Hawk Central, Tyler Tachman

[NorthKCHawk]

Also, if the McCaffrey clan thinks they would have gotten less scrutiny at another major conference program under the same circumstances, they are delusional. Fran grew up in Philly, they throw snowballs at Santa in Philly!

The truth is that a major college MBB coach is going to get a lot of criticism. A D1 athlete is also going to get a lot of noise and criticism. When you combine those two things, don't be shocked when its not all lolly pops and rainbows. And to be clear, I don't think the McCaffreys expected hugs and kisses. They are savvy people and knew what the deal was.

The "empty barn" is a sign of the times. Students have other interests. Iowa has not invested in the facility or fan experience in a meaningful way. There are many other options for your dollar, including watching the game on an 80 inch flat screen. You have a good but not great program with a coach who has been there 14 years, and its been decades since a deep tournament run, and probably most glaring, the program is being outshone by the greatest athlete on the planet right now who plays in the same gym.

 

[Hawkfnntn]

The podcasts that they've done and especially the podcast they had Margeret on would suggest differently. They know exactly what is being said about them, their Dad and they see the barn a 1/3rd full. Iowa fans have never fully embraced Fran or his family and I definitely feel there is some resentment there just based off of things they've said over the years on their podcast and on Twitter.

Yeah I've watched some of those. They had Clark and Martin on at different times too which were pretty cool. I'm trying to remember who it was I heard say this in the media but they were saying how they'd wish that Fran would put himself out there more to be seen with fans. He's just really guarded in public settings the Iclub stuff that he does do and whatnot. I think it was one of Scott Dochtermans pod I've heard him say that.

He wishes that something like the Prime Time league still existed for fan access to players. Something like that anyway. And having Fran just show his personable side more. He's just really guarded it seems like and I suppose how he and his kids have been portrayed over the years by the media may be largely why.

 

[InGoodCo]

https://x.com/Tyler_T15/status/1765486928525242480?s=20

I mean, he's not wrong...

 

[InGoodCo]

Fran said today at his presser... Patrick and Tony both could return for another year.. each also could decide to play elsewhere in college too.. that's college basketball today.

 

[trj]

Fran said today at his presser... Patrick and Tony both could return for another year.. each also could decide to play elsewhere in college too.. that's college basketball today.

Perk
Pmac
Payton Sandfort

In your opinion, do you think all three return? IMO, Payton is the only lock to return.

 

[Grady]

Perk
Pmac
Payton Sandfort

In your opinion, do you think all three return? IMO, Payton is the only lock to return.

I agree, I don't see Payton leaving. He's the heart and soul of this group, and if he and Perk both come back, they've got a great year ahead of them, with the maturation of Freeman & Dix.
Perk will either return to UI or head to Europe. I would guess NIL may play a role in his decision. I can't imagine him gaining anything by entering the transfer portal.
PMac has the most complicated decision...it depends on what his priorities are. If he wants to be a starter and play a lot of minutes, he should look elsewhere -- why would hestay another year and come off the bench, which is what he'd be doing? On the other hand, if he wants to stay close to his family, UI is the place to be -- I have no idea if he wants to work toward or already has a graduate degree. To me, he's the one with the most options and decisions to make.

 

[dahlhawk]

The podcasts that they've done and especially the podcast they had Margeret on would suggest differently. They know exactly what is being said about them, their Dad and they see the barn a 1/3rd full. Iowa fans have never fully embraced Fran or his family and I definitely feel there is some resentment there just based off of things they've said over the years on their podcast and on Twitter.

There are reason's for that. Fran's temper and demeaner (which I'm OK with, but I know it's cost us games with the refs.) and his lack of recruiting the traditional type of player. Fran's teams are not athletic on the whole, which is a problem as well. People want to cheer on Fran but for some reason he has not delivered with the talent he has had dropped in his lap. Bad luck maybe? One Big Ten Tournament championship has not earned him the love and respect that Kirk has achieved. Do I think he's a good coach, I do, but it has always seemed to me he gives too complicated answers to simple questions. As to all athletes, best to stay off of social media if you have thin skin.

 

[Zstatman]

I agree, I don't see Payton leaving. He's the heart and soul of this group, and if he and Perk both come back, they've got a great year ahead of them, with the maturation of Freeman & Dix.
Perk will either return to UI or head to Europe. I would guess NIL may play a role in his decision. I can't imagine him gaining anything by entering the transfer portal.
PMac has the most complicated decision...it depends on what his priorities are. If he wants to be a starter and play a lot of minutes, he should look elsewhere -- why would hestay another year and come off the bench, which is what he'd be doing? On the other hand, if he wants to stay close to his family, UI is the place to be -- I have no idea if he wants to work toward or already has a graduate degree. To me, he's the one with the most options and decisions to make.

I like your analysis for the most part. I'd add the G League to the possibilities. One thing I'd say is that most, if not all, of the guys that have entered the portal and left, IMO, have not really gained that much by doing so. Their games stay the same and they make the same contribution they were here so why leave. I'd put Tony and PMac in that category.

If they don't come back, I'd say the G League is a real possibility for both. At 22 or however old they are are they really ready to go live overseas? That's a big step. Most guys seem to give the G League 2-3 years then go overseas when the NBA path is doubtful.

Tony could play for a lot of G League teams; he could really improve his game. If he could develop a consistent outside shot, he could have some potential.

PMac, he's put a lot of pressure on himself. I've always felt he wanted to be the 'guy', the guy that lead the team thru his play and he just doesn't have the game to do that. To be honest I don't know that he has that much G League potential. His fuutre isin coaching or something. The one G League spot I could see him going to.................the Iowa Wolves.

Both Tony and PMac could come back and make solid contributions then they'll be right back to where they are now.

Payton, I don't see him leaving for anything but a first-round draft pick and a guaranteed contract. Otherwise, he's got a lot of room to grow by coming back for another year.

 

[NorthKCHawk]

Payton is not as NBA ready as Weiscamp was when he left, and he was mid second. Weiscamp was more athletic. A guy like Sanford has a role in the NBA along the lines of Kyle Korver, but PS doesn't shoot that well. I don't think that he would even be drafted this year. If he has a monster senior year and hits 42% from deep, somebody will take a flyer on him.

Perk is sort of goldilox for Iowa. Not good enough for the NBA and probably not quite good enough for a blue blood to back up the truck full of cash, but certainly good enough to be a high level starter at Iowa.

With Patrick there are so many variables, from his mental and physical health to the name on the back of his jersey.

I say Perk and Payton return, but Patrick hangs them up. From personal experience, I ran track for 4 years in college and was ready to stop being an athlete after my last conference meet. Its a grind and a lot of guys are ready to move to the next phase of their life.

 

[Hawkfnntn]

Perk
Pmac
Payton Sandfort

In your opinion, do you think all three return? IMO, Payton is the only lock to return.

Agree if I had to put $ on it Sandfort would be the only one I bet that'll be back. And if I'm right about Fran leaving then all bets are off on most of the guys frankly. I know he's said he's not retiring yet but I don't think he said he'd be back coaching Iowa next yr... If I'd missed that I hope someone corrects me but if that's still the case that certainly leaves that crack in the door.

 

[NorthKCHawk]

Agree if I had to put $ on it Sandfort would be the only one I bet that'll be back. And if I'm right about Fran leaving then all bets are off on most of the guys frankly. I know he's said he's not retiring yet but I don't think he said he'd be back coaching Iowa next yr... If I'd missed that I hope someone corrects me but if that's still the case that certainly leaves that crack in the door.

Fran was clear that he is not ready to retire. That said, he is still old. Not ready to retire and ready to start over at a completely new gig are two wildly different things. Also, what major program out there would want him? It would have to be a program in rough shape and the AD could sell stability and sustained success over time. But, most fan bases and boosters and ADs would focus on what we have focused on, absolutely no success beyond the first round in the tourney, and he has been around forever. Those other programs would not focus on the amazing things we have experienced like winning the conference tourney and what it was like to have back to back to back contenders for the Wooden award.

Also, with what Fran is returning, including possibly his son, and the Koch kid coming in, where is he going to land in a better spot the next couple years?

 

[InGoodCo]

Perk
Pmac
Payton Sandfort

In your opinion, do you think all three return? IMO, Payton is the only lock to return.

agree....

I don't love the quotes I heard from Fran or Patrick yesterday. Not that either were wrong with what they said (Pat complaining about the fans this season/Fran saying Tony and Pat could play at another school next year)....but it just sorta sounded (to me) like guys who don't have a ton of more time here. I've also been hearing a rumor about Josh Dix getting back channeled and talking with Creighton. At least there's smoke on Creightons side of things. I imagine some of these guys might know or think they know what Fran's plans are further then this year. I think the future of this roster is fairly uncertain and that's just me kind of reading tealeaves, I could be totally off

If nothing changes, obviously would LOVE Tony Perkins back, but I also am really excited about Harding and I have no problem rolling into next season with him as our 1.

 

[Hawkfnntn]

Payton is not as NBA ready as Weiscamp was when he left, and he was mid second. Weiscamp was more athletic. A guy like Sanford has a role in the NBA along the lines of Kyle Korver, but PS doesn't shoot that well. I don't think that he would even be drafted this year. If he has a monster senior year and hits 42% from deep, somebody will take a flyer on him.

Perk is sort of goldilox for Iowa. Not good enough for the NBA and probably not quite good enough for a blue blood to back up the truck full of cash, but certainly good enough to be a high level starter at Iowa.

With Patrick there are so many variables, from his mental and physical health to the name on the back of his jersey.

I say Perk and Payton return, but Patrick hangs them up. From personal experience, I ran track for 4 years in college and was ready to stop being an athlete after my last conference meet. Its a grind and a lot of guys are ready to move to the next phase of their life.

Couldn't agree more with this. Some in the media are really pushing the Sandfort getting NBA love story and it's so not fair to the kid. He's not an NBA player and I'd be surprised if he got drafted at all if he left. And even if someone took a flier on him late he's got no shot of making the team. Look how hard it's been for guys like Marble, Uthoff, Joe W, Garza, and I'll throw Kris Murray into this. He's not exactly tore up the NBA like his bro has either but at least he's stuck on the roster all yr. The NBA is just hard and all those guys I'd rank significantly above Sandfort.

Sandfort would have to be a one trick pony at that level with shooting 3s and he's just not that consistently great at it. The rest of his game doesn't translate to the NBA I don't think. He's not the next Luka Doncic. Far from it

 

[NorthKCHawk]

agree....

I don't love the quotes I heard from Fran or Patrick yesterday. Not that either were wrong with what they said (Pat complaining about the fans this season/Fran saying Tony and Pat could play at another school next year)....but it just sorta sounded (to me) like guys who don't have a ton of more time here. I've also been hearing a rumor about Josh Dix getting back channeled and talking with Creighton. At least there's smoke on Creightons side of things. I imagine some of these guys might know or think they know what Fran's plans are further then this year. I think the future of this roster is fairly uncertain and that's just me kind of reading tealeaves, I could be totally off

If nothing changes, obviously would LOVE Tony Perkins back, but I also am really excited about Harding and I have no problem rolling into next season with him as our 1.

I am sure there is this sort of chatter in every program. Kids know each other through summer ball and recruiting and they keep in touch. Keep in mind that Creighton has some good guards returning and has two Top 100 guards coming in with similar size and skillset, so it might be a crowded backcourt in Omaha.

Dix seems like an Iowa kid. Don't see him leaving unless Fran leaves.

That said, Creighton has money and McDermott had a bagman before NIL and a healthy collective since. Never say never.

 

[Hawkfnntn]

Fran was clear that he is not ready to retire. That said, he is still old. Not ready to retire and ready to start over at a completely new gig are two wildly different things. Also, what major program out there would want him? It would have to be a program in rough shape and the AD could sell stability and sustained success over time. But, most fan bases and boosters and ADs would focus on what we have focused on, absolutely no success beyond the first round in the tourney, and he has been around forever. Those other programs would not focus on the amazing things we have experienced like winning the conference tourney and what it was like to have back to back to back contenders for the Wooden award.

Also, with what Fran is returning, including possibly his son, and the Koch kid coming in, where is he going to land in a better spot the next couple years?

Yeah I don't think he'd be at the top of the list for most programs by any means. I don't think Fran leaving would be about him finding a 'better spot' so much as just a different one. I think after the yr he'll be taking a long look around at the landscape of what other options he might have. After doing that he may very well not leave. I just get the sense he'd like to if stars align. I could also see him step down and not 'retire' but just not coach next yr and follow Jack to wherever he ends up. I think at his age/stage of life he'd kinda like to just be a Dad and watch his youngest kid play ball.

Fran could get back into coaching down the road if he wanted easy enough. Just not a high profile one obviously. I don't think there's any shortage of job opportunities between Iowa and the east coast where I'd guess they'd prefer going. So we'll see I'm just not going to be surprised by Fran leaving is all. But by no means am I rooting for that. I'd like him back too

 

[InGoodCo]

Fran was clear that he is not ready to retire. That said, he is still old. Not ready to retire and ready to start over at a completely new gig are two wildly different things. Also, what major program out there would want him? It would have to be a program in rough shape and the AD could sell stability and sustained success over time. But, most fan bases and boosters and ADs would focus on what we have focused on, absolutely no success beyond the first round in the tourney, and he has been around forever. Those other programs would not focus on the amazing things we have experienced like winning the conference tourney and what it was like to have back to back to back contenders for the Wooden award.

Also, with what Fran is returning, including possibly his son, and the Koch kid coming in, where is he going to land in a better spot the next couple years?

I don't know that his next step would be a MAJOR program right? He's likely going to go down a level if he leaves and Fran's spent most of his career at midmajors on the east coast. We as fans all assume he's looking for something bigger and better, I am not sure that would be the case. Just something new and a TON of places would hire him at that level. Not telling you anything you don't know here, but TONS of old ball coaches hanging around at smaller schools that are well past their prime and those schools are hiring guys that are inches away from the grave all the time.

 

[NorthKCHawk]

Yeah I don't think he'd be at the top of the list for most programs by any means. I don't think Fran leaving would be about him finding a 'better spot' so much as just a different one. I think after the yr he'll be taking a long look around at the landscape of what other options he might have. After doing that he may very well not leave. I just get the sense he'd like to if stars align. I could also see him step down and not 'retire' but just not coach next yr and follow Jack to wherever he ends up. I think at his age/stage of life he'd kinda like to just be a Dad and watch his youngest kid play ball.

Fran could get back into coaching down the road if he wanted easy enough. Just not a high profile one obviously. I don't think there's any shortage of job opportunities between Iowa and the east coast where I'd guess they'd prefer going. So we'll see I'm just not going to be surprised by Fran leaving is all. But by no means am I rooting for that. I'd like him back too

At his age, I don't think you take a year off and then land a gig of any note. Maybe he could drop down several levels and he would get interest, but I don't see any power 5 school wanting him now, let alone after a year. He also did not sound like someone who lacks fire in his belly. I think he is still hungry and still likes what he is doing and enjoys the process. Sort of like KF I guess.

Plus, doesn't Jack have another year of high school? Are they going to pull him out for his senior year? Maybe.

I would guess Fran and family have decided to give it one more year. There would be a more natural breaking point after next season with Jack graduating and Pat being out of eligibility.

 

[NorthKCHawk]

I don't know that his next step would be a MAJOR program right? He's likely going to go down a level if he leaves and Fran's spent most of his career at midmajors on the east coast. We as fans all assume he's looking for something bigger and better, I am not sure that would be the case. Just something new and a TON of places would hire him at that level. Not telling you anything you don't know here, but TONS of old ball coaches hanging around at smaller schools that are well past their prime and those schools are hiring guys that are inches away from the grave all the time.

Sorry to correct, but this is the second time in the thread that someone has suggested that the majority of Fran's career has been someplace it has not.

Fran spent 11 years at Notre Dame as a coach (which is located in Indiana and is not exactly mid major) and 14 at Iowa. So 25 of his 42 years of coaching years have been in the Midwest, not the East Coast at mid major schools. One of those midwestern stops is where he met his wife and the most recent is where he raised all of his children. I am just saying that this constant narrative that Fran and his wife are just pining to get back to the East Coast where they have spent their entires lives is just not accurate. He has lived in IC longer than anywhere since his childhood.

 

[Hawkfnntn]

At his age, I don't think you take a year off and then land a gig of any note. Maybe he could drop down several levels and he would get interest, but I don't see any power 5 school wanting him now, let alone after a year. He also did not sound like someone who lacks fire in his belly. I think he is still hungry and still likes what he is doing and enjoys the process. Sort of like KF I guess.

Plus, doesn't Jack have another year of high school? Are they going to pull him out for his senior year? Maybe.

I would guess Fran and family have decided to give it one more year. There would be a more natural breaking point after next season with Jack graduating and Pat being out of eligibility.

You're right Jack is class of 25. I had it in my head this was it for him for some reason. I mighta heard someone recently refer to him as a senior the other day is why I thought that.

That changes everything I was just ranting about obviously timeline wise. And I was going to say if I'm wrong about PM and if he was hell bent on coming back for next yr then obviously Fran isn't leaving either. I just kinda think PM will be done here regardless too.

 

[Zstatman]

Maybe Fran and Jack go somewhere as a package?

Regarding Sandfort, Kevin Huerter keeps coming to mind. We all know the story, ball boy with Connor at Siena, dad is play by play announcer there, recruited by Iowa, then goes to Maryland. What did he play there, one year, maybe two. He went for a look see about being ready for the NBA and he gets drafted in the first ound and is gone. I didn't see him being ready, a shooter of 3s but not much else. But he started for Atlanta 2-3 years, did OK, then gets traded to the Kings where he is now starting on a good Kings team. He's starting with Keegan and fellow Iowan, Harrison Barnes. Does Payton have that kind of game? Maybe so? I think Payton's outside shooting is only going to improve, he's 6'7" sp he's got the size, Huerter size. The NBA knows what they are looking for.

I thought Wiesy had the best shot of making it in the NBA and he had ample opportunity to show his game. It just takes him too long to warm up from deep, he doesn't just sttep on the floor and start hitting 3s, didn't at Iowa either. I did see he scored 38 in a G League game recently but I think he's had his shot. I'd guess he'll be going overseas soon.