name, I'd have a different opinion. But he doesn't.
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I think you're missing Rob's point.
 
lightning1 said:
There you go. You labeled exactly what he accomplished and they have the words TITLES in them. If Fran had the words TITLES and BIG CONFERENCE associated with his name, I'd have a different opinion. But he doesn't.
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I'm not going to make you see your mistake in saying Fran has accomplished NOTHING, am I? Go ahead and die on that hill. I'm not going to continue to debate something within someone who struggles with reading comprehension.
 
Let me put it this way. If the previous owner of a house burned it to the ground and I came in and rebuilt it to what it was prior to the previous tenant....what did I accomplish, exactly?
 
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