Fran in games decided by 5 points or less

DP5555 said:
I don't disagree with you. I would agree that this trend is mostly on the players because in many cases they have been put in a position to win and they simply collapsed.

However, I do think Fran deserves some of the blame...That's probably my biggest gripe with Fran. It's like he just panics with his players and says "**** it whatever happens happens". Sometimes he needs to be the voice of reason. Call a timeout. Explain the situation. Get a couple different plays called and run through them based upon that situation. Don't just let all hell break lose and live with it. They've failed far too many times with that strategy.
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You saved your post with that second paragraph. I read that first paragraph and thought, Isn't that what coaches are for??
 
tweeterhawk said:
This is pretty brutal, actually, and perhaps indicative of the type of athlete Fran has managed to recruit at Iowa. Decent players but not physically or mentally hard enough to win close games at the end. Would be curious how this compares with other recent coaches at Iowa, especially Lute, Mr. Davis, Wonder Boy and Lackluster.
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How about this: A coach with the offensive philosophy of Fran AND the defensive philosophy of Lackluster?
 
HomerChampless said:
You saved your post with that second paragraph. I read that first paragraph and thought, Isn't that what coaches are for??
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What was wrong with his first paragraph? Coaches are supposed to put players in a position to win. That's all a coach can do.
 
PCHawk said:
What was wrong with his first paragraph? Coaches are supposed to put players in a position to win. That's all a coach can do.
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When players are 'put into a position to win', sometimes the coach has to call a timeout, call an inbound play, change defenses, change offenses, or just call a last second shot play that'll work. You know, because players don't always execute correctly?.
 
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HomerChampless said:
When players are 'put into a position to win', sometimes the coach has to call a timeout, call an inbound play, change defenses, change offenses, or just call a last second shot play that'll work. You know, because players don't always execute correctly?.
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You can do all of that from the bench without calling time out. You do realize that "calling a play that works" means calling a play that gets a good shot? It can't be judged on whether or not the shot goes in because the coach has no control over that.
 
Gesell didn't need those free throws to win that game but he really needed those free throws for mental reasons.
 
​Updated

..............#of +/-
............. 5 pt gms ..... W-L ..... W (season)
2010-11 .....8..............2-6........11
2011-12 .....7..............4-3........18
2012-13 .....9..............2-7........25
2013-14 .....9..............2-7........20
2014-15 .....7..............2-5........22
2015-16 .....7..............2-5........20 (one reg season game left)
Overall.......47............14-33.....116

This group of seniors has had 32 games over the last 4 years decided by 5 points or less ... winning 8. Woof.
 
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khock said:
​Updated

............................................ #of +/-
............. 5 pt gms ..... W-L ..... W (season)
2010-11 .....8..............2-6........11
2011-12 .....7..............4-3........18
2012-13 .....9..............2-7........25
2013-14 .....9..............2-7........20
2014-15 .....7..............2-5........22
2015-16 .....7..............2-5........20 (one reg season game left)
Overall.......47............14-33.....116

This group of seniors has had 32 games over the last 4 years decided by 5 points or less ... winning 8. Woof.
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It's a testament to Fran's coaching that we were in this many games with so many teams that had a bit more talent than we do.
 
HawkPrdatr40 said:
Maybe the first couple years it was a testament, not so much anymore!
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Agreed. I realize we aren't going to win them all, but this has continued to be a glaring problem (whatever the cause) year after year, with 2011-12 being the outlier.

Just being competitive was good the first year or two following Lick, but this program has been built past the point where we should not be celebrating moral victories of "at least we aren't getting blown out anymore".
 
Many believe this is a Fran problem. Many believe this is a player problem. I'm pretty sure we all agree Fran gets a pass in years 1 and 2. The current group of seniors were all part of the next/last 4 years. It will be interesting to look at these numbers 2 or 3 years from now...only looking at these next 2 or 3 years without this group of seniors.

Edit - I think it's a player problem. But I can't defend this position if it's still a problem for the next 2 or 3 years...too much talent on the roster IMO.
 
1977Hawkeye said:
Agreed. I realize we aren't going to win them all, but this has continued to be a glaring problem (whatever the cause) year after year, with 2011-12 being the outlier.

Just being competitive was good the first year or two following Lick, but this program has been built past the point where we should not be celebrating moral victories of "at least we aren't getting blown out anymore".
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Put me in this category as well. We are 7 years into this I am at least waaaaay beyond moral victories. And before someone hits me with the "do you know Iowa's history" card......Yeah, I get it, Iowa isn't a blue blood and for that very reason you can't have epic meltdowns when you get off to a great start.

Right now I lean towards PCHawk's argument that it is more the mental makeup of the players(this Senior group specifically) than it is Fran's coaching......but man, I am starting to waffle on this.
 
tweeterhawk said:
This is pretty brutal, actually, and perhaps indicative of the type of athlete Fran has managed to recruit at Iowa. Decent players but not physically or mentally hard enough to win close games at the end. Would be curious how this compares with other recent coaches at Iowa, especially Lute, Mr. Davis, Wonder Boy and Lackluster.
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Ask and ye shall receive (Source: sports-reference.com)

Lickliter
2009-2010 3-2 10-22
2008-2009 4-6 15-17
2007-2008 3-6 13-19
Lickliter 10-14 38-58
41.7%

Alford
2006-2007 1-5 17-14
2005-2006 8-3 25-9
2004-2005 6-6 21-12
2003-2004 4-3 16-13
2002-2003 7-5 17-14
2001-2002 3-3 19-14
2000-2001 9-4 23-12
1999-2000 5-1 14-16
Alford 43-30 152-104
58.9%

Davis
1998-1999 5-3 20-10
1997-1998 2-3 20-11
1996-1997 3-3 22-10
1995-1996 3-2 23-9
1994-1995 4-6 20-12
1993-1994 3-3 11-16
1992-1993 1-1 22-9
1991-1992 3-5 19-11
1990-1991 6-6 19-11
1989-1990 4-3 12-16
1988-1989 5-3 23-9
1987-1988 1-5 24-10
1986-1987 8-2 30-5
Davis 48-48 265-139
50%

Raveling
1985-1986 3-6 16-12
1984-1985 4-6 20-11
1983-1984 2-7 12-15
Raveling 9-19 48-38
34.6%

Olson
1982-1983 5-7 21-10
1981-1982 4-4 20-8
1980-1981 5-3 20-7
1979-1980 7-3 22-10
1978-1979 3-6 20-8
1977-1978 4-5 12-15
1976-1977 3-3 18-9
1975-1976 5-0 17-10
1974-1975 4-5 10-16
Olson 40-36 160-93
52.6%

Schultz
1973-1974 3-3 7-16
1972-1973 2-4 11-11
1971-1972 2-7 11-13
1970-1971 3-9 8-15
Schultz 10-23 37-45
30.3%

Miller
1969-1970 3-2 19-5
1968-1969 2-3 8-12
1967-1968 5-4 16-9
1966-1967 5-5 16-8
1965-1966 1-0 15-7
1964-1965 3-3 12-9
Miller 19-17 86-50
52.8%
 
I was curious so I did some digging. I thought others might find this to be interesting. Below is Fran's record in games decided by 5 points or less.

4-3...Fran's 2nd year at Iowa...year before the current senior class arrived.
2-7...Fran's 1st year at Iowa...can't believe we even stayed within 5 points 9 times that year and 7 of those were conference games.

4-1...Fran's last year at Siena
6-2...Fran's 4th year at Siena
7-3...Fran's 3rd season at Siena
4-6...Fran's 2nd season at Siena
4-5...Fran's 1st season at Siena

Note - I included OT games without regard to final margin.

So Fran was 25-17 at Siena and 4-3 in his 2nd year at Iowa. I'm ignoring his 1st year at Iowa because the cupboard was bare. So Fran's numbers at Siena and Iowa excluding his 1st season at Iowa and the 4 years of this senior class are 29-20 (59%).

Edit - I can live with 59% moving forward in games decided by 5 points or less.
 
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WindsorHawk said:
I was curious so I did some digging. I thought others might find this to be interesting.

4-3...Fran's 2nd year at Iowa...year before the current senior class arrived.
2-7...Fran's 1st year at Iowa...can't believe we even stayed within 5 points 9 times that year and 7 of those were conference games.

4-1...Fran's last year at Siena
6-2...Fran's 4th year at Siena
7-3...Fran's 3rd season at Siena
4-6...Fran's 2nd season at Siena
4-5...Fran's 1st season at Siena

Note - I included OT games without regard to final margin.

So Fran was 25-17 at Siena and 4-3 in his 2nd year at Iowa. I'm ignoring his 1st year at Iowa because the cupboard was bare. So Fran's numbers at Siena and Iowa excluding his 1st season at Iowa and the 4 years of this senior class are 29-20 (59%).

Edit - I can live with 59% moving forward.
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So what is this??
 
trj said:
Put me in this category as well. We are 7 years into this I am at least waaaaay beyond moral victories. And before someone hits me with the "do you know Iowa's history" card......Yeah, I get it, Iowa isn't a blue blood and for that very reason you can't have epic meltdowns when you get off to a great start.

Right now I lean towards PCHawk's argument that it is more the mental makeup of the players(this Senior group specifically) than it is Fran's coaching......but man, I am starting to waffle on this.
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Every game I see makes me more and more confident I'm right. These players are making so many mistakes now, there isn't a coach in the world that could save them. And not all 5 point losses aren't created equal. I would bet Fran's first year most of those games were ones where we were lucky to be within 5 at the end.

Even 3 years ago it was one or two mistakes in a game where they were trading punches. Now it's just an epic meltdown on both sides of the court.
 
WindsorHawk said:
Many believe this is a Fran problem. Many believe this is a player problem. I'm pretty sure we all agree Fran gets a pass in years 1 and 2. The current group of seniors were all part of the next/last 4 years. It will be interesting to look at these numbers 2 or 3 years from now...only looking at these next 2 or 3 years without this group of seniors.

Edit - I think it's a player problem. But I can't defend this position if it's still a problem for the next 2 or 3 years...too much talent on the roster IMO.
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I agree that in a few years we will know if we're right or wrong. I have a feeling we're going to lose some games where we were down big and make some late baskets to get down to 5. Then people are going to pull out the stat and say I told you so. I think we might not have a great record in close games next year but I bet the meltdowns will be over.
 
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