Trump supporters, how do you square this?

I agree with you for the most part but see Ukraine as an issue that must be gotten right and Trump is on the wrong side of it. We have wasted billions of dollars since WW2 because of Russia. In the long run beating them into a different type of government will be to our great benefit.

Ukraine is a stepping-stone for Putin, the Eastern European countries on the Russian Border are targeted

Putin's Ego is monstrous and he is borderline insane, IMHO
 
This whole "he's not a career politician" bullshit is so stupid (Was he not the President for 4 years???). If a person is a terrible human being, they're a terrible human being. He's been a terrible business person his whole life and and a worse moral character. Oh, but he's Christian...he's as Christian as the Sun is purple. He's a pathetic leader who never takes responsibility for anything, lies constantly, never pays for what he owes and for some reason so many of his followers thing he's the next Jesus Christ. Man, you people are so exhausting.

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I don't think comparing Trump to prior fascist dictators convinces any trump supporter to move away from him. We are so desensitized by Godwin's Law: for the last 2 decades, we have fairly consistently heard Bush, Obama, and Trump all compared to Hitler. Further, we envision Nazi Germany as this monstrosity that could never happen again, the German citizens as either horrifically racist or inconceivably gullible. We are not like that.

Guess what? Neither were those Germans prior to being led to that state by a charismatic leader who preached nationalism, grievance, and a common enemy they could focus their hatred upon. I really do NOT think we will become Nazi Germany, I think we have enough guard rails in place and a strong enough counter-balance to Trump's fascist tendencies, and overall most people in this country have it pretty good (much of the grievance is contrived).

But it is hard to not think of the Kristallnacht when Trump starts hammering his mass deportation plan. There are already paramilitary organizations (analogs to the SA, or "brown shirts") working throughout our country to locate illegal immigrants. In a recent speech, Trump said something to the effect of...we have people ready to take care of these immigrants, and they will be allowed to do so (paraphrased). It was not clear if he was talking about US Law Enforcement, Military, or something else, but it certainly could have been taken as a call to arms for these militias (much like his "stand back and stand by" was in 2016).

I am sure this seems hyperbolic to anyone who supports Trump, and I hope it is truly hyperbole. But it is hard to not see parallels.

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Kristallnacht
 
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No. Our military is bigger, more well-trained, more well-equipped, and has exponentially farther reach and logistics than the rest of the worlds' militaries combined. Like it or not, there's one thing our country knows better than anything else, and that's how to go to war and how to blow up persons, places, and things. Russia and all their supposed might as the 2nd most powerful military in the world can't even take over a section of land in Ukraine the size of like 20 counties in Iowa reliably. Like all their conventional weapons and forces, their nuclear arsenal is also in a state of disrepair and dysfunction. This war in Ukraine has shown that without a doubt there isn't a force on this planet even close to being able to do anything more than a proverbial mosquito bite if they squared off with us. We have 11 full strength aircraft carrier strike groups all over the globe, each with a full complement of destroyers and missile cruisers keeping watch. Not to mention submarines and every other base scattered from here to infinity. Seriously, google "world militaries compared" to see stats on our Army, Navy, Air Force and Marines and look at the equipment, ships, and planes. Any of our 4 branches individually towers over the next largest full militaries.

And let's say someone tried it made an actual dent in our military, what the f*ck are they going to do when they get here to take over?

Name another country on Earth that has 350,000,000 people spread over 3.8 million square miles owning 433,000,000 firearms. Did you see how riled up our populace got after 9/11? There's a really, REALLY good reason we've never been attacked by anything other than religious extremist wackos since 1941. One bomb dropped by Russia/China within our borders would be the end of both of those coutries immediately. Nukes or no nukes. My money after seeing Russia's fake news military is on no nukes.

One thing is for sure, for all our faults we are rabidly patriotic and when some outsider f*cks with any of us we get really goddamn angry, our differences (temprarily) get put aside, and entire countries start getting rearranged.

It might not be that way for the rest of time, but as long as we and our next few generations are alive it will be.

Yeah, any country attempting to invade America doesn't just have the Military to be concerned about

American citizens might have more AK-47s and such weapons than many foreign militaries
 
It's so funny how you completely forgot the last umpteen times our military tried to invade another country. Do you think someone in Russia at some point typed up your exact post about us trying to kick Afghanistan's ass?

The issue with Mexico is how fast a nuke would hit us from right next door compared to across the world. It would give us no time to retaliate. If what you are saying is true, why did we make such a big deal of Russia bringing missiles to Cuba? If Russia decides ending civilization is the better option than losing, our military won't stop it buddy. All we can do is kill them too.

Afghanistan hasn't been controlled/conquered since Genghis Khan

The terrain and fanatical religions folk like the Taliban are serious obstacles
 
Damn. Wish I could post a couple of emojis.

Windows 11​

  1. Access the emoji keyboard by pressing Windows key+. (period).
  2. In the window that opens, click the
    Show emojis icon on the Windows 11 touch keyboard.
    icon at the top of the window. You may also click the arrow to the right of the Emoji section header.
Emojis and GIFs window in Windows 11.
 
I'm not surprised to read something like this. It was a pretty long article I tried to read while my kid is subbed out of a soccer game. I didn't see where it got into the specifics of exactly what was updated. Was it in there and I missed it?

“The previous revision of DoDD 5240.01 was issued on March 22, 2019,” Sue Gough, spokesperson for the Department of Defense, told us in an email. “Reissuing 5240.01 was part of normal business of the Department to periodically update guidance and policy.”

The procedure for reissuing policies like this involves five stages of development and review and takes at least six months, according to department instructions.

“The release was in no way timed in relation to the election or any other event,” Gough said.

Furthermore, the portion of the revised policy that’s the focus of most social media posts isn’t anything new.

Posts on this issue typically cite a paragraph specifying one of the situations in which the secretary of defense may approve a request for help from state or local law enforcement agencies.

The paragraph says the secretary may approve requests for (emphasis is ours): “Assistance in responding with assets with potential for lethality, or any situation in which it is reasonably foreseeable that providing the requested assistance may involve the use of force that is likely to result in lethal force, including death or serious bodily injury. It also includes all support to civilian law enforcement officials in situations where a confrontation between civilian law enforcement and civilian individuals or groups is reasonably anticipated. Such use of force must be in accordance with DoDD 5210.56, potentially as further restricted based on the specifics of the requested support.”

The phrases “potential for lethality” and “lethal force” are often emphasized in social media posts.

While that language is new to DoDD 5240.01, “it does not represent any change to DoD’s policy regarding the use of lethal force, which is addressed in DoDD 5210.56, ‘Arming and the Use of Force,'” Gough said. “The revised 5240.01 simply describes how this long-standing policy applies to the DoD intelligence community.”
 
“The previous revision of DoDD 5240.01 was issued on March 22, 2019,” Sue Gough, spokesperson for the Department of Defense, told us in an email. “Reissuing 5240.01 was part of normal business of the Department to periodically update guidance and policy.”

The procedure for reissuing policies like this involves five stages of development and review and takes at least six months, according to department instructions.

“The release was in no way timed in relation to the election or any other event,” Gough said.

Furthermore, the portion of the revised policy that’s the focus of most social media posts isn’t anything new.

Posts on this issue typically cite a paragraph specifying one of the situations in which the secretary of defense may approve a request for help from state or local law enforcement agencies.

The paragraph says the secretary may approve requests for (emphasis is ours): “Assistance in responding with assets with potential for lethality, or any situation in which it is reasonably foreseeable that providing the requested assistance may involve the use of force that is likely to result in lethal force, including death or serious bodily injury. It also includes all support to civilian law enforcement officials in situations where a confrontation between civilian law enforcement and civilian individuals or groups is reasonably anticipated. Such use of force must be in accordance with DoDD 5210.56, potentially as further restricted based on the specifics of the requested support.”

The phrases “potential for lethality” and “lethal force” are often emphasized in social media posts.

While that language is new to DoDD 5240.01, “it does not represent any change to DoD’s policy regarding the use of lethal force, which is addressed in DoDD 5210.56, ‘Arming and the Use of Force,'” Gough said. “The revised 5240.01 simply describes how this long-standing policy applies to the DoD intelligence community.”
Am I reading that wrong or something? I don't see anything that shows exactly what the new changes to the existing one were.
 
This just isn't cool, and it is straight out of an authoritarian's playbook:

He's saying that after they doctored an answer during a 60 minutes interview to make the answer sound not so horrible. Doing that is worse than creating the very fine people hoax.

I assume you think there are countries with medias that's are simply government propaganda? For instance North Korea? If you think that, would you think it would be authoritarian for a politician to call them out?

My point is, I believe it would only be wrong for Trump to say that if it weren't true. After covid, very fine people, bloodbath, 60 minutes editing, and a million other examples, it's pretty obvious it's true. Just the way they all use the exact same terminology at the exact same time (like the Biden is sharp as a tack one every media outlet used for a handful of days) makes it blatantly obvious it's a coordinated effort.
 
Am I reading that wrong or something? I don't see anything that shows exactly what the new changes to the existing one were.

Basically, there was no change in any policy. But, the language clarified that their existing policy governing potential use of lethal force by Department of Defense personnel also applies to DoD intelligence personnel.
 
He's saying that after they doctored an answer during a 60 minutes interview to make the answer sound not so horrible. Doing that is worse than creating the very fine people hoax.

I assume you think there are countries with medias that's are simply government propaganda? For instance North Korea? If you think that, would you think it would be authoritarian for a politician to call them out?

My point is, I believe it would only be wrong for Trump to say that if it weren't true. After covid, very fine people, bloodbath, 60 minutes editing, and a million other examples, it's pretty obvious it's true. Just the way they all use the exact same terminology at the exact same time (like the Biden is sharp as a tack one every media outlet used for a handful of days) makes it blatantly obvious it's a coordinated effort.

60 minutes was not trying to hide anything. They are the ones that posted the video in question to twitter. When they later broadcast their show, minor edits were made for time. That is not a conspiracy...if they were trying to hide something, they would not have posted the video to twitter. It certainly is not close to as egregious as what Fox does for Trump.


And yet, the Harris campaign has not called out Fox for that editing practice, and certainly none of them have called Fox an enemy of the people.

We can probably wrap this up, as we have noticed before, we have very different ways of understanding what is true in the world. You seem perfectly happy with the information your algorithms are feeding you and do not seem especially receptive to more reputable sources.
 
Because this got so far away from the original topic, just to reiterate...

Nearly half of Trump's cabinet, his Vice President, and numerous lower level staffers have not endorsed his campaign.

His first term was characterized by dysfunction within the executive branch, a stark inability to advance any sort of meaningful legislation aside from his tax cut though Republicans controlled both houses of Congress in the first half of his term, a massive failure of leadership under pressure (COVID), and an unwillingness to concede a lost election. As a cherry on the cake, he also retained classified documents after his presidency, failed to return them upon request, and actively tried to cover up his retention of said documents.

If elected, he would be the oldest person ever elected president. I will not speculate on his physical or cognitive health, but being president is a pretty demanding job for any 80 year old.

If that sounds like USA's best path forward, have at it, I guess. But I don't think it is possible for someone to present with any more red flags than this.
 
I still haven't decided on who I'll vote for. I agree with Trump on a good chunk of his policies (mostly disagree on his approach to Ukraine which I think is personal for him).

You can tell his strongest policy positions by what Biden retained (China tairiffs), and what he eventually reverted to (executive action to close the border). But it doesn't seem like he has any sort of coherent plan moving forward...he is just promising to get rid of practically everyone's taxes, and he wants universal tairiffs. Economists are pretty unanimous in panning those ideas.

And, of course, his mass deportation. While I am all for beefing up border security, this mass deportation thing has chaos written all over it. I hope we never have to see how that plays out.

This was a pretty good recent podcast I listened to with Oren Cass and Zachary Carter, laying out a leftist and rightist case for economic policy:

I think Cass does a good job in defending and rationalizing some of Trump's policies, past and future, and I felt I learned quite a bit from it.
 
60 minutes was not trying to hide anything. They are the ones that posted the video in question to twitter. When they later broadcast their show, minor edits were made for time. That is not a conspiracy...if they were trying to hide something, they would not have posted the video to twitter. It certainly is not close to as egregious as what Fox does for Trump.


And yet, the Harris campaign has not called out Fox for that editing practice, and certainly none of them have called Fox an enemy of the people.

We can probably wrap this up, as we have noticed before, we have very different ways of understanding what is true in the world. You seem perfectly happy with the information your algorithms are feeding you and do not seem especially receptive to more reputable sources.
It's a very fair point that fox news does it too. But you're really watering down that point by pretending what CBS did was less bad than what Fox did. I'd say it's exactly the same thing if anything. But also, didn't the original clip 60 minutes posted get taken down? I thought it did. If it's true it did get taken down, then that means it got bad publicity so they did damage control. It even says in the link you posted they refuse to hand over the original interview.
 
Because this got so far away from the original topic, just to reiterate...

Nearly half of Trump's cabinet, his Vice President, and numerous lower level staffers have not endorsed his campaign.

His first term was characterized by dysfunction within the executive branch, a stark inability to advance any sort of meaningful legislation aside from his tax cut though Republicans controlled both houses of Congress in the first half of his term, a massive failure of leadership under pressure (COVID), and an unwillingness to concede a lost election. As a cherry on the cake, he also retained classified documents after his presidency, failed to return them upon request, and actively tried to cover up his retention of said documents.

If elected, he would be the oldest person ever elected president. I will not speculate on his physical or cognitive health, but being president is a pretty demanding job for any 80 year old.

If that sounds like USA's best path forward, have at it, I guess. But I don't think it is possible for someone to present with any more red flags than this.
Biden had classified documents that he wasn't supposed to even have in the first place as a senator. But in his defense, he probably had no idea he even had them. What's the point of having classified documents anyway? Just take a picture of them. That's why I don't really believe either the Biden or Trump documents story.
 
You can tell his strongest policy positions by what Biden retained (China tairiffs), and what he eventually reverted to (executive action to close the border). But it doesn't seem like he has any sort of coherent plan moving forward...he is just promising to get rid of practically everyone's taxes, and he wants universal tairiffs. Economists are pretty unanimous in panning those ideas.

And, of course, his mass deportation. While I am all for beefing up border security, this mass deportation thing has chaos written all over it. I hope we never have to see how that plays out.

This was a pretty good recent podcast I listened to with Oren Cass and Zachary Carter, laying out a leftist and rightist case for economic policy:

I think Cass does a good job in defending and rationalizing some of Trump's policies, past and future, and I felt I learned quite a bit from it.
I dont see how no income taxes could be a bad thing if it's possible to make it work. Are they saying it will he bad because it will increase our debt? I don't know enough about it. I also don't see why we don't just start drilling like crazy and export a bunch of oil to pay our debt. All we do now is take a third of everyone's money and it's still not enough after we give most of it away.
 
Trump is trying to bring American companies back to America. That's a pretty major thing he's trying to do that would be really good for the country. His new talking point is he threatened a car manufacturer out of Detroit (not sure which one) that he was would tairiff the shit out of them if they go to Mexico. Now they announced they aren't leaving. Is that story true? I guess it's possible it's not and I'm guessing you are going to say it's not. But preventing manufacturing from leaving the country is a really good thing. We need a lot more of that.
 
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