The seating expands rather than stacks up so sound escapes as opposed to being trapped (which would be preferred), that along with fans being so far away from the floor go into not being able to create a real home court advantage. It also makes it harder to sell to recruits.
Where Would You Build a New Arena?
- Thread starter BGOLD
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The seating expands rather than stacks up so sound escapes as opposed to being trapped (which would be preferred), that along with fans being so far away from the floor go into not being able to create a real home court advantage. It also makes it harder to sell to recruits.
1hawkeye1
Well-Known Member
That is absolute gold, GOLD I tell ya!!!
judzeehawk
Well-Known Member
Thank you for your response. I can understand what you are saying about the fans being so far away from the floor. I'm just not sold on the idea of a recruit not choosing Iowa because of that. If the fans got as rabid as they do for the young ladies games I'm here to tell you it's freaking loud. That's what would sell recruits. The women's team has in fact got some recruits just because of the fans being so crazy. Put a fun and exciting team on the floor and I think things would change. I do have a personal bitch about Carver though. I used to buy snacks at the game but the prices have got out of hand so we stop and eat at a nice restaurant before the game.
InGoodCo
Well-Known Member
but there kind of IS something wrong with Carver that putting an exciting basketball team on the floor won't fix ya know? Cause we've had that now going on a season and a half and just having that hasn't fixed it. There's no reason Iowa fans shouldn't be supporting a team that spent 90% of last season in the top 25 and won an NCAA game the season prior. If Iowa was terrible this year, I would understand that, but they aren't. So what gives? Just having a good and exciting team doesn't seem to be fixing the issue.
InGoodCo
Well-Known Member
So top 25 last season isn't enough, does it need to be top 10? Does it need to sustained for multiple seasons? I get the whole, it's the product on the court theory, really I do.... but it doesn't really explain last year and this so far.
I'm guessing TV plays a pretty pivotal role and how accessible all of the games are now. But I think your point still stands when you compare it with attendance at Iowa games vs other schools around the country.
InGoodCo
Well-Known Member
Right, and I get that too....but things have changed considerably since the Mr. Davis era...socially, the way people spend their money, the way they digest their sports etc but Carver hasn't. Games have always been on TV so I don't think that's it. So what is it?
IMO - it's the atmosphere - it's the seating - it's the parking and it's the amenities comparable to other sporting events that are available. Going to Kinnick is an experience. Atmosphere, 2nd to none.... many entrances, tiered seating, a good product, lots of concessions and they keep working to improve the fan experience every year. Outside of the stadium there are a lot of options to do things after and before the game with amazing tailgates. Outside of Carver? At least an hour wait with traffic. Nothing close to walk to for night life. From a fan experience, it's more of a hassle then it's worth IMO. They have crappy food - a 10 mile long wait for an ice cream cone and 300 flights of stairs to take a pee.
I've been of the opinion that Iowa needs a new basketball facility for a long long time now - it's honestly laughable if you experience a game for other programs that have newer facilities. I mean, you will notice the difference in just about every experience you have at a newer facility and you will likely say ... "oh, now I get it"
1977Hawkeye
Well-Known Member
Agree 100%. Carver was rocking in the 80's and even the 90's. It's the product, not the arena. A new arena won't help much if the fan base isn't energized.
sioux34
Well-Known Member
I have been to a number of other arenas, I didnt notice how it is markedly better than carver. Funny you should mention Kinnick. I have quit going to football games. They have shrunk the seat sizes to such an extent that I no longer fit in the seats. For me, the game day experience for football is now better in my livingroom. I still go to games at carver.
1977Hawkeye
Well-Known Member
I don't remember having to listen to many games on the radio during the 80's and 90's. The games were televised then, too, and Carver was nearly full, or full.
InGoodCo
Well-Known Member
Ok, explain last season - 3/4's of it in the top 25, an NCAA appearance and win - it was empty last year. This year, the team is off to a good start. It's empty. If it's the product on the floor, the last season and 10 games seem to disprove that theory. If it's the product excuse, why hasn't it gotten better with a better team? Do they need to sustain it longer? Do they need to be top 10 ? I don't remember the teams in the 80's and 90's really sustaining top 10 rankings or deep tournament runs? The ones that did were outliers.
InGoodCo
Well-Known Member
I always use Nebraska and Creighton's barns to compare and there is no comparison. Escalators in both, places to hang out in both (like a commons area) and watch the game, get food, watch other games etc. The stadiums have bowl levels. You enter your right door, you have a short walk. Bathrooms outside of every entrance. Multiple food options. Several kiosk of different food options, not just stadium food. They have vendors that walk through to stadium and sell drink and food. They have a DJ (I give rats about that, but kids and younger people think that's "dope") playing relevant music. Plenty of parking. You park AT the stadium. It's a novel concept, but one that your casual sport fan enjoys being able to do. Park close to what you're going into. You walk out of them and what do you have? Night life galore...all right across the street. Sports bars, music, fast food, hotels, movie theaters - ya know, civilization.
I live close to 5 hours from IC. I only make 1 or 2 home games a season ....and even THAT little of attendance has me dreading going to Carver.... mostly because the whole experience is gonna suck.
1977Hawkeye
Well-Known Member
The team lost 19 games the year before last, and NIT the year before that. It's been 20 years since our last Sweet 16.
Going back to the 80's, Lute took us to 5 straight tournaments, a Final Four and a Sweet 16. Davis took us to an Elite 8 and a Sweet 16. Davis also took us to 6 dances his first 7 years, and the 92-93 team was in the Top 10 for a while. I think there was maybe more reason for optimism and hope in any given year.
Did attendance not start dropping later in the Davis years, too, once results started dropping off a bit?
I'm not sure the Alford and Lickliter era, followed by a coach that has failed to earn better than a 7 seed and a 2nd round tournament appearance, is quite enough to get people excited. But I'm just speculating. That's how I feel, anyway.
InGoodCo
Well-Known Member
And that's fair - but Iowa has been to 4 of the last 6 NCAA's including last seasons....eventually we're not gonna be able to use the "it's the product on the floor" excuse for that dump that everyone seems to hold so dearly.
InGoodCo
Well-Known Member
And that's fair and you are probably right. I just was pointing out that just having a good team doesn't seem to be enough. Cause we've had that and it hasn't really mattered. So, instead of saying the product on the floor, maybe it's better stated by "Iowa hasn't won anything of relevance in 20 years and it's going to take something like that for the crowd to come back" .... cause THAT I totally buy.
sioux34
Well-Known Member
I think that's two ways of saying the same thing.
1977Hawkeye
Well-Known Member
Yeah I agree, and that's what I suspect. I agree with Sioux - It'll take some time to really bring back the fan base, because it didn't disappear overnight, either. Fran has had some success, yes, but just am not sure it's been sustained enough and/or at a high enough level.
Speaking for myself, I also am gun shy from some of the late season meltdowns. I count 3 times on Fran's watch where things were looking great, and then the calendar turned to February. I think it was 2013-14 and 2015-16 where the team was Top 5-10 nationally in January, then totally imploded. Last year honestly wasn't a whole lot better, but at least they made a decent NCAA showing.
