Why can't we recruit?

[CPHAWK82]

To say that Kirk and staff don't target any top recruits in just incorrect. We've been in some pretty big recruits. We don't get a lot of them, but every once in a while we do. CJ Fiedorowicz, Andrew Donnal, Rodney Coe, Darian Cooper, Nico Law, Jordan Walsh, Ray Hamilton, Austin Blythe, Jaleel Johnson. (Among others) These are all kids ranked in the top 25 at their positions coming out of high school. Some didn't make it to campus and others are too young to play right now. You just have to hope you recruited the right type of kid who works hard and buys into your system.

 

[vosov]

If Steven Hawking and I were having a discussion on Physics, it would go something like this.

Hawking: "You have no business talking about physics."

Me: "Agreed."

I suggest most of the people talking about recruiting in this thread take the same approach.

 

[TritonHawkeye]

We need a recruiting philosophy in Football similar to the effort McCaffery has put in on the Basketball side.

Yes. Our coach with 92 football wins over 12 seasons needs to take a lesson from a guy who has been here for 18 months and won 11 games.I'm speechless. I think I'm going to have to block this forum from my computer for my own well-being. The meltdowns, at this point, are beyond comical.

Am I in meltdown mode no, do I think Ferentz is a good recruiter ahhh no.

 

[Igothawked]

To say that Kirk and staff don't target any top recruits in just incorrect. We've been in some pretty big recruits. We don't get a lot of them, but every once in a while we do. CJ Fiedorowicz, Andrew Donnal, Rodney Coe, Darian Cooper, Nico Law, Jordan Walsh, Ray Hamilton, Austin Blythe, Jaleel Johnson. (Among others) These are all kids ranked in the top 25 at their positions coming out of high school. Some didn't make it to campus and others are too young to play right now. You just have to hope you recruited the right type of kid who works hard and buys into your system.

I tend to agree with this. The staff is in with a lot of highly ranked players. I don't have that much of a problem with the recruiting per se.
The problem I see is when the players actually get on campus. KF has gone away from his previous identity of "Only upper classmen play" and has started playing freshman. But the problem is he burns redshirts so that guys can mostly play special teams.
I see this as quite a problem. If you notice the special teams has not been as special in the last 3-4 years, which coincides with when the younger guys started filling out the special teams positions. I'm not saying playing them on special teams is wrong, but he often burns redshirts to play guys only on ST and in mop up duty.
I think some of these guys have to play meaningful downs. Take the good with the bad, some of them are playmakers. Canzeri for example, burn his redshirt and then put him back on kickoffs and nothing else. Bullock plays against Tenn Tech, Pitt, and ULM, and nary a down against ISU and Pitt. Nico Law is a playmaker, and I assume he will slide into the safety roll next year after Bernstine graduates. Lomax, plays special teams, bring him in as your nickelback, or Campbell. The D-line recruits of Cooper and Raymon, the d-line is not good and you have a lot of upper classmen, they will be needed next year. Those are two guys you could have burned the redshirt on gotten them on the fiield this year, but they are not.
I guess I just question how they utilize the young players and the red shirts. You got to put some playmakers on the field and see what they can do in meaningful time. There are true freshman all over the B1G playing every down, but not at Iowa.
Marcus Grant is interesting, he has only played mop up duty. What is the point of playing him in that roll? Try him on the field in a 4 or 5 wide set. Why burn his redshirt if he is sitting at 6 or 7 on the WR depth chart? Why use Ray Hamilton for nothing other than mop up duty? Put these guys on the field, all the coaching staff is saying to them is, "we think you might be good in a year or two, but we do not trust you at this point."

Sorry that is my rant. Not so much on recruiting but utilization of recruits. I think this is part of why you see so much roster turnover, the players don't understand how they are being used.

 

[DeputyHawk]

Hell just watch Iowa's game against Penn St. Who would want to play at Iowa after watching that?

 

[HawkPhreek]

Iowa City is Cold and Iowa is boring to watch.

 

[Tmoney12]

So our number of players in the nfl doesn't reflect or have anything to do with wondering if this staff can recruit??? Interesting....

 

[LGEND24]

Hell just watch Iowa's game against Penn St. Who would want to play at Iowa after watching that?

Nice try by pointing to one game to make a point. That would be like saying "who wouldn't want to go to Iowa after they drubbed MSU last year". Fail.

 

[Winterhawk]

I believe our recruiting is a strength in that we have a system that allows us to outplay what would be expected from circumstances outside of our control (population base, location, perception, etc...). This is not to say that we couldn't ever improve something, but rather that this coaching staff has a belief about who plays well in their scheme, and who they can consistently count on getting to come to Iowa. If Iowa thought they could consistently get freak athletes to come play corner and DE here you think they might play more man coverage? Of course, but they know they can't consistently count on that, so they don't plan to succeed on hope that they will pull miracles in recruiting. Likewise, Wisconsin who is used as a target for where Iowa could/should get to, builds their offense around big backs and bigger offensive lines - recruits they know they can get on a consistent basis from their Wisconsin/Minnesota/Illinois recruiting base.

For those of you who watched the B1G Icons on Dan Gable (and for those who haven't, you should) it was interesting to note what they said about his recruiting. I fully acknowledge that Iowa wrestling under Gable and Iowa football under Ferentz are at two different perception levels with their respective recruits, but Gable didn't have the highest rated classes for most, if not all years. He was more interested in the content of their character and work ethic. If I had to guess, that philosophy rubbed off on Ferentz during the 80's, because the way that was stated in the tv special could have come right from Ferentz mouth.

 

[DexterMorgan]

The state of Iowa also develops what might be the least talent out of any state that has a BCS conference school, let alone 2 BCS conference schools.

 

[kmurp]

We will never be a consistent top 15 in recruiting unless we cheat.

 

[hawkIhoops]

Ferentz isn't going to go after kids with issues and I respect him for that. If you land a bunch of top recruits, you typically have more issues in my opinion. I think we have plenty of talent (except D line), it's more of an issue of the staff not playing young guys and building depth. When we get hit with an injury, we are stuck playing a guy with little PT and it shows. MSU rotates about a dozen D linemen in, allowing their starters to be fresh in 4Q.

 

[hawkfarmer]

Ferentz isn't going to go after kids with issues and I respect him for that. If you land a bunch of top recruits, you typically have more issues in my opinion. I think we have plenty of talent (except D line), it's more of an issue of the staff not playing young guys and building depth. When we get hit with an injury, we are stuck playing a guy with little PT and it shows. MSU rotates about a dozen D linemen in, allowing their starters to be fresh in 4Q.

I agree to an extent. How is KF and co supposed to get young DL in when there are hardly any. Is McMinn supposed to get reps when he weighs 219 lbs? Maybe Cooper, but other than that I think most of the young guys are getting reps, they just aren't big/physical enough yet or maybe they're just not good.

 

[hawkeyebob62]

I've always been baffled by the way recruiting works and what goes through recruits heads in college football. It seems like we always end up with an extremely average recruiting class with hardly any 4 and 5 star recruits. I know stars don't mean everything, but usually those players pan out to be better than the 2 and 3 stars.

What's the issue of a recruit coming to play in Iowa? I've never understood the statement other than it's cold during the winter. Durp.

We have extremely nice facilities, a proven coaching staff, a nice campus, solid education, and large fan base. Most of these are some of the best in the country.

I know basketball is completely different and played inside, but how is Fran getting his highly regarded players to come here?

My point is why can our football program never take that next step in the recruiting process and start bringing in top 25 recruiting classes, let alone snagging a couple top 150 players? Wisconsin, Missouri, Nebraska, Stanford, BYU, Vanderbilt, TCU, Virginia, Virginia Tech, and Arizona State have top 25 classes at the moment. I know a lot can change, but there is absolutely no reason that we can't be doing the same.

Are Kirk and company not targeting and pursuing highly rated players hard enough and just letting them go to the big time programs? Or is he satisfied with getting the mostly 3 star class?

It would be a lot of fun seeing Kirk and company develop some of these highly rated players seeing with what the staff can do with these middle of the road players.

Finally, does it bother anyone else that it seems that FSU, ND, Clemson, and South Carolina seem to recruit half of the top 150 year in and year out, yet they hardly produce the results you would expect. IE Florida State this year and they still are signing top end recruits left and right.

First, posts like THIS ^^^ don't help, either with current players or current recruits. And it shows just how uninformed any fan base can be. Second, we don't have the pipeline--ahem, in terms of extra "juice"--that some recruits "require". As an FYI/aside, recruits don't "turn" bad (a la OSU or USC players) because of the school. They, their parents or their guardians are already/inherently bad. And as was pointed out in another thread, KF and staff don't "play" that, nor do they make promises of playing time, or even position.

<<(D)oes it bother anyone else that it seems that FSU, ND, Clemson, and South Carolina seem to recruit half of the top 150 year in and year out, yet they hardly produce the results you would expect>>

You just shot your whole premise down with that statement. KF/staff HAVE gotten a few "big-time"/highly-rated recruits. How many haven't panned out? Yet, the 2008 team b*tch-slapped South Carolina in the Outback Bowl.

It isn't about "ratings", it's about the staff seeing players they can work with, who fit the system and who WANT to work hard and make themselves better.

What do Seantrel Henderson, Gunner Kiel and a host of others have in common? Egotistical/overbearing parents/guardians/advisors who want to run the show. For the class-envy/KF-makes-too-much crowd, that means KF gets paid to do Sean Henderson's or Blair Kiel's "de facto" job. The Occupy Kinnick folks would go nuts.

 

[HawkForce]

Not sure if this thread is serious....