North Carolina-Duke to B1G?

[eyekwah]

I'm not a fan of super-conferences, but I came across the article below while I follow the Texas A&M saga.

BCS football: Texas A&M to the SEC(?), how the Big 12 might respond and more | College Hotline

"If the Tar Heels are going anywhere in the next few years, I’m told, it’s the Big Ten – possibly in a package deal with Duke. Why would the Big Ten want Duke and UNC, other than commissioner Jim Delany being a UNC alum (he played point guard for Dean Smith)?
In addition to being terrific schools, they’re among the very few that would add value to the league’s basketball contract. They’d also increase the size of the Big Ten Network’s coffers."

 

[Snowcraig]

Sorry, I just don't think ACC teams are going to automatically want to jump to the SEC or Big 10. Big 12 or Big East teams for sure, but the ACC has allot going for it.

 

[PhoenixHawk]

The BB contract is PEANUTS compared to FB. All the BB money is in the NCAA tournament. If the B10 expands, it will be for the football tv contract and markets. ie., Nebraska.

 

[JonDMiller]

These r tv footprint decisions. By adding both Duke and UNC, u control the TV sets in another state where u presently dont have a presence. And it's a growing state at that.

While don't think it will happen, i think the revenue model could support it. But it just won't fit.

 

[PhoenixHawk]

These r tv footprint decisions. By adding both Duke and UNC, u control the TV sets in another state where u presently dont have a presence. And it's a growing state at that.

While don't think it will happen, i think the revenue model could support it. But it just won't fit.

You get the same thing by adding Rutgers (NJ), and Syracuse (NY), but with 4x the TVs.

 

[ColumbusHawk]

You get the same thing by adding Rutgers (NJ), and Syracuse (NY), but with 4x the TVs.

Syracuse brings nothing to the table. The school is out in the middle of nowhere. Also, few people realize that Penn State actually is closer to the New York metropolitan area than Syracuse. Also, Syracuse doesn't fit the Big Ten's academic model.

Duke & North Carolina to the Big Ten is not as crazy as it first appears. Both schools are members of the prestigious Association of American Universities (AAU).

Membership in the AAU is important to the presidents of the Big Ten institutions. Nebraska's Chancellor has stated that the Huskers probably would not have been invited to join the Big Ten in athletics if it had not been a member of the AAU. Nebraska was removed from the AAU after being invited to join the Big Ten in athletics. The Huskers were the first school to be removed from the AAU. Syracuse recently has withdrawn from the AAU.

Except for Nebraska, every school in the Big Ten is a member of the AAU. In contrast, Florida & Vanderbilt are the only two SEC schools in the AAU. Schools that are members of the AAU & are contigious to the Big Ten states include Kansas, Maryland, Missouri, Rutgers & Virginia.

Iowa State & Pittsburgh are members of the AAU, but they bring nothing to the table in TV sets. If it expands again, the Big Ten will want to extend its footprint. The Cyclones & Panthers will not expand the Big Ten's market. Iowa & Pennsylvania are already dominated by the Big Ten. The conference will not expand for teams to get less money.

Interestingly, Texas A&M is an AAU member. That is a lot of TV sets.

Notre Dame is a whole different story. Notre Dame's graduate school programs are the "little sisters of the poor" compared the Big Ten. However, Notre Dame is unique. The Irish are the only school where TV sets would overwhelm academics with the presidents of the Big Ten universities.

 

[tm3308]

You get the same thing by adding Rutgers (NJ), and Syracuse (NY), but with 4x the TVs.

No, you don't. New Yorkers (as in NYC) don't give two sh*ts about Rutgers or Syracuse. It's a pro sports town through and through. Rutgers and Syracuse are merely IN the NYC market. They don't DELIVER it. Duke-UNC would DELIVER all of North Carolina.

I don't think it will happen, but it makes much more sense than Rutgers or Syracuse.

 

[H8IAST8]

The BB contract is PEANUTS compared to FB. All the BB money is in the NCAA tournament. If the B10 expands, it will be for the football tv contract and markets. ie., Nebraska.

Money is money, no matter where it comes from. These are 2 of the top 10 programs in history, it is a big deal.

Each game played in the ncaa bball tournament is worth $226,206. If UNC & Duke both average 3 games every year thats $1.3 million. A far cry from football, but still a chunk of change. That equates to a low paying bowl game, but expenses are much less than the bowl entourage.

The Big East actually pulls in more revenue from basketball than football:
The Big East’s television fate is a bit more complicated than most leagues. It generates more revenue from basketball than football, the only major conference do so.

 

[PhoenixHawk]

As has been pointed out BB money is nothing. Yeah, there's money in the tournament, but how much of that is going to make it to Iowa? Split those "hundreds of thousand$" 14 ways, gentlemen! Talk about massively diminishing returns! I for one, do not want Iowa's cut to go down, which is an absolute certainty if we waste 2 expansion slots on one middling population state! Back in the Nebraska expansion, a Big Ten rep talked about BB vs. FB money. He actually used NC & Duke as an example. He pointed out that a hugely hyped, midseason game between #1 Duke and #2 NC got a 3 share, while a midseason game between two unranked B10 teams got a 7.5 share. There's no money in BB. When was the last time you heard big stories about conference BB contracts? How are they supposed to bring $20 million to the conference *each*?

Syracuse still probably brings in more in NY when Rutgers is added as well. It's a package deal, you keep adding more teams around that market (PSU, Syr, Rut) and NY stations start adding the BTN. Then, since Syr is in state, you can charge a load more per set.

Maryland and Missouri are both better choices than NC&Duke. Maryland helps with the NY/NJ market corridor mentioned above. Missouri has two big markets and borders 3 B10 states.

 

[tm3308]

As has been pointed out BB money is nothing. Yeah, there's money in the tournament, but how much of that is going to make it to Iowa? Split those "hundreds of thousand$" 14 ways, gentlemen! Talk about massively diminishing returns! I for one, do not want Iowa's cut to go down, which is an absolute certainty if we waste 2 expansion slots on one middling population state! Back in the Nebraska expansion, a Big Ten rep talked about BB vs. FB money. He actually used NC & Duke as an example. He pointed out that a hugely hyped, midseason game between #1 Duke and #2 NC got a 3 share, while a midseason game between two unranked B10 teams got a 7.5 share. There's no money in BB. When was the last time you heard big stories about conference BB contracts? How are they supposed to bring $20 million to the conference *each*?

Syracuse still probably brings in more in NY when Rutgers is added as well. It's a package deal, you keep adding more teams around that market (PSU, Syr, Rut) and NY stations start adding the BTN. Then, since Syr is in state, you can charge a load more per set.

Maryland and Missouri are both better choices than NC&Duke. Maryland helps with the NY/NJ market corridor mentioned above. Missouri has two big markets and borders 3 B10 states.

Rutgers brings nothing at all. Nobody in NYC gives a damn about them. Why people keep talking about them as an option is beyond me. Duke-UNC actually bring North Carolina to the table. Sure, basketball isn't the driving force. But if paying for Duke-UNC football means getting Duke-UNC basketball games that are aired on the BTN, you can bet your a** that the people will fork over the dough.

The BTN still gets its money that way.

 

[H8IAST8]

As has been pointed out BB money is nothing. Yeah, there's money in the tournament, but how much of that is going to make it to Iowa? Split those "hundreds of thousand$" 14 ways, gentlemen! Talk about massively diminishing returns! I for one, do not want Iowa's cut to go down, which is an absolute certainty if we waste 2 expansion slots on one middling population state! Back in the Nebraska expansion, a Big Ten rep talked about BB vs. FB money. He actually used NC & Duke as an example. He pointed out that a hugely hyped, midseason game between #1 Duke and #2 NC got a 3 share, while a midseason game between two unranked B10 teams got a 7.5 share. There's no money in BB. When was the last time you heard big stories about conference BB contracts? How are they supposed to bring $20 million to the conference *each*?

Syracuse still probably brings in more in NY when Rutgers is added as well. It's a package deal, you keep adding more teams around that market (PSU, Syr, Rut) and NY stations start adding the BTN. Then, since Syr is in state, you can charge a load more per set.

Maryland and Missouri are both better choices than NC&Duke. Maryland helps with the NY/NJ market corridor mentioned above. Missouri has two big markets and borders 3 B10 states.

ACC Now - Carolina-Duke rules TV ratings | newsobserver.com blogs
The network has announced the game pulled in an average overnight household rating/share of 3.4/7, up 183 percent from the comparable window in 2008, which earned a 1.2/2 for coverage of Purdue vs. Michigan, in the metered markets.

Sunday’s result was the highest rating (nationally) for a regular-season NCAA basketball game on CBS since a 3.9/8 for No. 6-ranked Duke vs. No. 2-ranked North Carolina on March 6, 2005.

 

[tm3308]

ACC Now - Carolina-Duke rules TV ratings | newsobserver.com blogs
The network has announced the game pulled in an average overnight household rating/share of 3.4/7, up 183 percent from the comparable window in 2008, which earned a 1.2/2 for coverage of Purdue vs. Michigan, in the metered markets.

Sunday’s result was the highest rating (nationally) for a regular-season NCAA basketball game on CBS since a 3.9/8 for No. 6-ranked Duke vs. No. 2-ranked North Carolina on March 6, 2005.

This just demonstrates my point. While expansion is not about basketball, that's what people in Carolina care about. If you tell them they have to get the BTN to ensure that they will be able to see all Duke and UNC games on the hardwood, they will subscribe without hesitation.

 

[H8IAST8]

ACC Now - Carolina-Duke rules TV ratings | newsobserver.com blogs
The network has announced the game pulled in an average overnight household rating/share of 3.4/7, up 183 percent from the comparable window in 2008, which earned a 1.2/2 for coverage of Purdue vs. Michigan, in the metered markets.

Sunday’s result was the highest rating (nationally) for a regular-season NCAA basketball game on CBS since a 3.9/8 for No. 6-ranked Duke vs. No. 2-ranked North Carolina on March 6, 2005.

To put this in perspective, Iowa vs. PSU 2009 Whiteout on ABC got a 7 share...

 

[PhoenixHawk]

I don't think anyone's doubting that stations in NC won't pick up the BTN, just like pretty much all stations in the B10 now have the BTN. But like I said, you can see the biggest shares for a BB game aren't anything to FB ratings. Same reason Kansas will never happen. They can't bring the $.

Adding both NC and Duke would be as stupid as adding Pitt or ISU. They are redundant to what we already have. They are a pair, and fit nicely out there with all their traditional rivals. Who here is going to be excited about NC coming to Kinnick in the fall? Do you really think any of their fans would be excited about playing Minnesota and Illinois every year as opposed to NCST, VA, or USC?

Expansion is about $. Do you not agree with that? NC & Duke cannot bring $40m to pay their way, let alone add anything to Iowa's take. I care about the hawks, so I am only interested in what will make my school more $. The only way to make that kind of $ is ND, Tex (yuck), or the NE corridor.

 

[tm3308]

I don't think anyone's doubting that stations in NC won't pick up the BTN, just like pretty much all stations in the B10 now have the BTN. But like I said, you can see the biggest shares for a BB game aren't anything to FB ratings. Same reason Kansas will never happen. They can't bring the $.

Adding both NC and Duke would be as stupid as adding Pitt or ISU. They are redundant to what we already have. They are a pair, and fit nicely out there with all their traditional rivals. Who here is going to be excited about NC coming to Kinnick in the fall? Do you really think any of their fans would be excited about playing Minnesota and Illinois every year as opposed to NCST, VA, or USC?

Expansion is about $. Do you not agree with that? NC & Duke cannot bring $40m to pay their way, let alone add anything to Iowa's take. I care about the hawks, so I am only interested in what will make my school more $. The only way to make that kind of $ is ND, Tex (yuck), or the NE corridor.

And you think we'd all be excited about having Rutgers or Syracuse come to Kinnick? They aren't any better, in any way, than Duke-UNC.

 

[PhoenixHawk]

No, they're not that exciting to us, but would be to PSU. They have more history, and, in a 4 team expansion with ND and Maryland, could bring in much more money. You get the whole Washington-Baltimore-NJ-NY corridor. Missouri would be exciting to us, Illinois, and Neb.

NY is a pro town, but they also love ND. You then get Syracuse as a home-state team (for higher fees), Rutgers and Maryland (lots of grads from both in NY and that corridor), and you get massive boost in $ for the B10.

 

[DwayneTwill]

No fricking way.

 

[kicker22]

ISU has a better chance playing in a new years day bowl game.

 

[ssckelley]

Rutgers brings nothing at all. Nobody in NYC gives a damn about them. Why people keep talking about them as an option is beyond me. Duke-UNC actually bring North Carolina to the table. Sure, basketball isn't the driving force. But if paying for Duke-UNC football means getting Duke-UNC basketball games that are aired on the BTN, you can bet your a** that the people will fork over the dough.

The BTN still gets its money that way.

Because Rutgers gets BTN into the New York & New Jersey market. While most in NYC do not care about Rutgers there is enough alum & interest there to where they would have to carry BTN. The BTN then collects on those millions of TVs subscribed to the network regardless if most of them never tune into the station. While good ratings attract sponsors the BTN generates most of their revenue from the amount of televisions subscribed.

But if BTN wants to go after the basketball revenue then Duke & North Carolina would do the trick. Next go after Kansas from the little 10 and the BTN could surpass the Big East in revenues.

 

[ColumbusHawk]

No, you don't. New Yorkers (as in NYC) don't give two sh*ts about Rutgers or Syracuse. It's a pro sports town through and through. Rutgers and Syracuse are merely IN the NYC market. They don't DELIVER it. Duke-UNC would DELIVER all of North Carolina.

I don't think it will happen, but it makes much more sense than Rutgers or Syracuse.

Where do you get these crazy ideas? First of all, Syracuse is not in the New York city market. Penn State is actually closer to the New York metropolitan area than Syracuse. Another interesting tidbit, Iowa City is about twenty-five miles closer to metropolitan Chicago than Syracuse is to metropolitan NY.

Rutgers is a different story. The campus is about forty-five miles from downtown Manhatten. While pro sports may dominate, Greater New York contains almost nineteen million people. The Tri-State population is almost fifty percent larger than Illinois, the most populous state in the Big Ten.

Many of the residents of the area are Rutgers alumni & natives of the midwestern states. Just because an individual lives in New York doesn't mean they were raised in New York. New York is a great melting pot of people from all over the country. There are millions of Rutgers graduates & natives from the midwest in Greater New York.

Further, adding Rutgers to the Big Ten would guarantee that the late afternoon games & night games would be televised by ABC New York. Rutgers would be a huge financial bonanza to the conference's TV contracts & the BTN.