why I am not worried about 1st year starters

R

redhawk55

Banned
in 2002 JUCO Banks was 1st time starter, top 10 finish
2003 JUCO Chandler was a 1st time starter very little playing time, top 10 finish
2004 Tate was a 1st time starter 11 total passes, top 10 finish as a backup
2005 Tate 7-5 no backup threw a pass
2006 Tate 6-7 JC threw 35 passes
2007 JC 6-6. Nelson threw 1 pass
2008 JC and Stanzi started the season til Stanzi took over as the starter no prior starts 9-4
2009 Stanzi 11-2 top 10 missed 2 games JVB played in one and started 2 more top 10
2010 Stanzi 8-5, JVB 6 Passes
2011 JVB 7-6, Derby got 6 passes
2012 JVB 4-8, nobody got a pass

the 1st time starters had winning seasons but after their 1st season regressed.
this appear to a problem with KOK as the QB coach, the QB was good for 1 good year then went down hill.
having a QB without prior experience will not hurt this team.
as the one thing they all had in common was a solid OL and as we saw when Scherff and Donall were starters this line was solid
 
redhawk55 said:
in 2002 JUCO Banks was 1st time starter, top 10 finish
2003 JUCO Chandler was a 1st time starter very little playing time, top 10 finish
2004 Tate was a 1st time starter 11 total passes, top 10 finish as a backup
2005 Tate 7-5 no backup threw a pass
2006 Tate 6-7 JC threw 35 passes
2007 JC 6-6. Nelson threw 1 pass
2008 JC and Stanzi started the season til Stanzi took over as the starter no prior starts 9-4
2009 Stanzi 11-2 top 10 missed 2 games JVB played in one and started 2 more top 10
2010 Stanzi 8-5, JVB 6 Passes
2011 JVB 7-6, Derby got 6 passes
2012 JVB 4-8, nobody got a pass

the 1st time starters had winning seasons but after their 1st season regressed.
this appear to a problem with KOK as the QB coach, the QB was good for 1 good year then went down hill.
having a QB without prior experience will not hurt this team.
as the one thing they all had in common was a solid OL and as we saw when Scherff and Donall were starters this line was solid
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Stanzi's stats as a senior were much much better than his numbers as a jr or sophomore. He did improve so there goes this theory.

I would say the success of these 1st year starting QB's had a lot to do with the supporting cast they had around them.

2002- Best offense in Iowa history
2003- Excellent D, Chandler wasnt asked to do a lot
2004- Best d line in school history? Nasty defense
2008- Tons of talent on this team, both sides of the ball
 
Well, all those guys you mentioned saw the field before they became a first-year starter. Also, none of them sat behind a guy who had just 7 TDs on 389 pass attempts.
 
Cover3 said:
Well, all those guys you mentioned saw the field before they became a first-year starter. Also, none of them sat behind a guy who had just 7 TDs on 389 pass attempts.
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To be honest, I think it would have been nice to see Ruddock a couple times, but how big of a deal is it if one of the other two guys end up starting? Two out of three QBs were on redshirt. You rather blow a redshirt on someone who only has 2 years? We have a QB with college experience, not B1G, but it's college. I wouldn't read too much into who didn't get to have a few snaps at the end of a game.
 
I agree a good OL helps any QB a lot. But to say experince is huge ? I dont get that. First of all they probley wont even get the whole play book. If Ruduck wins the job at least it will be his 3rd year in the program. But just second year with GD
 
HawkeyeHypnosis said:
To be honest, I think it would have been nice to see Ruddock a couple times, but how big of a deal is it if one of the other two guys end up starting? Two out of three QBs were on redshirt. You rather blow a redshirt on someone who only has 2 years? We have a QB with college experience, not B1G, but it's college. I wouldn't read too much into who didn't get to have a few snaps at the end of a game.
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I wasn't criticizing not playing Rudock (although I did that during the season). I was simply saying that Banks, Chandler, Tate, JC, Stanzi, and JVB all got time before they had their varying levels of success (save JC) in their first years starting. Be it Rudock, Sokol, or Beathard next year, our QB will have zero D1 experience.

I do agree that Sokol's experience is worth something. Don't know exactly what, but Banks got a nice year kind of sharing snaps with McCann coming from JUCO, and Chandler played a few second halves in 2002 (Akron, Utah St, jNW). Not saying our QB next year will be bad. All I'm saying is the examples given don't mean that our QB will be good.
 
redhawk55 said:
in 2002 JUCO Banks was 1st time starter, top 10 finish
2003 JUCO Chandler was a 1st time starter very little playing time, top 10 finish
2004 Tate was a 1st time starter 11 total passes, top 10 finish as a backup
2005 Tate 7-5 no backup threw a pass
2006 Tate 6-7 JC threw 35 passes
2007 JC 6-6. Nelson threw 1 pass
2008 JC and Stanzi started the season til Stanzi took over as the starter no prior starts 9-4
2009 Stanzi 11-2 top 10 missed 2 games JVB played in one and started 2 more top 10
2010 Stanzi 8-5, JVB 6 Passes
2011 JVB 7-6, Derby got 6 passes
2012 JVB 4-8, nobody got a pass

the 1st time starters had winning seasons but after their 1st season regressed.
this appear to a problem with KOK as the QB coach, the QB was good for 1 good year then went down hill.
having a QB without prior experience will not hurt this team.
as the one thing they all had in common was a solid OL and as we saw when Scherff and Donall were starters this line was solid
Click to expand...


How many of those years did we have a top 20 defense? Our D over the majority of the Ferentz era has masked an anemic offense. There were also a lot of offensive playmakers on those teams. I look at our roster next year and don't really see any. With another likely below avg D and O, even for KF, next year does not look encouraging for returning to some level of respectability.
 
you mean getting 6-11 passes in a game really helps that much.
and my point is whoever get the starting job will have a very solid OL in front of him.
not to mention a solid group of skill players to surrond him.
Weisman 900 total yards 800+ on the ground
Bullock 670 total yards 513 on the ground
Canzeri 142 total yards 114 on the ground his freshmen season
that over 1700 yards total offense just between the RB'S returning
as for receiving just between
KMM 571 yards
CJ 433 YARDS
not a bad supporting cast to start out with. 1300+ yards receiving and 1400+ yards rushing and that does not include the other returning players
 
We were developing a very solid O-line this year, until PSU.....ot tha JVB has ever really set the world on fire, but I think that he checked out of more pass's than we think,early in the year which hurt his TD stats, and over the 2nd half of the year, he didnt have the greatest O-line for protection...and then theres the GD thing....Like I said, not that he ever set the world on fire, but theres a lttle more to the story.....I cant wait till next season, thats for sure....
 
redhawk55 said:
you mean getting 6-11 passes in a game really helps that much.
and my point is whoever get the starting job will have a very solid OL in front of him.
not to mention a solid group of skill players to surrond him.
Weisman 900 total yards 800+ on the ground
Bullock 670 total yards 513 on the ground
Canzeri 142 total yards 114 on the ground his freshmen season
that over 1700 yards total offense just between the RB'S returning
as for receiving just between
KMM 571 yards
CJ 433 YARDS
not a bad supporting cast to start out with. 1300+ yards receiving and 1400+ yards rushing and that does not include the other returning players
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Redhawk55 and those who think it is no big deal that Rudock didn't get any game reps this season; I have a Yes/No question for you. If you were Rudock, in 2012, would you have wanted game reps so that you could have a mental picture of how fast D1 and BIG defenses are and, then, have game film to study so that you can see how you reacted to what you thought you saw during the game and what actually happened?

Then; giving Rudock this type of experience can only improve the competition during spring and fall camps. If Rudock had received some game reps, perhaps he would be a front runner during camps because he had some insight on how/when/why to throw a pass or not; in turn, making Sokol and Beathard work harder to catch up.

I believe KF made a huge mistake here unless Rudock leaves. I am not saying he is, but this should have been the only reason to not give him game reps.
 
I don't see it as huge. He, or whoever the new qb is will have all spring, spring game, and then a couple games before big ten.
 
HawkeyeMHA said:
I don't see it as huge. He, or whoever the new qb is will have all spring, spring game, and then a couple games before big ten.
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We can agree to disagree on this. But the most important part of preparation in football, other than actual fundamentals, is film study. Whether you are looking at film of yourself or an opponent; this is key.
 
Yeah film study won't hurt. I actually think we likely have a good qb waiting in the wings. The new system worries me more than anything.
 
ArvadaHawk said:
We can agree to disagree on this. But the most important part of preparation in football, other than actual fundamentals, is film study. Whether you are looking at film of yourself or an opponent; this is key.
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And not just that, but the best way to learn is by doing something. I didn't play college football, but having played baseball extensively, I can tell you the most improvement I made pitching came after games in which I got roughed up a little (or a lot). To analogize to a QB coming in in scrub time, just pitching two-thirds of an inning often gave me stuff to work on that I wouldn't have discovered in practice.

It is true that all three guys are going to have the spring and the summer to work, and also that Sokol and CJ were de facto ineligible. All I'm saying is, don't be surprised with another 2-2 non-con next year. Coming in cold with no D1 experience may yield some rough QB play.
 
HawkeyeMHA said:
Yeah film study won't hurt. I actually think we likely have a good qb waiting in the wings. The new system worries me more than anything.
Click to expand...

I agree and, to me, makes it even more puzzling why Rudock recieved no game reps. By default, and because Sokol and Beathard were being redshirted, Rudock was the only available qb to be the #2 and let us not forget that Rudock was also learning the new GD offense (whatever that is). Game reps for Rudock should have been an even higher priority.
 
I'm wondering if this Sokol or beat hard might be more suited than tussock for our new system. Seems like it is more suited for a gun slinger like a Tate vs a jvb? Hopefully one of them fits the bill otherwise, this system will make even a decent qb look miserable.
 
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