ND - Wisconsin

[Xerxes]

Most years Notre Dame is a cupcake. They have lost 52 games in the last 10 years. Still a smart move by Wiscy getting them on the schedule.

Iowa has lost 49 games over the last 10 years. Does that mean Iowa is a cupcake most years as well?

 

[ibahawkeye]

Iowa has lost 49 games over the last 10 years. Does that mean Iowa is a cupcake most years as well?

I don't think I'd want to compare strength of schedule either. ND is always playing teams like Texas, USC, Stanford. I would bet their SOS is much higher over that 10 year time period even with our Big Ten conference schedule.

 

[Motigerhawk]

What is the win total KF needs now?
What can he do to achieve this knowing that he has to play B1G teams?

KF will never dump ISU to play someone good. We may see Pitt or other average P5 teams again. But I doubt it.

 

[eveningnewsteam]

What is the win total KF needs now?
What can he do to achieve this knowing that he has to play B1G teams?

KF will never dump ISU to play someone good. We may see Pitt or other average P5 teams again. But I doubt it.

Doubt we'll see that either with the Big 10 schedule. Get ready for Iowa State, North Texas and Illinois state until KF retires

 

[ArvadaHawk]

My guess is Wisconsin will play Notre Dame and two cupcakes in those seasons. Iowa does not have that option because it's locked into the series with Iowa State. If you want to see the Hawkeyes play another Power 5 in the non-conference, the Cyclones must go.

We should stop pretending ISU is anything but a team that should be a cupcake. But okay, let's get rid of them. They're a P5 team that doesn't help Iowa at all. We win, so what. We lose, then that shades the rest of our season. And, with a .500-ish record against ISU under kirk, who'd rather be .500-ish, against different and potentially better competition? it sort of seems like an excuse.

 

[Hawk1960]

Iowa has lost 49 games over the last 10 years. Does that mean Iowa is a cupcake most years as well?

In '07, and '12 we were a very edible cupcake. The point is, with 52 losses in 10 years Notre Dame is nothing to fear. They are like a rusty old antique ... good in it's day but the only positive now is the "patina" looks nice.

 

[ArvadaHawk]

Has there ever been any talk about the Big Ten and lets say the ACC of doing what they do in basketwork with the big Ten and ACC challenge, How would that be a bad deal for anyone? Sign a couple year contract and set the matchups. Would create some buzz and would be an easy Marketing tool for both conferences. I am sure TV money would be good especially for some of the potential games

i thought there was some talk a few years ago for the B1G and Pac 12 have non-conf games each season. I don't recall other conferences, though.

 

[hawkdrummer1]

Actually HF had a bad bad bad loss to Tulsa. If I'm remembering straight, when they scheduled KSU and Colorado, they were terrible, but on the upswing when they caught Iowa.

Yep. One. On the road.

And he immediately made adjustments afterwards admitting what they'd done wrong. (came in the morning of the game, instead of the day before and preparing well.)

 

[HawkGold]

Yep. One. On the road.

And he immediately made adjustments afterwards admitting what they'd done wrong. (came in the morning of the game, instead of the day before and preparing well.)

Was that the "Shoe" game?

 

[tksirius]

My guess is Wisconsin will play Notre Dame and two cupcakes in those seasons. Iowa does not have that option because it's locked into the series with Iowa State. If you want to see the Hawkeyes play another Power 5 in the non-conference, the Cyclones must go.

I'd think most non-cyclown fans would agree with the last sentence.

 

[hawkdrummer1]

Was that the "Shoe" game?

Don't know about the "shoe" reference. What I do know is that Iowa took the game way too lightly. They flew in the morning of instead of going through the normal road game ritual. It showed. Worst loss of Hayden's career at Iowa.

 

[eveningnewsteam]

Don't know about the "shoe" reference. What I do know is that Iowa took the game way too lightly. They flew in the morning of instead of going through the normal road game ritual. It showed. Worst loss of Hayden's career at Iowa.

Should have learned. Took a miracle to beat Tulsa in Kinnick in 93. Iowa needed a TD and 2 pointer to win 26-25 with under a minute left

 

[hawkeyebob62]

At least Hayden won those games 52-0 instead of losing some of them. Times have changed; recruiting is national for everyone with 24 hour news cycles, social media, etc, Maybe 35 years ago Iowa fielded physically weaker teams than the big boys; but that certainly would not be true, today. Now that we're in an age of National Championship Playoffs, your non conference helps or hurts you when it comes to post season. Hayden had 1 less non con per season than kirk has. That makes it completely different. Why not play Alabama on a neutral field to get a huge t.v. splash? Many folks on this board were against playing kNU on Black Friday. Now, we understand the benefits of playing that game (now that we've won some).

<<Why not play Alabama on a neutral field to get a huge t.v. splash?>>
Do you really see that happening? What does Alabama gain by it? Roughly the same as we get playing ISU, I would imagine.

 

[hawkeyebob62]

There were a lot of similarities between KF and HF that many fans don't understand. Ironically HF thought the cupcakes would lead to fewer injuries, but my now fading memory tells me that wasn't the case.

I would say, in the early years, Hayden's thought process made a ton of sense. But getting away from the concrete-like astro"turf" probably made a lot more sense, injury-wise. These days, injuries are less a product of "schedule" and more a product of increased size/strength/speed/intensity.

For today, people talk about "visibility" and "high-profile" and "big money". With BTN and the TV deals, that's become a non-argument, except as it relates to "prestige". And even that is pretty specious from a national perspective, given the propensity of media hacks to play up the fact we're playing a "bad" team from our conference schedule in November, while $EC teams are playing FCS or severely deficient FBS teams that same weekend.

 

[hawkeyebob62]

My guess is Wisconsin will play Notre Dame and two cupcakes in those seasons. Iowa does not have that option because it's locked into the series with Iowa State. If you want to see the Hawkeyes play another Power 5 in the non-conference, the Cyclones must go.

You could hammer it into the heads of many in this forum and it STILL wouldn't sink in.

 

[ArvadaHawk]

<<Why not play Alabama on a neutral field to get a huge t.v. splash?>>
Do you really see that happening? What does Alabama gain by it? Roughly the same as we get playing ISU, I would imagine.

It's called an example. I hope you do get the concept, though, of playing tougher competition on a marque basis. WUs is just taking one more step past Iowa in the prestige category, as a program. They're becoming a national brand. I, for one, am not afraid if Iowa risking 1 loss per season to achieve the same.

 

[guffus]

I'd think most non-cyclown fans would agree with the last sentence.

How long have you been reading this message board? Most Iowa fans want the Iowa-ISU series to continue every year and to get rid of the 2 cupcake games instead. Nobody wants to see Iowa play North Texas. Thats the game on this years schedule that needs to go away forever.

 

[SmokeTownHawk]

Actually HF had a bad bad bad loss to Tulsa. If I'm remembering straight, when they scheduled KSU and Colorado, they were terrible, but on the upswing when they caught Iowa.

Oregon came to town one year during Hayden's reign. I'd love to see the Ducks on the schedule again.

 

[eveningnewsteam]

Oregon came to town one year during Hayden's reign. I'd love to see the Ducks on the schedule again.

1989. Oregon won 44-6 in the opener. Boy was that ugly. Iowa also returned the trip to Eugene in 1994 and got pasted again 40-18.

 

[SCHawkeye2]

From page 106 of Al Grady's "25 Years With the Fighting Hawkeyes": However, Iowa came away from the hard-hitting defensive game with a lot of players banged up, and Fry again commented on the philosophy of scheduling. "We enjoy the challenge of big intersectional games", he said, "but they don't count toward the championship. It's a lot easier playing a team that is not as physically strong. You're not so beaten up, you look good and you gain confidence. That is the only way to win consistently is to have a great schedule".

From page 95 of the same book: "Next year we'll have Nebraska right where we want 'em", said Hayden. "Off our schedule"

And finally, from page 110: It was important to note that finally...finally...Iowa was through "warming up" against teams like Penn State and Nebraska and Oklahoma and UCLA. The non-conference schedule was Drake, Northern Illinois and Iowa State. And if some critics wanted to pooh-pooh that sort of schedule, it was okay with Fry.

There you have it folks. The (possible) origin of the "modern" Iowa schedule philosophy.

The fact is, Notre Dame, and many others, won't do a home-and-home. They either want two games in THEIR stadium, or, at best, a two-and-one, with the "one" in Iowa City being the last game. Which, of course, gives them time to find another team and back out of the game in Iowa City by paying a nominal (for a blue-blood) cost.

No $EC team is coming to Iowa City. Put that dream away. Missouri, as a Big 12 member, backed out in order to play some less-than-powerful team from an after-thought conference. They aren't busting down walls to play now. There are some ACC and Pac 12 teams that will do it. But with nine-game schedule and the continued hard-on to play Iowa State every year on a home-and-home basis, there is no way around the fact that most years will feature one cupcake and a MAC/Mountain West/Sun Belt/C-USA type of team. If we could crystal ball ISU staying "down", that would be one thing, but as long as they treat the game as their Super Bowl, Iowa has to continue treating it like a P5 game.

Actually I think Hayden's strategy was the right thing to do - at that time.
Iowa had not had a winning season in 20 years. In a few of those seasons they lost to all their non-conference games to teams like USC, Penn State, UCLA and other 'top tier' schools. Had they played three cupcakes they might have had a winning record in some of those years.
Fry's first task was to build confidence on his team and achieve a winning record. Scheduling lighter non-con opponents allowed him to do that. Often they won by large margins - allowing the starters to rest and backups to get valuable playing time. Both made the program better overall.
That said, once the program has moved forward, scheduling better opponents is the next step to move on to the next level. Unfortunately, we continue to schedule cupcakes in an attempt to ensure at least three or four non-con victories and pad a mediocre, approximately .500 B10 record. Perhaps most importantly, we no longer get the 'benefit' of the cupcake schedule in the form of resting starters and gaining experience for backups. Our cupcake games are often close (or losses) with starters playing the whole games. The result is more injuries to valuable starters AND a lack of any real playing experience for the backups and future starters. All has a detrimental effect on the overall program over time.