#1DieHardHawk
Well-Known Member
Last night's game stirred up another hornet's nest.
It's a mess.
It's a mess.
OT - NFL Officiating
- Thread starter #1DieHardHawk
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Northside Hawk
Well-Known Member
Sounds like a lot of critical calls were left open to interpretation, according to the referee of last night's crew.
He was talking about "strict liability for the defensive player" (on the pass interference) and since Flowers had the O-lineman "pinned back" that constituted illegal hands to the face regardless of where Flowers' hands may have been.
It is all over ESPN and football conversations this morning. And on top of it that was a division game and changed the entire landscape of the division standings and potential tiebreakers.
Give Rogers credit in the end, however, as well as Green Bay's red zone defense. Detroit had ample opportunities to win this game going away
I don't watch a ton of NFL but do like the Packers and Rams...so tuned in for a bit last night to hear the announcer, whoever he was say about the hands to the face call...
"I am here to tell ALL OF AMERICA that was a terrible call." And he said the same thing over and over.
Just stop...it isn't that important.
"I am here to tell ALL OF AMERICA that was a terrible call." And he said the same thing over and over.
Just stop...it isn't that important.
hawkeyes87
Well-Known Member
Anybody see Chiefs Texans Sunday?
Seemed like there was a flag every other play or so.
Chiefs had 5 penalties in the first 5 minutes, ended up w/ 11 to the Texans' 10.
Seemed like there was a flag every other play or so.
Chiefs had 5 penalties in the first 5 minutes, ended up w/ 11 to the Texans' 10.
I actually liked it, even as a Packers fan. Too many announcers aren't brave enough to call out the officials for their mistakes and just dance around bad calls as if they were 50/50 or didn't happen. Booger may be a bad play-by-play guy, but I appreciate his take on that.
okeefe4prez
Well-Known Member
I only saw the last few minutes whilst switching channels between the NFL game and the Cardinals' glorious choke job and I gotta say that last penalty was absolutely an influencing factor in the outcome of the game. It kept the Lions from getting the rock back with about 2 minutes on the clock, down 1. That is a very winnable game for them. If you have games decided by bad calls, it really hurts the sport.
Fryowa
Administrator
I don’t think officiating is any worse than its ever been. In fact, as far as applying the rules they’re given, it’s probably better.
What's changed the officiating part of the game is the crazy number of camera angles, and high definition and frame rates.
Back in the 80s/90s we had one, maybe two, camera angles of a PI situation, reception, line of scrimmage, etc. The officials made the calls based on what they saw and that was that. The camera shots were often blurry, zoomed out, and the frame rates were so low that we couldn't tell what happened from one frame to the next.
Now cameras are in the pylons, on the goal line, in the yardage sticks/markers, on cables suspended above the field, in the goal posts, and a million other different places. We see every call from ten different angles and the slow-mo frame rates are so crazy that they actually catch the 60hz cycling of the led stadium lights.
Refs have always missed calls, but when cameras got better and more numerous and we started seeing the replays thousands of times on social media and TV, everyone started complaining about it. That's also why we've had so many stupid rules created regarding what constitutes a catch, etc, because we never used to be able to see someone bobble a ball from 5 different angles at 300 fps.
That also was the beginning of the review/challenge process, and pretty soon we're where we are now with everyone thinking refs suck when in actuality they most likely know the rules better and make better calls.
Just like the electronic strike zone has shown us that umpires average 14 missed pitches per game. Umpires aren't shittier than they used to be, we just have better measuring tools. If anything umpires are better than ever because they know they're scrutinized so hard.
tl;dr, officiating isn't bad, it's the game and rules themselves that suck.
What's changed the officiating part of the game is the crazy number of camera angles, and high definition and frame rates.
Back in the 80s/90s we had one, maybe two, camera angles of a PI situation, reception, line of scrimmage, etc. The officials made the calls based on what they saw and that was that. The camera shots were often blurry, zoomed out, and the frame rates were so low that we couldn't tell what happened from one frame to the next.
Now cameras are in the pylons, on the goal line, in the yardage sticks/markers, on cables suspended above the field, in the goal posts, and a million other different places. We see every call from ten different angles and the slow-mo frame rates are so crazy that they actually catch the 60hz cycling of the led stadium lights.
Refs have always missed calls, but when cameras got better and more numerous and we started seeing the replays thousands of times on social media and TV, everyone started complaining about it. That's also why we've had so many stupid rules created regarding what constitutes a catch, etc, because we never used to be able to see someone bobble a ball from 5 different angles at 300 fps.
That also was the beginning of the review/challenge process, and pretty soon we're where we are now with everyone thinking refs suck when in actuality they most likely know the rules better and make better calls.
Just like the electronic strike zone has shown us that umpires average 14 missed pitches per game. Umpires aren't shittier than they used to be, we just have better measuring tools. If anything umpires are better than ever because they know they're scrutinized so hard.
tl;dr, officiating isn't bad, it's the game and rules themselves that suck.
hawkeyebob62
Well-Known Member
Last night was pretty rough but the NFL refs are very good at their jobs and of the major sports only MLB umps are better. They are light years better than their college counterparts.
They are just still in the heat wave of the missed PI in the NFC championship game. So everything is heavily scrutinized right now.
Plus we are in that era of everyone striving to be a victim and who creates innocent victims in sports better than those horrible refs?
okeefe4prez
Well-Known Member
Agreed. Once Big Ten hoops went to high def, I couldn't watch it anymore.
ibahawkeye
Well-Known Member
The laughable part for me is after blowing the PI call last year, they change the rules.
However, the officials apparently have a pact to completely ignore the rule change as I believe they have yet to overturn a PI replay. Now on top of that look, we have seen other calls missed not eligible for replay.
In today's day and age with as much criticism as officials already take, why are these NFL refs so reluctant to utilize technology to improve the PI calls?
Obviously that doesn't change last night. However, similar to last season, I think we see a rule change that will offer coaches some type of challenge or an automatic replay of flags under 2:00 by a replay official or something that will allow officials a chance to rectify blatant misses like last night.
I also hope the league continues to have discussions with the officials on the PI replays. I do believe a conservative approach is correct in overturning these but there have been a couple examples that deserved to be changed.
However, the officials apparently have a pact to completely ignore the rule change as I believe they have yet to overturn a PI replay. Now on top of that look, we have seen other calls missed not eligible for replay.
In today's day and age with as much criticism as officials already take, why are these NFL refs so reluctant to utilize technology to improve the PI calls?
Obviously that doesn't change last night. However, similar to last season, I think we see a rule change that will offer coaches some type of challenge or an automatic replay of flags under 2:00 by a replay official or something that will allow officials a chance to rectify blatant misses like last night.
I also hope the league continues to have discussions with the officials on the PI replays. I do believe a conservative approach is correct in overturning these but there have been a couple examples that deserved to be changed.
Concur...but also thrown into the mix is this fact, losing programs and teams, historically, seldom get "the calls" in any sport.
Fryowa
Administrator
Parents are making me think twice latelySpoken like one who officiates
It wasn't like he was announcing the Pearl Harbor attack or D-Day landings...it was a marginal call in a game that has little to do with the lives of most Americans. (I want ALL of America to know) Refs are human, subject to mistakes. In most events there are hundreds of other plays (and coaching decisions) all over the field that make a bigger difference in the outcome.
hawkeyebob62
Well-Known Member
Parents are making me think twice lately
I can understand that. I have seen some really vile "parents" at the ball field, the chorus performance, in the audience/stands, etc. Sad, really.
ibahawkeye
Well-Known Member
I have not umpired a baseball game so I can't speak from that side but I feel confident in stating basketball officiating is the most difficult, followed by football.
Basketball is difficult because constant movement among players, split second decisions, proximity of fans/coaches.
Football is difficult because of the physicality and again the # of players. The benefit is breaks between plays and you can always throw a flag, pick it up and more opportunities to come together as a crew to make decisions.
Baseball has to be the easiest. Balls strikes has to be difficult but it's not near as physical a task as the other 2 sports. Plus the 2 teams don't have as much interaction with one another.
SteveGarvey1
Well-Known Member
I'm not a conspiracy theorist but I am starting to wonder whether the refs got together and said blank U to this new PI review policy and are refusing to overturn them because they hate the rule.
Northside Hawk
Well-Known Member
Officiating probably has gotten better, its the interpretation of judgement calls that will always be a problem.
It can be difficult for people in the same crew to see a judgement call the same way, let alone every professional official. I remember a basketball game between Purdue and Indiana last year where one official called block and one called charge. Then there was the end of the Seattle/Green Bay game a few years back.
I once saw a Mets/Giants baseball game where one umpire ruled catch in short centerfield and one ruled trap. The runner on first was screwed no matter what he did. When the crew got together and said batter out, but runner stays on first, neither manager was happy. One wanted a double play, the other wanted men on first and second.
You're probably right on this. Those sports have quicker athletes too.
I just wish everyone would quite bitching about them. There are youth sports leagues where I live getting cancelled because nobody wants to coach or ref. Too many people who refuse to coach or ref bitch about them all the time.
