So What is Good enough at Iowa?

L

longtimer

Well-Known Member
I read a lot of posts regarding the job McCaffrey has done bring us back from the depths from the Lick years and of course things are better. How could they not be? Still I continue to have a "concern" as to the status of Iowa basketball under McCaffrey Lets just look at some of the happenings in his 9 years at Iowa

He is 174-132 (which includes a ton of (creampuffs) and 79-86 in the Big Ten. No championships but has finished as high as 3rd a couple of times but mostly middle of the pack or lower. NIT 3 times and runner up. NCAA 3.5 times (i count the playin game as .5) winning 3 games in the NCAA. Gutsy win last year and comeback in the next game BUT has never made the sweet 16. Villanova and Gonzaga rolled over them in second games.
Im sorry but a poor recruiter who seems to always be in on good players until they go elsewhere. Wieskamp is a good player who was recruited by Iowa not McCaffrey. According to someone very close to Foster the latest "close calls"

Now I realize this is Iowa and we aren't going to be playing for the championship on a regular basis but I was around when Ralph Miller came to Iowa and won 2 Big Ten championships and came very close to the big prize in 69-70 (scoring over 100 points a game with no 3 point shot) and when Lute Olsen came in a took a pretty limited talent team with one great player Lester to the final 4 and if Lester didn"t get hurt who knows and when Raveling came in and recruited probably the most talented team in Iowa history which tom Davis took and a great NCAA run.

I also remember when Wisconsin was an annual doormat in the Big Ten Enter Bennett and they have been a factor in the big ten and on the national level since

so I guess when I keep hearing that Fran is doing a good job and his job shouldn't be in doubt it's just kind of hard to accept this is the best we can hope for. When I see this class he is bringing in. If we are having similar conversations this time next year (and I think we will be) I would be up for a change.

PS the worst part about a change is that we have an Athletic Director like Barta!
 
I thought a big what if was not getting Marcus Paige. Adding him with MG and Woody would have made things interesting around that time. By the time that group were JRs with Uthoff being added... Just felt like we were often times one player away.
 
To me, Fran's tenure feels a lot like the last decade or so of Kirk Ferentz. He does just enough to keep me from calling for his head. Just when I'm about to that point, he pulls a rabbit out of his hat and gets us to the NCAA Tournament last year, kinda like how KF got us to Indy in 2015 following some disappointing seasons from 2010-2014.

79-86 in conference games isn't good enough (a losing record is never acceptable IMO) but I also recognize the fact that Fran inherited Lickliter's mess, so his record is better than that since he's established his own recruits. He's usually had winning conference marks the last several years. We'll see how this year goes.

It's a hard question to answer - but winning 20+ games, top half of the conference, getting to the tournament and winning a game or two more often than not, I think is a good place to start. I guess that's essentially what Tom Davis got us.

I always felt, and still do, that Alford's results should have gotten him canned. 3 NCAA trips in 8 years and only 1 win. Fran has done better than that.

What makes it tough for me is the late season meltdowns. Three of them at least, in years that honestly should have been quite a bit better than they ended up. 2014, 2016 and last year.
 
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Fran has done good, not great. He has done "good enough" for where Iowa was - now it's time for something better then "good enough" IMO - out of a guy who's going into his 10th season and you'd expect to see that bare itself over the next few years.

He certainly hasn't done "not good enough" ..... because 4 in 6 to the NCAA is a WHOLE lot better then the program that went to only 3 the previous 14 years total. That's "good enough" at Iowa to keep your job. It just is. It's certainly not something a school in Iowa's pecking order should be "firing" a coach for due to lack of success. If Fran doesn't make the NCAA this year, his seat will be hot. If he misses it 2 years in a row I suspect you'll see him fired after 2021.

But ya can't fire a guy for what you think "might happen". Ya gotta let it play out. As it stands, Fran is in NO jeopardy of losing his job because he SHOULDN'T be. He just had a pretty good season, one of the better ones Iowa has had in over a decade..... fans wanting him ousted are idiots at this point b/c Iowa is going to the NCAA with regularity, if that ceases you will see a coaching change.
 
longtimer said:
I also remember when Wisconsin was an annual doormat in the Big Ten Enter Bennett and they have been a factor in the big ten and on the national level since
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I do not give all of the credit to coaching at Wisconsin. In 1998 Wisconsin opened the Kohl Center, with a modern basketball training facility. It was also the same year that they became a factor in the B1G. Iowa's modern training facility opened thirteen years later in 2011. Wisconsin's facilities' advantage has diminished and the league has become far more competitive. Minnesota, Northwestern, and Rudgers have recently made major upgrades. It will interesting to see if they become more competitive.
 
I want to see Iowa get back to the Tom Davis years where reaching the NCAA tournament was an every year deal, making an occasional run to the Sweet 16, and feeling like you had a shot at winning it once in a while.

I'm still pissed at Bowlsby for ruining that and Alford for screwing up the basketball program when he was supposed to take Iowa to "the next level".
 
Good enough is keeping high level talent from from backyard at Iowa, making the NCAAT regularly and making a S16+ run every 5 years or so.

Losing DJC and now probably XF not to blue blood programs in 2 years in not good enough.
 
ssckelley said:
I want to see Iowa get back to the Tom Davis years where reaching the NCAA tournament was an every year deal, making an occasional run to the Sweet 16, and feeling like you had a shot at winning it once in a while.

I'm still pissed at Bowlsby for ruining that and Alford for screwing up the basketball program when he was supposed to take Iowa to "the next level".
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Take away the first 2 years from both coaches and they are very similar.
 
FirstDownHawkeyes said:
Good enough is keeping high level talent from from backyard at Iowa, making the NCAAT regularly and making a S16+ run every 5 years or so.

Losing DJC and now probably XF not to blue blood programs in 2 years in not good enough.
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If Fran would have landed those guys, they would have "come to iowa no matter who the coach was".
 
longtimer said:
I read a lot of posts regarding the job McCaffrey has done bring us back from the depths from the Lick years and of course things are better. How could they not be? Still I continue to have a "concern" as to the status of Iowa basketball under McCaffrey Lets just look at some of the happenings in his 9 years at Iowa

He is 174-132 (which includes a ton of (creampuffs) and 79-86 in the Big Ten. No championships but has finished as high as 3rd a couple of times but mostly middle of the pack or lower. NIT 3 times and runner up. NCAA 3.5 times (i count the playin game as .5) winning 3 games in the NCAA. Gutsy win last year and comeback in the next game BUT has never made the sweet 16. Villanova and Gonzaga rolled over them in second games.
Im sorry but a poor recruiter who seems to always be in on good players until they go elsewhere. Wieskamp is a good player who was recruited by Iowa not McCaffrey. According to someone very close to Foster the latest "close calls"

Now I realize this is Iowa and we aren't going to be playing for the championship on a regular basis but I was around when Ralph Miller came to Iowa and won 2 Big Ten championships and came very close to the big prize in 69-70 (scoring over 100 points a game with no 3 point shot) and when Lute Olsen came in a took a pretty limited talent team with one great player Lester to the final 4 and if Lester didn"t get hurt who knows and when Raveling came in and recruited probably the most talented team in Iowa history which tom Davis took and a great NCAA run.

I also remember when Wisconsin was an annual doormat in the Big Ten Enter Bennett and they have been a factor in the big ten and on the national level since

so I guess when I keep hearing that Fran is doing a good job and his job shouldn't be in doubt it's just kind of hard to accept this is the best we can hope for. When I see this class he is bringing in. If we are having similar conversations this time next year (and I think we will be) I would be up for a change.

PS the worst part about a change is that we have an Athletic Director like Barta!
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If you're going to take away half an NCAA appearance for the play in game, you need to at least add an extra half appearance for the NIT for that year too.
 
PCHawk said:
If Fran would have landed those guys, they would have "come to iowa no matter who the coach was".
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That’s not true. He got credit for landing Woody. He wasn’t a slam dunk like Joe W was. He gets credit for Garza and Cook, too. Those were real battles. You need to win battles like that EVERY year. Take a look at lil bro. Somehow they win some of those battles EVERY year.
 
FirstDownHawkeyes said:
That’s not true. He got credit for landing Woody. He wasn’t a slam dunk like Joe W was. He gets credit for Garza and Cook, too. Those were real battles. You need to win battles like that EVERY year. Take a look at lil bro. Somehow they win some of those battles EVERY year.
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Garza and Cook aren't in state guys so that doesn't pertain to my half joke.
 
JPinIC said:
I do not give all of the credit to coaching at Wisconsin. In 1998 Wisconsin opened the Kohl Center, with a modern basketball training facility. It was also the same year that they became a factor in the B1G. Iowa's modern training facility opened thirteen years later in 2011. Wisconsin's facilities' advantage has diminished and the league has become far more competitive. Minnesota, Northwestern, and Rudgers have recently made major upgrades. It will interesting to see if they become more competitive.
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Well Bo Ryan, when he wasn't chasing co-ed skirts, won four D-3 National Championships for UW Platteville before he assumed the throne in Madison. In fact his tenure at UWP dovetailed almost exactly with the Chicago Bears' preseason camp and it was well known that Ryan would show Mike Ditka and Dave Wannstedt where some of the local hills were for running gassers. He assumed a program in 2001 that had been kicked into gear by Dick Bennett, who reached an NCAA final four in his own right. So in my opinion the coaches did have a great deal to do with the success.

You're correct that the Kohl opened in 1998, but not in time for the Badger season. It's first big event was the 1998 boys state basketball tournament. The first basket scored at the Kohl Center was by a player named Matt Schultz from Cuba City High School.
 
I guess I would like to see another Final Four in my lifetime but it's probably the only one I'm gonna see. I guess I just need to appreciate a Cub's World Series win in my lifetime.
 
dahlhawk said:
I guess I would like to see another Final Four in my lifetime but it's probably the only one I'm gonna see. I guess I just need to appreciate a Cub's World Series win in my lifetime.
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We had some elite eight games for the ages last spring. Texas Tech/Gonzaga, Virginia/Purdue, Auburn/Kentucky.

I tried to envision an Iowa team rising up to be able to play at that level at that stage of the tournament. To be able to execute offensive sets under immense defensive intensity. To be able to lock down and play defense with that intensity. To have that Carson Edwards type who could do what was necessary when you had to have a basket-shoot, drive, dish, finish.

With our team constructed the way it is and advance deep we would have to get white hot from distance and have the quickness, mentality, and desire to switch and recover properly on defense, and do it until we drop. Then we have to trust someone to take over on offense and make the play.

A lot would have to fall into place for this to happen.
 
FirstDownHawkeyes said:
Good enough is keeping high level talent from from backyard at Iowa, making the NCAAT regularly and making a S16+ run every 5 years or so.

Losing DJC and now probably XF not to blue blood programs in 2 years in not good enough.
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agree 100% Fran is below average coach and a CRAPPY recruiter!
 
1977Hawkeye said:
To me, Fran's tenure feels a lot like the last decade or so of Kirk Ferentz. He does just enough to keep me from calling for his head. Just when I'm about to that point, he pulls a rabbit out of his hat and gets us to the NCAA Tournament last year, kinda like how KF got us to Indy in 2015 following some disappointing seasons from 2010-2014.

79-86 in conference games isn't good enough (a losing record is never acceptable IMO) but I also recognize the fact that Fran inherited Lickliter's mess, so his record is better than that since he's established his own recruits. He's usually had winning conference marks the last several years. We'll see how this year goes.

It's a hard question to answer - but winning 20+ games, top half of the conference, getting to the tournament and winning a game or two more often than not, I think is a good place to start. I guess that's essentially what Tom Davis got us.

I always felt, and still do, that Alford's results should have gotten him canned. 3 NCAA trips in 8 years and only 1 win. Fran has done better than that.

What makes it tough for me is the late season meltdowns. Three of them at least, in years that honestly should have been quite a bit better than they ended up. 2014, 2016 and last year.
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I always chuckle when I read stuff like this because it’s honestly so laughable to compare Fran and KF, but people still try and do it. Lmao dumb!!


Furthermore many people had Iowa a NCAA tournament last year people it was expected! So not sure I’m following the rabbit out of a hat comparison.
 
ssckelley said:
I want to see Iowa get back to the Tom Davis years where reaching the NCAA tournament was an every year deal, making an occasional run to the Sweet 16, and feeling like you had a shot at winning it once in a while.

I'm still pissed at Bowlsby for ruining that and Alford for screwing up the basketball program when he was supposed to take Iowa to "the next level".
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I would like it if we weren’t the whitest team in America anymore
 
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