To rob

[HawkGold]

you're conflating things because you're losing the debate . . . but thanx for making it clear you're not a fan of free speech . . . shocking that a political ideology which can't win debates would want to shut down ideas and speech

Thx Robert E Lee

 

[HerkyMcHerky]

Yes. I 100% support the work you're doing Rob.

Please do not cave to anyone making an effort to mute you whether its folks leaving HN, HN owners or if anyone associated with the UI.

I haven't commented on this yet because this event has struck me at my core. I'm a UI grad, fan of all our sports teams and academic departments. To me, my alma mater is the 1st public univ to admit women equally and among the pioneer universities to desegregate colleges of advanced degrees (Law) and athletic teams in 1895.

Growing up in rural Iowa in the 80s, the Iowa football and basketball program were points of pride to a little kid. While that maintained, it has grown into a deep pride in the actual university and what it stands for...at least to me.

What I've heard these young men say about their time in Iowa football deeply troubles me. Further, it runs contrary to what, I believe, The Univ of Iowa stands for. It is shameful, irregardless of success on/off the field, anyone in the Hawkeye football family was spoken to in such a manner. You do not treat humans in such a manner; particularly when these "coaches" likely stood in these families' living rooms, hugged their moms and dads and the fact the child was off to play D1 football for a man, seemingly of high character, was a major point of pride for the family and the communities/schools to which they came. The families trusted KF.

While some changes have occurred that seem to be pointing in the right direction, I'm still not convinced the reconstruction should be left to the family Ferentz. I've always been a KF guy. Based on the narrow view of the man we, as fans/alumni, see...up to 4 weeks ago, I'd say he was the best man in college football. Obviously, that is not the case. I cannot believe for a second, that someone in charge of a program as air-tight as Iowa for 20 years is ignorant to the behaviors of his staff as described by current and former players.

Please keep at it. Find the answers. Go beyond the surface or what the UI wants us to know. It is time the current and former players have a voice.

If, in the end, there was no wrongdoing by the staff, so be it. Otherwise, the house needs cleaned.

 

[jparmley3]

Thank you for sharing your story. I appreciate the service of your family members and am sorry for your loss.

What I wrote a few weeks ago is that the players should be allowed to make up their own minds on what to do during the anthem. If you feel like standing because of what you feel the flag represents, stand. If you feel like kneeling because of how you feel about what the flag represents, then kneel. And if players kneeling offends you to the point that you no longer support them, they have said they're OK with you walking away.

Thinking that you can get more than 100 players to agree on what to do or think alike on this topic is naive, IMO.

 

[RobHowe]

Yes. I 100% support the work you're doing Rob.

Please do not cave to anyone making an effort to mute you whether its folks leaving HN, HN owners or if anyone associated with the UI.

I haven't commented on this yet because this event has struck me at my core. I'm a UI grad, fan of all our sports teams and academic departments. To me, my alma mater is the 1st public univ to admit women equally and among the pioneer universities to desegregate colleges of advanced degrees (Law) and athletic teams in 1895.

Growing up in rural Iowa in the 80s, the Iowa football and basketball program were points of pride to a little kid. While that maintained, it has grown into a deep pride in the actual university and what it stands for...at least to me.

What I've heard these young men say about their time in Iowa football deeply troubles me. Further, it runs contrary to what, I believe, The Univ of Iowa stands for. It is shameful, irregardless of success on/off the field, anyone in the Hawkeye football family was spoken to in such a manner. You do not treat humans in such a manner; particularly when these "coaches" likely stood in these families' living rooms, hugged their moms and dads and the fact the child was off to play D1 football for a man, seemingly of high character, was a major point of pride for the family and the communities/schools to which they came. The families trusted KF.

While some changes have occurred that seem to be pointing in the right direction, I'm still not convinced the reconstruction should be left to the family Ferentz. I've always been a KF guy. Based on the narrow view of the man we, as fans/alumni, see...up to 4 weeks ago, I'd say he was the best man in college football. Obviously, that is not the case. I cannot believe for a second, that someone in charge of a program as air-tight as Iowa for 20 years is ignorant to the behaviors of his staff as described by current and former players.

Please keep at it. Find the answers. Go beyond the surface or what the UI wants us to know. It is time the current and former players have a voice.

If, in the end, there was no wrongdoing by the staff, so be it. Otherwise, the house needs cleaned.

Appreciate the kind words and support.

As I've said, I've tried to do my job and explained why I covered the story the way I did. Some folks don't think I've done that. I think my energy can be spent in better ways that trying to convince them differently.

I've taken heat before in this job. I remember writing about 20 years ago when I was at the ICPC that chances were good that through the years, some Hawkeyes on the football and men's basketball team for whom fans rooted were gay. Received a few death threats and plenty of invitations to leave the state. And that was before social media and the explosion of the internet.

 

[ForeverHawk]

Gundy's first amendment rights were not violated. The school did not threaten to fire him over the shirt he wore. It also did not force him to stop wearing the shirt or apologize.

How were his first amendment rights violated?

ANSWER THE QUESTION

I'm not saying your are wrong and I have no idea. But, do you know specifically from sources that Gundy was not forced to apologize and that his job was not threatened?

 

[Ree4]

I'm not saying your are wrong and I have no idea. But, do you know specifically from sources that Gundy was not forced to apologize and that his job was not threatened?

From wiki: The burden of proof is usually on the person who brings a claim in a dispute. It is often associated with the Latin maxim semper necessitas probandi incumbit ei qui agit, a translation of which in this context is: "the necessity of proof always lies with the person who lays charges."

In this case it lies with the person who thinks he was "forced to apologize". In this case especially (if there is any proof), it's a hell of a lot easier to prove that an apology was forced than it wasn't.

 

[Fryowa]

I'm not saying your are wrong and I have no idea. But, do you know specifically from sources that Gundy was not forced to apologize and that his job was not threatened?

1) Unless he was held at gunpoint or his physical heath was threatened, he wasn't "forced" to do anything.

2) Even if his job was threatened and he was given an ultimatum, it wouldn't be illegal. People get fired or suspended all the time for what they do or say in public. If the OSU athletic department's position was that it did not want it's image associated with what it interprets to be racist and inflammatory positions held by OAN, it has every right to part ways or issue an ultimatum. There is nothing illegal about that.

Whether it's right or wrong is up for debate, but it's not illegal.

Again, any public statement or action (and yes, a logo on a t-shirt is a public statement) is and always has been plainly understood as open to criticism. If that criticism leads to backlash against your employer and they terminate you because of it, that's not illegal.

Let's say you own one of two car dealerships in town, and one of your employees puts a post on facebook wearing a t-shirt from the other dealership. Obviously this is not a good look for you at all, and if you decide to fire him are you saying you that would be violating his 1st Amendment rights? No way.

How about if you call him in your office and say, "Look Bob, if you wanna do stuff like that I can't have you working here, but I'm a fair guy and I want to give you another chance. If you want to stay here I'd like you to call everyone together in the meeting room and apologize to your co-workers. If not, we have to part ways." Is that violating Bob's 1st Amendment rights? Nope.

You can be mad as hell about it and write nasty letters to OSU or say you're boycotting college football because it isn't fair, and you might even be right. But it's not a violation of anyone's constitutional rights and it's not illegal.

 

[ForeverHawk]

1) Unless he was held at gunpoint or his physical heath was threatened, he wasn't "forced" to do anything.

2) Even if his job was threatened and he was given an ultimatum, it wouldn't be illegal. People get fired or suspended all the time for what they do or say in public. If the OSU athletic department's position was that it did not want it's image associated with what it interprets to be racist and inflammatory positions held by OAN, it has every right to part ways or issue an ultimatum. There is nothing illegal about that.

Whether it's right or wrong is up for debate, but it's not illegal.

Again, any public statement or action (and yes, a logo on a t-shirt is a public statement) is and always has been plainly understood as open to criticism. If that criticism leads to backlash against your employer and they terminate you because of it, that's not illegal.

Let's say you own one of two car dealerships in town, and one of your employees puts a post on facebook wearing a t-shirt from the other dealership. Obviously this is not a good look for you at all, and if you decide to fire him are you saying you that would be violating his 1st Amendment rights? No way.

How about if you call him in your office and say, "Look Bob, if you wanna do stuff like that I can't have you working here, but I'm a fair guy and I want to give you another chance. If you want to stay here I'd like you to call everyone together in the meeting room and apologize to your co-workers. If not, we have to part ways." Is that violating Bob's 1st Amendment rights? Nope.

You can be mad as hell about it and write nasty letters to OSU or say you're boycotting college football because it isn't fair, and you might even be right. But it's not a violation of anyone's constitutional rights and it's not illegal.

That still leaves us not knowing if he was forced to apologize or had his job threatened. Legal or not, we just don't know, that's why I asked Rob if he knew.

 

[Katan]

That still leaves us not knowing if he was forced to apologize or had his job threatened. Legal or not, we just don't know, that's why I asked Rob if he knew.

Or if he did out of a realization of his long term self interest. All of us act out of self interest.

By the way, Rob. This board is a dumpster fire. I used to occasionally come here to talk Hawks, now I come here to see the human condition play out in the worst of ways. Just change the website name to some sort of political name so that those that want to talk Hawks can go somewhere else.

 

[RobHowe]

Or if he did out of a realization of his long term self interest. All of us act out of self interest.

By the way, Rob. This board is a dumpster fire. I used to occasionally come here to talk Hawks, now I come here to see the human condition play out in the worst of ways. Just change the website name to some sort of political name so that those that want to talk Hawks can go somewhere else.

Let’s stick to sports...

 

[HawkGold]

Or if he did out of a realization of his long term self interest. All of us act out of self interest.

By the way, Rob. This board is a dumpster fire. I used to occasionally come here to talk Hawks, now I come here to see the human condition play out in the worst of ways. Just change the website name to some sort of political name so that those that want to talk Hawks can go somewhere else.

KF is the one that caused this. To ignore the issue would be wrong. You are projecting on the wrong person.

 

[Katan]

KF is the one that caused this. To ignore the issue would be wrong. You are projecting on the wrong person.

I want to have your free time. I could only imagine the positive outcomes for me and others would have with what you've put into this board.

 

[Katan]

Let’s stick to sports...

Dude, do you get click revenue? This is insane.

Fokker, out.

 

[RobHowe]

Dude, do you get click revenue? This is insane.

Fokker, out.

Site traffic is fine. Thanks for your concern.

If you don’t want to be here, just go. You don’t have to let us know. We’ll be ok.

 

[HawkGold]

I want to have your free time. I could only imagine the positive outcomes for me and others would have with what you've put into this board.

I do just fine.