Program Expectations and Reality

[HawkPrdatr40]

I'm not trying to convince you of anything. I just looked at the stats and how he has taken over at times this season. His stats are better than last year. We'll see what his senior season brings when he's not sharing time at the 5. Both he and Gabe should be playing...hot hand getting the majority of the minutes in any given game.

When has Woody taken over, I will hang up and listen? To crickets chirping for EVER.

 

[ArvadaHawk]

You all need to quit taking your frustrations out on Fran, that you can't take out on kfootball.

 

[BlackGold57]

I am sorry. Woodbury is a flop. Slow & uncoordinated. Poor hands & No jumping ability. 7 footer who plays like a very slow and uncoordinated 6'6" player. If he has any spot on this team, it should be to give Gabe a breather. He should be nowhere near the floor at crunch time in a tight game.

You will never convince me that Iowa isn't a better team without him stumbling around out there.

If you want to talk about player development, how about compare AC Earl, Les Jepsen to Woodbury. Both looked silly as freshman and were NBA draft picks. Woody, little improvement in 3 years.

 

[lightning1]

You all need to quit taking your frustrations out on Fran, that you can't take out on kfootball.

This is a very honest and thoughtful conversation. Nobody is attacking Fran's character, nor is anyone being unfair. This is basketball and has nothing to do with KF. Get a life. Or get permission before you get on the interwebs, at the very least.

 

[lightning1]

The Gabe O situation is very frustrating to me. He is a physical freak but he hasn't been playing basketball for very long. If I had the privilege of coaching a guy like that, I play him as close to 40 mins a night to accelerate his learning curve. By the time he is a SR, he would have 15 ppg/10 rpg/ 3 bpg.

 

[MiniMoeHawk]

The Gabe O situation is very frustrating to me. He is a physical freak but he hasn't been playing basketball for very long. If I had the privilege of coaching a guy like that, I play him as close to 40 mins a night to accelerate his learning curve. By the time he is a SR, he would have 15 ppg/10 rpg/ 3 bpg.

Gabe couldn't play for 40 minutes per game with the intensity he plays with.

 

[ChosenChildren]

Any season we qualify for the NIT is a good season; qualifying for the NCAA is a great season.

If you don't believe me, read Fran's contract. He gets a bonus for an NIT bid. Obviously, the athletic department considers an NIT bid a success.

I'd equate NIT to a minor bowl bid; NCAA to a major bowl bid; Elite 8 to the college football playoffs.

 

[MisterLucky]

I know that nobody EVER admits that they might have been wrong, but there are some real comical posts in this thread.

 

[Tvismylif]

Here is some simple information after spending 5 minutes. Tim Miles takes over Colorado State after a 7-25 year, in NCAA tourney in year 5. Takes over Nebby, in NCAA tourney in year 2.

Using Tim Miles is probably not the best example you could use to make your argument. Almost every Nebraska fan at the game on the 22nd wished they had Iowa's Team and Coach.

The fans still think Miles is a good coach, but his mistake was catching lightning in a bottle in year two. That raised fans expectations for the future. Now, they can't understand why Nebraska has lost 9 of their last 10 games. And this with almost the entire team back from last year.

 

[WindsorHawk]

What a difference a year makes. There are some interesting thoughts and perspectives in this thread from approximately 1 year ago. Some questioned Fran. Some questioned whether Iowa would even make the NCAA Tournament in 2016. Fran knows what he's doing. He's building the program his way. And it's working.

I don't disagree with those expecting a step back next season. I certainly don't expect a top 5 ranking. But I disagree with those...as I've stated in other threads...that think we can't finish in the top 6 of the Big 10 or make the 2017 NCAA Tournament. There are so many minutes for so many guys that are just waiting their turn to shine. We're just getting glimpses this year.

 

[1977Hawkeye]

I certainly didn't expect the level of success with the hoops team (or the football team for that matter) that we've seen so far this year, so I guess maybe I should not be too quick to write off next season as "no way they sniff the NCAA's".. Guess we'll see. There will still be a drop off, though - Iowa is just losing too much this year for them to not miss a beat. Particularly Uthoff.

Do I expect Iowa to be a 1 seed this year? In my heart, no. I think it's possible, but I think they have a much better shot at a 2-3 seed. The schedule, on paper, gets easier, so they just need to continue to stay focused and they'll be fine. If so, I can't see their projected seed falling much, if at all.

Regarding program expectations - I've come to accept that unless you're Duke, Kansas, Kentucky, etc. that you just have to ride the roller coaster a bit and enjoy the big seasons when you have solid talent AND an experienced roster. It doesn't mean I think Iowa can't be a regular NCAA participant, but years like this one don't come along too often. Then there will be other times where you've gotta rebuild. Heck, even Duke & UK are off this year... So very few programs can simply reload year in and year out.

 

[bcl20]

Why don't any of those weirdos post in the basketball thread anymore?

 

[meaning]

what a great bump.

 

[theboat]

I don't remember the context. What happened prior to this thread?

 

[NEIChawk]

Fran inherits a dead program, signs Woody, Gesell, etc, gets Jok, and gets in the Chicagoland area.....Old Deanvogs said we needed to wait until years 3,4,& 5 to see if we hit our stride, and it appears we have....Uthoff coming back was huge, of course....things have been working out well...

 

[lightning1]

The reasons why I think we are seeing Fran's ceiling.
#1. We are well into his 5th year and players don't know their roles.
#2. His in-game management is poor. He never uses his time outs to break another team's momentum, or to correct problems on the court.
#3. He's still recruiting mid-major talent.
#4. His personnel decisions are suspect. Gabe's upside is twice what Woody's is, yet they split minutes to the detriment of Gabe's development. Gabe hasn't been playing basketball very long. The more minutes he gets, the faster he realizes his full potential. I'm not even going to start on Ogelsby.
These are all things that I and several others have seen and discussed here. I am beginning to believe it's a coaching problem because this is the same thing we saw in season 2, 3, 4 and now 5. I say this while admitting that I have met and talked to Fran. I have watched him interact with people and kids in public. I love his passion and I genuinely like the man. I try to be realistic and give my honest opinion.
I certainly could be wrong and have been wrong before.

Just to go back and question my own observations:
#1. I think this was accurate but perhaps it was more on the players than Fran, as the players certainly seem to know their roles this year and it is showing.
#2. Still doesn't use his TOs like I think he should but...
#3. If he gets great leadership, effort and understanding from mid-major talent (like he has this year)...I'm convinced.
#4. He even admits that he should have given this guy more minutes in that game, etc. It's easy to forget that even highly paid coaches can lose sight of things from time to time.
This years team is the culmination of having multiple 3 and 4 year program guys on the floor, that know their roles. I am really impressed with how he has coached this team, this year. Or is it a matter of the players finally "getting it"? Either way, it's fun to watch and I think he deserves it.

 

[theboat]

You are just repeating the overplayed narrative. You act like Iowa was the worst program ever but that isn't the case. Yes Lickliter failed, but as I said in a different thread, Iowa had a better 5 year run prior to Fran than ISU had prior to Fred. Yet, you don't hear Fred and fans still blaming the McDermott years. Why is that? Because they are actually winning.

Basketball is not football. Football is very hard to pull a program up from the bottom because of how much is involved.

Basketball can be turned in 1 year with a couple of players. 2-3 years for a location like Iowa is perfectly reasonable. Iowa/Fran is in year 5 and starting down the slide again and losing their most productive player. Maybe this recruiting class will finally stick, but forgive me if I have my doubts.

What I see are "shooters" who can't shoot. Big men who can't hold onto the ball in the paint. Guards that can't create their own shots or shots for those around them. And a team that doesn't seem to care that they are embarrassing to watch.

People thought Marble was an offense killer last year, but it turns out he was the only offense savior on the team.

If this team continues down this path again this season, then the Fran experiment has failed. Thank goodness we have Barta though so he can get an extension.

I stand by what I said. This was after bad losses to MN and NW. It has been mostly fun to watch since then. Uthoff/Jok are the couple of players that have turned it around, surrounded by experienced players.

If the team today were to play the team from this post last year, they would win by 30.

 

[ibahawkeye]

What a difference a year makes. There are some interesting thoughts and perspectives in this thread from approximately 1 year ago. Some questioned Fran. Some questioned whether Iowa would even make the NCAA Tournament in 2016. Fran knows what he's doing. He's building the program his way. And it's working.

I don't disagree with those expecting a step back next season. I certainly don't expect a top 5 ranking. But I disagree with those...as I've stated in other threads...that think we can't finish in the top 6 of the Big 10 or make the 2017 NCAA Tournament. There are so many minutes for so many guys that are just waiting their turn to shine. We're just getting glimpses this year.

Im starting to become more optimistic about next year.

Baer has proven he can contribute.
Uhl is playing better in Big Ten conference games in comparison to even the weaker non conference games.
Wagner is an athletic freak.
Jok is now a good defender.

Can Moss, Hutton, Dale Jones or Tyler Cook contribute?

 

[meaning]

I stand by what I said. This was after bad losses to MN and NW. It has been mostly fun to watch since then. Uthoff/Jok are the couple of players that have turned it around, surrounded by experienced players.

If the team today were to play the team from this post last year, they would win by 30.

I think part of the "fun to watch" aspect is the fact that we've lost 0-1 regular season conference games since the original post. (We also haven't lost a regular season football game since that post. Good times.)

but yes. It's been fun to watch, and the players/coach/program appear to be ok.