Some reflections that you may wish to ignore...

[doclee]

I attended the Iowa vs MSU game last night and have some thoughts to share.

1. The officials did not cost Iowa the game.
2. Probably our free throw shooting failures were the difference.
3. Tom Izzo has always been a great coach.
4. I have lost all respect for him.
5. MSU committed 29 fouls this game.
6. During Iowa's failure to score a field goal during a 15 minute stretch, which involved 12 possessions, MSU committed 8 fouls (Iowa missed several free throws).
7. 29 fouls by MSU Means that, if my math is correct, that MSU committed a foul every 1.37 minutes.
8. In overtime, the five players on the floor for MSU had accumulated a total of 17 fouls.
9. So, it does not seem unreasonable to conclude that Izzo built his game plan around purposely fouling Iowa, sometimes very hard, in order to swing the game in his favor.
10. I guess in this day and age, that means Izzo is a good coach and Iowa lacks toughness.

In my day, Izzo would have been suspended and fined for poor sportsmanship. As the saying goes, "This is no Country for old men." I guess I will have to get used to understanding that "it is only about the W" or in our larger world, "it's all about the $$".

i guess I can live with being naive.

 

[loesshillshawk]

I attended the Iowa vs MSU game last night and have some thoughts to share.

1. The officials did not cost Iowa the game.
2. Probably our free throw shooting failures were the difference.
3. Tom Izzo has always been a great coach.
4. I have lost all respect for him.
5. MSU committed 29 fouls this game.
6. During Iowa's failure to score a field goal during a 15 minute stretch, which involved 12 possessions, MSU committed 8 fouls (Iowa missed several free throws).
7. 29 fouls by MSU Means that, if my math is correct, that MSU committed a foul every 1.37 minutes.
8. In overtime, the five players on the floor for MSU had accumulated a total of 17 fouls.
9. So, it does not seem unreasonable to conclude that Izzo built his game plan around purposely fouling Iowa, sometimes very hard, in order to swing the game in his favor.
10. I guess in this day and age, that means Izzo is a good coach and Iowa lacks toughness.

In my day, Izzo would have been suspended and fined for poor sportsmanship. As the saying goes, "This is no Country for old men." I guess I will have to get used to understanding that "it is only about the W" or in our larger world, "it's all about the $$".

i guess I can live with being naive.

There is a big oak tree on Melrose...go hug it

 

[volhawk50]

Not sure why you think hand-check fouls are evidence that Izzo was intentionally fouling, and I'm not sure why you think that, with his short bench and Iowa's inability to make a field goal against his defense, Izzo would think it prudent to accumulate a ton of fouls and give Iowa a bunch of free throw opportunities. If he had it his way we would not have scored at all in the last 10 minutes, because we would not have shot a single free throw.

 

[duhawk70]

I agree with the OP. Even though we think MSU had a short bench, Izzo played ten players with only one (Gauna) playing less than 12 minutes. He also substituted almost every time a foul was called, constantly rotating players esp his frontline. This slowed the game down and made it what it turned out to be. we need to remember that even players on the deep pine are usually pretty highly rated HS players.

In addition to the hand checks, there was quite a lot of hacking under thebasket. Valentine was adept at this as was Byrd, Kaminski, Schilling and Costello. Five Spartans had 4 fouls.

 

[kicker22]

While the free throw shooting hurt us, I don't think it was nearly as costly as not hitting a field goal for 15 minutes. I think its fair to say, that shooting from the stripe as pourly as we did, that if we hit even 2 or 3 field goals during the drought its a different outcome.

As far as Izzo goes. I may be on the outside thinking that a great coach came up with a game plan that beat us. If they were fouling to get fresh players into the game to help a depleted bench get some rest then so be it. I don't think that was his plan, as I think his halftime interview, more than displayed anger toward how he thought the game was being called, but if it was why fault it. The fact is, it's up to the players to make the most of the free throws and knock them down. If I'm coaching and against a team that is struggling from the stripe, I'll make them earn it, especially when its a tight game and every empty possession is beneficial.

 

[tm3308]

While the free throw shooting hurt us, I don't think it was nearly as costly as not hitting a field goal for 15 minutes. I think its fair to say, that shooting from the stripe as pourly as we did, that if we hit even 2 or 3 field goals during the drought its a different outcome.

As far as Izzo goes. I may be on the outside thinking that a great coach came up with a game plan that beat us. If they were fouling to get fresh players into the game to help a depleted bench get some rest then so be it. I don't think that was his plan, as I think his halftime interview, more than displayed anger toward how he thought the game was being called, but if it was why fault it. The fact is, it's up to the players to make the most of the free throws and knock them down. If I'm coaching and against a team that is struggling from the stripe, I'll make them earn it, especially when its a tight game and every empty possession is beneficial.

The hole in this theory is that Iowa could hardly get a shot off without getting fouled. MSU essentially took away our ability to make field goals by simply fouling (whether they did it by design or not, it doesn't matter; the effect was the same). So when you're left with having to do most of your scoring from the FT line, you've got to hit them while you're there.

 

[kicker22]

The hole in this theory is that Iowa could hardly get a shot off without getting fouled. MSU essentially took away our ability to make field goals by simply fouling (whether they did it by design or not, it doesn't matter; the effect was the same). So when you're left with having to do most of your scoring from the FT line, you've got to hit them while you're there.

Point taken. But when your playing a team that is in that much foul trouble at one point do you start attacking those guys and going to the basket. It's a double bladed sword I guess as if we were hitting the free throws then we most likely would have had more offensive opportunities to make field goals.

 

[HawkMD2007]

I still probably trade Fran for Tom......

 

[tm3308]

Point taken. But when your playing a team that is in that much foul trouble at one point do you start attacking those guys and going to the basket. It's a double bladed sword I guess as if we were hitting the free throws then we most likely would have had more offensive opportunities to make field goals.

I thought we did plenty of that, honestly. They had five guys with four fouls and another with three. Izzo just kept rotating guys in and out to avoid fouling anyone out.

 

[volhawk50]

I thought we did plenty of that, honestly. They had five guys with four fouls and another with three. Izzo just kept rotating guys in and out to avoid fouling anyone out.

So what you may be saying is Iowa outplayed Michigan State, but Izzo beat Fran so bad it didn't matter? That's pretty much how it felt at many times during the game.

 

[tm3308]

So what you may be saying is Iowa outplayed Michigan State, but Izzo beat Fran so bad it didn't matter? That's pretty much how it felt at many times during the game.

I guess you could say that, but I wasn't really making a commentary either way on that point. I think if we really wanted to claim that we outplayed them, we needed to hit a few more of the FT's. And as the game wore on, it just seemed like there wasn't any way Appling was going to let them lose that game. That guy is the B1G POY, IMO.

 

[CPHAWK82]

Izzo's game plan was simple. They were under manned so he wanted his guys to come in and out physical and out hustle Iowa which they did. I think I read they were 8 out of 10 in 50/50 balls. Iowa ended up getting the benefit of their physical play in getting to free throw line over 40 times and didn't hit enough of them. Iowa's misses at the FT line became a good defense for MSU. "Hack em and they might get 1 point out of it" It was very frustrating to watch. You could almost see the thought bubbles over their heads while at the FT line. Izzo made the Hawks have to earn it in a spot everyone could see they were struggling at. I don't think that makes him a dirty coach either. No mercy…Killer instinct are something his teams always have.

 

[GVGiant44]

While the free throw shooting hurt us, I don't think it was nearly as costly as not hitting a field goal for 15 minutes. I think its fair to say, that shooting from the stripe as poorly as we did, that if we hit even 2 or 3 field goals during the drought its a different outcome.

Sorry pal. I get what you are saying about the field goals. But we were given 41 chances at the free-throw line, and we left thirteen freebies bouncing off the rim. And that doesn't even include the fact that at least three of those were front-ends of one-and-ones. And this is in front of the home folks!

Few were immune from this collective gack. There was a rumor that Uthoff, and to a lesser extent McCabe, were two of our better free-throw shooters. They combined for one-for-four. Point guard Gesell, who should be the closest thing we have to Mr. Automatic, bounced two off down the stretch that we just plain had to have. And we know we are running a risk playing Woodbury down the stretch because of his poor free-throw shooting. For once, Marble was better than he has been, but earlier in the year, teams were fouling him down the stretch knowing he'd miss the freebies.

I'll say it - we fix this, and no one will stop us. If we don't, we're going to keep wondering how we lose games like these.

 

[damnfinn]

this would appear to be a very good strategy against this Iowa team. Not only are we missing free throws, the game is getting slowed down to a Lickliter pace. This team is at its very best and can beat anyone when it can run and gun.

 

[22hawkeyes]

So what you may be saying is Iowa outplayed Michigan State, but Izzo beat Fran so bad it didn't matter? That's pretty much how it felt at many times during the game.

The only thing I think Fran does not excel at is exploiting match ups. Not just in this game, but all year. We find a good match up and get 4-10 pts off of it in a short period of time, and never go back to it. Sometimes we never even find it. Our random motion offense creates mismatches in man coverage, and it seems that we simply fail to exploit them. IMO

 

[volhawk50]

The only thing I think Fran does not excel at is exploiting match ups. Not just in this game, but all year. We find a good match up and get 4-10 pts off of it in a short period of time, and never go back to it. Sometimes we never even find it. Our random motion offense creates mismatches in man coverage, and it seems that we simply fail to exploit them. IMO

100% agree.

 

[hawkfan33]

The only thing I think Fran does not excel at is exploiting match ups. Not just in this game, but all year. We find a good match up and get 4-10 pts off of it in a short period of time, and never go back to it. Sometimes we never even find it. Our random motion offense creates mismatches in man coverage, and it seems that we simply fail to exploit them. IMO

We do a very poor job of entering the ball to the post. This is nothing new. When White or Uthoff or Basabe had Trice or some other guard on them we have to get them the ball right away. Too many times we failed to enter the ball to them and simply reversed the ball.

 

[Knight78]

The hole in this theory is that Iowa could hardly get a shot off without getting fouled. MSU essentially took away our ability to make field goals by simply fouling (whether they did it by design or not, it doesn't matter; the effect was the same). So when you're left with having to do most of your scoring from the FT line, you've got to hit them while you're there.

The other hole in this theory is that in that stretch we were 15-21 from the FT line. People talk about our poor FT shooting... apparently 15-21 (71.4%) is not good enough, even though we shoot 72% as a team for the season. In that stretch we missed 9 FG attempts where we were not fouled (well, at least a foul wasn't called). And in that same 15 minute stretch, MSU made 8-13 FGs (4 3pointers) and went 5-10 FTs.

 

[MisterLucky]

We did shoot 70% form the line which is better than some pretty good teams e.g. Kansas and Syracuse have shot for the season. Yeah, the Spartans were called for a ton of fouls but the real problem I saw with this game was the calls that weren't made: the obvious travels, the over and back, the goal tending on Basabe's shot at the buzzer and the body slam on Gesell's final shot. There are three refs out there and none of the had the guts to make the calls that affected the game when the chips were down.

 

[PhotoHawk]

Don't forget the shot to the head Woody took. I know refs whistled a foul but it should have been a flagrant with IA getting the ball if I were to compare a similar call against IS in their game last night.