At what point do 3 pointers not make sense for this team?

T

tednugentfan

Banned
With the exception of the UNI game, the team has been abyssmal from 3 all season. Based on the body of work Oglesby and McCabe have submitted thus far, I don't see this changing. McCabe needs to find some space at 13-15 feet and make that his spot. Oglesby has had ample time to shoot himself out of his slump, but hasn't. He needs to see the ball go through the hoop, so run some sets to get him a jumper inside the arc, a backdoor cut...anything to get his confidence up. Conversely, Gessel and Clemmons should take more shots. While I don't think Clemmons is a great shooter, he can't do worse than others shooting sub 20%.

It's still a mystery to me why the staff opted for Olaseni and Ingram riding the pine all year over a juco SG. As we saw Saturday, our bench is not going to be a much of a factor in conference play and other teams have guys like Sheehey who come in and knock down shots. I like McCaffrey and think the team plays hard, but at the end of the day, you need guys capable of creating their own offense OR making wide open shots as role players. It's getting a little old hearing McCaffrey talk about how great guys shoot in practice. As Dakich stated, there are practice shooters and game shooters.
 
This team is still very flawed. I really look at it like this is only fran's 2nd true season as his recruiting class his 1st yr wasn't really his as he had mostly hawkeyes that would have come no matter the coach. He will get more of shooters next yr (jok and uthoff). Plus those additions will give the length at the 2 that we lost with gatens leaving. Uthoff will allow marble to play the 2 more by being a legit back up at the 3 (nothing against may and white isn't a 3). Plus jok I see as possibly have the ability to be similar to matt in being able to score in a lot of ways and develop a clutch 3. While also being athletic enough to be a lockdown defender. I see a lot of upside with jok and the depth that he won't have to carry things early to stunt his growth like matt went through.
 
If you run your offense, the shots will come. Too many opportunities were lost b/c of bad transition, or hurried looks. This is a lot better bball than in years past. Be patient and good things will happen.
 
Foval21 said:
This team is still very flawed. I really look at it like this is only fran's 2nd true season as his recruiting class his 1st yr wasn't really his as he had mostly hawkeyes that would have come no matter the coach. He will get more of shooters next yr (jok and uthoff). Plus those additions will give the length at the 2 that we lost with gatens leaving. Uthoff will allow marble to play the 2 more by being a legit back up at the 3 (nothing against may and white isn't a 3). Plus jok I see as possibly have the ability to be similar to matt in being able to score in a lot of ways and develop a clutch 3. While also being athletic enough to be a lockdown defender. I see a lot of upside with jok and the depth that he won't have to carry things early to stunt his growth like matt went through.
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Calling Uthoff a 3 and a shooter are both huge stretches.
 
Mike Gessel is the best jump shooter on the team. Hes playing great, but is almost to unselfish. I wouldnt mind seeing him shooting more 3s even if they are contested. Hes more than capable of knocking down a few daggers.
 
BasketballMan said:
Calling Uthoff a 3 and a shooter are both huge stretches.
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How many games of his have you seen?

I have seen him in multiple games live and he is a legit wing and shooter. What fran tried to do with white by making him a wing, he doesn't have to do with uthoff because he already has that skill set.
 
At no point do "3 pointers not make sense for this team". That's asinine. Watta ya gonna do? Have FM tell the team, "No more 3 pointers fellas."?
You keep shooting them. No we aren't very good at hitting them, but we have to keep shooting them.
 
Foval21 said:
How many games of his have you seen?

I have seen him in multiple games live and he is a legit wing and shooter. What fran tried to do with white by making him a wing, he doesn't have to do with uthoff because he already has that skill set.
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I have seen him enough to think he's not a 3 at the D1 level. He thinks he is, but is much more a stretch 4 type kid who needs to add muscle and weight.
 
Jok will be the big addition, imo. He will be the best shooter/scorer on the team which will enable Marble more freedom on the offensive end of the court to do what he does best. Uthoff will also add another shooting and scoring dimension making next year's team one of the more talented teams to ever play at Iowa, imo.
 
BasketballMan said:
I have seen him enough to think he's not a 3 at the D1 level. He thinks he is, but is much more a stretch 4 type kid who needs to add muscle and weight.
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What is enough? I stated seeing games...are you pulling a herby and going off of video.

He is a combination of marble and white in skill set. This will allow him to play both the 3 and 4. He will play the 3 not as well as marble but better than white. He will play the 4 also but not as well as white. He is a better shooter than white and ballhandler. He can finish at the rim better than marble (imo marble lacks this right now and is why he doesn't get enough and 1s). He has similar skills to a gordon heyward...though not at that level.
 
Here's the key and why we are not back yet and how it relates to the 3 ball. Especially against man to man.

Our big's especially the really big one has slow legs and arms. He does not side and create picks well. The perimeter defenders know this. They also know our guards are decent in speed, but not jet burners. They can afford to come out hard on the outside shooter and take up the "landing zone" of a 3 point shooter. The key to stopping 3 ptrs is to take away the feet. Any D1 coach can teach 3 point shooting. They can't create the quickness needed. Until we can really threaten to go to the hoop, we won't be able to shoot 3's consistently.

As the big guy gets more experience, this will improve greatly, but he will never be quick. The other way to beat the defense is to pick and role and we no longer have Matt. We have one guard who understands how to do this and can do it, but he can't do it by himself. As long as there is a lack of quickness on D, the better teams in B1G will stop this anyway.

Teams with quick guards are going to be the Achilles heal of this team.

If you don't believe me, the easiest way to see the lack of guard quickness is on D as well. They can't 1 up and stop the drive by themselves and there is no quickness underneath to slide over. Teams with quick guards will repeated go to the hoop against us.

Teams with smart coaches like Carmody will also be a handful for us.
 
There really is never a point where you stop shooting threes. That would cause a lot of problems offensively.
 
bcl20 said:
There really is never a point where you stop shooting threes. That would cause a lot of problems offensively.
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However, missing all of these threes is a pretty big problem right now.

This team doesn't miss Gatens' shooting though.
 
Haha, did someone really blame our offensive woes on our Bigs slow legs?! And screening ability?!?
I don't know if we are "back" or not, but losing to the preseason #1 team in the nation by 4 might mean we ARE more than we ARE NOT.
 
Shooting and missing 3's is a problem and while I don't think McCaffrey should tell guys not to shoot, I think he needs to change some sets to get guys closer looks. We shoot and miss 3's at an alarming rate, which causes breaks for the other team and cheap fouls for us. Oglesby has enough game to score inside the arc, so run him off screens and give him some jumper opportunities.
 
goldenhawk96 said:
Haha, did someone really blame our offensive woes on our Bigs slow legs?! And screening ability?!?
I don't know if we are "back" or not, but losing to the preseason #1 team in the nation by 4 might mean we ARE more than we ARE NOT.
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Have you never shot threes in a game before? Your landing is critical. When the defender is not concerned about you blowing by them and using a pick down low, they guard you tighter. Makes perfect sense to those who have shot 3's before. A good defender isn't as keyed in on jumping with you and blocking the shot as much as taking away your landing. Refs don't call body contact down low anyway. Some coaches teach NOT to put the hand up, but to take away the feet and maybe a stiff arm to the chest which also disrupts the landing and makes you think about things the next time you shoot. Gets in your head and it can hurt. Refs seldom call the hand/forearm in the chest either. Watch a well coached game closely if you don't believe it. Most fans watch the ball going toward the basket or where ever it goes. Want to really understand, watch off the ball and watch foot work, spacing and such.
 
Woodbury knows how to screen and screen well. Our bigs actively screen. Our guards were quick shooting the ball and later just missing.
Stiff arming a shooter or taking away their landing by undercutting them even on their landing are both fouls...
 
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