How about a little perspective...

W

WindsorHawk

Well-Known Member
I think most would agree that Duke is pretty relevant when it comes to college basketball, has one of the top coaches in the game and is definitely a top 10 team nationally this year.

Why do I mention Duke in this thread? Duke is 4-2 in their conference...same as Iowa. They have lost at NC State (4-2) by 12 and AT HOME to Miami of Florida (2-2) by 16. I wonder if their fans have given up on their coach and written off their season. I mean how can a top 5 team lose at home by 16 to Miami of Florida and still have anything to play for the rest of the way? They clearly aren't very good and their coach doesn't know what he's doing...Sarcasm.

Coach K was 17-13, 10-17, 11-17 and 24-10 in his first 4 years at Duke. Fran went 11-20, 18-17, 25-13 and 20-13 in his first 4 years at Iowa. I'm not saying Fran is Coach K but I am saying it's ridiculous to suggest he's in over his head, can't coach, can't recruit, should be gone, etc. as some of the ridiculous posts on this board suggest.

Year 1 - No Postseason
Year 2 - NIT
Year 3 - NIT Championship Game
Year 4 - NCAA
Year 5 - To Be Determined
 
We're talking about a coach that has won almost 1000 games and multiple national titles so not a good comparison, but I doubt Duke fans are saying the things you mentioned, but there are always a few morons out there, and those people should be disregarded.

That doesn't mean I think Fran doesn't know what he's doing. Not by a long shot. But, I do think recruiting needs to pick up if Iowa hoops is going to take that next step. Otherwise, we might be pretty close to the ceiling.

There's only so much coaching can do - talent has to do the rest. Iowa isn't getting the same types of players coach K has been bringing in at Duke the last 30+ years.
 
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1977Hawkeye said:
Terrible comparison, at least if you're wondering why Duke fans aren't throwing coach K under the bus. We're talking about a coach that has won almost 1000 games and multiple national titles.

That doesn't mean I think Fran doesn't know what he's doing. Not by a long shot. But, I do think recruiting needs to pick up if Iowa hoops is going to take that next step. Otherwise, we might be pretty close to the ceiling.

There's only so much coaching can do - talent has to do the rest. Iowa isn't getting the same types of players coach K has been bringing in at Duke the last 30+ years.
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He's not comparing the entire body of work. He's comparing the first five seasons. And in that particular sample, he has a legitimate point.
 
Fran is an excellent coach. The improvement from the Lickliter years has been remarkable. His success at Iowa ultimately will be determined by his ability to recruit. We know he can coach.

Anyone on this board who doesn't understand Fran's ability is either an Iowa State troll (and there are literally HUNDREDS of them hanging out on this board, God Bless their dark souls) or just doesn't understand basketball
 
Knight78 said:
He's not comparing the entire body of work. He's comparing the first five seasons. And in that particular sample, he has a legitimate point.
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As for "first 4-5 years", fair enough, although I'd like to see a comparison of the recruits that were being brought in between Duke & Iowa.

He was also making this point:

"Why do I mention Duke in this thread? Duke is 4-2 in their conference...same as Iowa. They have lost at NC State (4-2) by 12 and AT HOME to Miami of Florida (2-2) by 16. I wonder if their fans have given up on their coach and written off their season."

Given coach K's body of work, that would be ludicrous to be writing anything or anyone off. As I said, bad comparison to Iowa's situation. Apples & Oranges.
 
Although I should clarify - as I just said, that doesn't mean I think Fran is in over his head. He did a good job of getting it turned around, and you don't do that if you don't know what you're doing. For an example of incompetence, just look at Fran's predecessor.
 
FM needs to land his "Johnny Dawkins" before I am 100 percent all in. The one big time recruit who believes.
 
If you want to make Duke the perspective for year 1 thru 5 great, but if that is where the perspective ends? Then big deal. If that isn't where the perspective ends then He'll Yeah it going to get fun.

So it's is only fair to look at want happen after year 5 at Duke.

Year 6: NCAA Finalist
Year 7: Sweet 16
Year 8: Final Four
Year 9: Final Four
Year 10: NCAA Finalist
Year 11: NCAA Champions
Year 12: NCAA Champions


How many are confident that Fran is building this at Iowa?
 
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Duke stinks, Christian Laettner was the most overrated basketball players of all time. Iowa is going to have a far better run.
 
In today's climate coach K would have been run after year 3. People forget if he hadn't made it to the title game in '86 he would have been likely fired.
 
ChosenChildren said:
Fran is an excellent coach. The improvement from the Lickliter years has been remarkable. His success at Iowa ultimately will be determined by his ability to recruit. We know he can coach.

Anyone on this board who doesn't understand Fran's ability is either an Iowa State troll (and there are literally HUNDREDS of them hanging out on this board, God Bless their dark souls) or just doesn't understand basketball
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Great post. Fran just needs to continue to improve the level of athleticism. He needs to recruit well. If he can improve in that area, I think Iowa is in great shape.

Uhl looks like he has a future. Jok continues to improve. I hope the Chicago recruits can add value next year. Having said that, I really hope that Iowa can finish strong this year and have a decent season next year, and truly get some real four star guys coming into the program. Talent is just so important.
 
Fran's offense, motion or screening low and at the elbow, get players open for jumpers all over the court. We dont make nearly enough of those jumpers so then the lane is clogged.

If Jok can get on fire and uthoff also hit a good % of jumpers then the lane will open up. Notice how Wisky packing the lane totally shut down Woody and Gabe, what 2 pts for them.

Coaches dare Iowa to take the jumper.
 
trj said:
In today's climate coach K would have been run after year 3. People forget if he hadn't made it to the title game in '86 he would have been likely fired.
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Your first statement is probably correct - on the surface, it looked like things were going nowhere if you look at just the W/L record for those first 3 years. The question is, what kind of recruits were coming in?

If there were great recruits on the way, I would (as a fan) want to see how the team would perform with better talent. As it turns out, Duke was drastically improved in years 4 & 5.
 
I still remember staying up late listening to Jim Zabel call the first round of the Rainbow Classic in 1994. Jess Settles scored 28 points as Iowa beat Duke 81-71. It was one of the best nights of my life. I will never forget it!
 
Hawknick said:
I still remember staying up late listening to Jim Zabel call the first round of the Rainbow Classic in 1994. Jess Settles scored 28 points as Iowa beat Duke 81-71. It was one of the best nights of my life. I will never forget it!
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I remember that, too. No TV, so we were all huddled around the radio.

Zim Zabel: "Jim Bartels must have about a million rebounds!" lol
 
Hawknick said:
Duke stinks, Christian Laettner was the most overrated basketball players of all time. Iowa is going to have a far better run.
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You sure??

Year 6: NCAA Finalist
Year 7: Sweet 16
Year 8: Final Four
Year 9: Final Four
Year 10: NCAA Finalist
Year 11: NCAA Champions
Year 12: NCAA Champions


As for Laettner pretty tough for anyone to bash his College Career..
 
Jim Bartels was one heck of a player. I actually played a couple of pick up games with him. He was known as a 3 point shooter but he was so welll rounded. He was hard to keep of the boards and I remember having a hard time trying to score any points against him.
 
trj said:
In today's climate coach K would have been run after year 3. People forget if he hadn't made it to the title game in '86 he would have been likely fired.
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This is kind of where I was going with this thread. IMO Fran can coach and recognize talent...often before other programs take notice. It takes time...especially with the high end recruits considering the starting point for Fran when he arrived at Iowa.
 
trj said:
FM needs to land his "Johnny Dawkins" before I am 100 percent all in. The one big time recruit who believes.
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Would Ulis have qualified? I believe he's on record as saying it was Iowa over MSU until Kentucky came calling late. It's hard to say no to Kentucky. I wish we had actually landed Ulis but knowing we were so close makes me believe Fran will get his "Johnny Dawkins" sooner rather than later.
 
trj said:
In today's climate coach K would have been run after year 3. People forget if he hadn't made it to the title game in '86 he would have been likely fired.
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He would have been Fired in 1986? You do know that Duke finished the 1986 season 31-3 and 12-2 in conference.
 
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