JF is small by the standards of Iowa linemen that made it to the NFL. Also, Jones is coaching HS football and was an undrafted FA, who never made a roster. Of the top Iowa line recruits, Dace got hurt, Doering never panned out, Jones was mediocre, Larson didn't emerge, AD is still adding muscle.
looking at next years offense
- Thread starter herbyhawk
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JF is small by the standards of Iowa linemen that made it to the NFL. Also, Jones is coaching HS football and was an undrafted FA, who never made a roster. Of the top Iowa line recruits, Dace got hurt, Doering never panned out, Jones was mediocre, Larson didn't emerge, AD is still adding muscle.
hawkIhoops
Well-Known Member
Agree with CaarHawk. It's hard to fathom being worse offensively, but it will happen. We apparently don't actually recruit guys to play, as those spots are reserved for undersized walkons. Without McNutt to bail us out, I think it will be ugly. Canzeri and Johnson (assuming they don't leave) should combine for at least 10 carries each next season assuming Coker sprains both ankles and has the flu.
We used to be big and physical, now we are small and get pushed around by the likes of ISU and MN. Not sure I understand the thinking behind this.
MoseSchrute
Well-Known Member
So how did he fool all the recruiting services and coaches?
whatever on Larson spin it all you want it the fact remain his career was ended by injury so we never got to see the END of his CAREER
you bring up Dace his career was riduled with injury which had a BIG effect on his career
i doubt you ever played sports
to ignore the effects of how injuries have on your ability to play
also i looked back on Tobin he was a walk-on but when it comes to the O-Line that is one area i don't worry about as that is KF's strong suit
and again the more higher rated players you have on your team the easier it is to look past the players that don't pan out
with the way you are complaining about star rated player no working out the why complain about not getting any star players at the skill position as they can be failures just as easily,
i guess the answer is to call KF and tell him recruit strictly unranked recruits so we can afford failures of the ranked players
one last thing Scherff and Van Sloten have playing time
you bring up Dace his career was riduled with injury which had a BIG effect on his career
i doubt you ever played sports
to ignore the effects of how injuries have on your ability to play
also i looked back on Tobin he was a walk-on but when it comes to the O-Line that is one area i don't worry about as that is KF's strong suit
and again the more higher rated players you have on your team the easier it is to look past the players that don't pan out
with the way you are complaining about star rated player no working out the why complain about not getting any star players at the skill position as they can be failures just as easily,
i guess the answer is to call KF and tell him recruit strictly unranked recruits so we can afford failures of the ranked players
one last thing Scherff and Van Sloten have playing time
First, if you are talking to me about not playing sports, major fail there. I had a Jr. AAU track record, played on all teams of my HS football team, and played soccer in Europe.
Yes, I did get injured and have gone under the knife on more than one occasion from a sports injury and have pending surgery this year from an old injury that has been worked on twice.
If you are thinking that I have a problem with the multiple star players, I don't. I expect Iowa's line to be really, really good starting in 2013 and peaking in 2014.
The problem is that the line for 2012, which is what you are talking about is not going to be the one that has all the 4 star players starting. Or, if it is, none of them will have any game experience.
The likely line-up is Van Slotten, Tobin, Ferentz, Scherff, and Donnal. If MacMillan is able to play, he is most likely to take Donnal or Scherff's slot, merely based on previous playing time and former performance.
When you consider that Tobin outplayed Scherff this year and both he and Ferentz are not currently perceived as NFL quality linemen, the line for next year does not, in any conceivable way, look like an upgrade from this year.
Now, what would be best is if some of these guys could be sprinkled in with the less physically talented, but far more experienced guys, so that they are really ready to go in 2013.
If you look at Wisconsin, Michigan, Nebraska, Northwestern, and all the other "up and coming" programs, they have dual-threat quarterbacks. After having Brad Banks, and Drew Tate, why did our head coach revert back to lead-footed quarterbacks who wouldn't be able to side-step a street sweeper on Burlington Ave. in Iowa City? The league is passing us by in the type of offense we are running, recruiting, and every other aspect of the game. Our program is tired and lacks any sign of enthusiasm. Our coaching staff badly needs new blood!
my comment is directed at the people who call Blake Larson a failure
when he clearly wasn't
he had injuries that cut his career short
if MacMillan is go to go he will start in place of Tobin
Scherff was a freshman and to expect him to play as a AA his 1st year playing is idiotic at best
next year he will be a 3rd year So and i expect him to get better
Van Sloten will be a 4th year JR, both have played and both have experience
the 1st 4 game will give the chance to play as starters and gel but in the end youth is being served and at this point nobody should expect anymore than another 8-5 or 7-6 season
and by whose standard is a center that is 6'2 284 lbs a small center
if i could find past rosters i think Brian or Eubanks weren't much bigger and I think they had pretty good careers for Iowa
when he clearly wasn't
he had injuries that cut his career short
if MacMillan is go to go he will start in place of Tobin
Scherff was a freshman and to expect him to play as a AA his 1st year playing is idiotic at best
next year he will be a 3rd year So and i expect him to get better
Van Sloten will be a 4th year JR, both have played and both have experience
the 1st 4 game will give the chance to play as starters and gel but in the end youth is being served and at this point nobody should expect anymore than another 8-5 or 7-6 season
and by whose standard is a center that is 6'2 284 lbs a small center
if i could find past rosters i think Brian or Eubanks weren't much bigger and I think they had pretty good careers for Iowa
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i see no response to query about James actual size and weight
i did a little looking Austin Blythe who many feel will be next in line for the center spot is a monsterous 6'3 285 lbs a whole inch taller and a whopping 1 lb heavier
the team will be young and will struggle
but with past Iowa's offensive line they ussually get better the more they play
the good thing is the leader of the line is JF and will be a 5th year sr
and the center handles the line blocking calls
to be respectable we have to hope JVB improves his play on the road
and the Defensive line has to make giant strides with the youth
next year looks to be a painful one with youth
but with losing at most 3 sr starters on the D and 4 at most on offense in JVB, Davis, Ferenzt and Reiff if he comes back
the 2013 season will have more promise
i am ready for a bad year and expect it, if we get 8 or more wins i will be pleasently surprised
the best part is the 1st 5 game look winnable and will give the youngsters time to gel with getting the playing time they need
i did a little looking Austin Blythe who many feel will be next in line for the center spot is a monsterous 6'3 285 lbs a whole inch taller and a whopping 1 lb heavier
the team will be young and will struggle
but with past Iowa's offensive line they ussually get better the more they play
the good thing is the leader of the line is JF and will be a 5th year sr
and the center handles the line blocking calls
to be respectable we have to hope JVB improves his play on the road
and the Defensive line has to make giant strides with the youth
next year looks to be a painful one with youth
but with losing at most 3 sr starters on the D and 4 at most on offense in JVB, Davis, Ferenzt and Reiff if he comes back
the 2013 season will have more promise
i am ready for a bad year and expect it, if we get 8 or more wins i will be pleasently surprised
the best part is the 1st 5 game look winnable and will give the youngsters time to gel with getting the playing time they need
hogeye
Well-Known Member
Wow, this is filled with fail...
Wisconsin, Michigan and Nebraska aren't "up and coming" programs.
Michigan has a dual-threat QB because that's what the staff inherited, look at their recruiting, they are going back to the pocket passer. Look what they did with Denard. They curbed his running as much as they felt comfortable and tried to pass with him (which didn't work so well).
Wisconsin went with a short term, play making solution. I'll give you that.
Nebraska, yes they have a dual-threat QB, but similar to Michigan they're wanting a guy badly that can make plays with his arm as well, but honestly...this isn't the first running QB Nebraska has had, if anyone remembers Frazier, Gill, Crouch...nothing new here, this isn't a shift for Nebraska outside of the Callahan era.
Northwestern's success hasn't been dual-threat QB's. It's been "mobile" pocket passing QB's and there is a significant contrasting difference between Denard Robinson and the recent regime of NW QB's, and I am not talking about skin color, insert Martinez for the comparison if that helps.
That said, I am not downplaying the success with Banks and Tate, but conversely I think if throw Stanzi or other successful Iowa QB's in those same years you get similar results.
Stanford has demonstrated the power of pro-style success in this era. Michigan's success historically is predicated on it. Ohio State has arguably done more with lead-footed, no name QB's in the Sweater era. The standard issue USC QB has been largely pro-style in nature. Most fans can't even remember an Alabama QB's name that recently won a national title (despite the popular cliche that you can't hide your QB in college football, Alabama has done it multiple times).
hawkfarmer
Well-Known Member
I'm excited about the potential of the OL, but that's all it is when Reiff leaves. It always takes a while for the OL to gel and it will take a little extra next year. I hope they turn out to be good.
my biggest concern is JVB. He looked like he had no clue what to do anytime there was pressure, and sometimes even when there was faux pressure. Any pressure and he loses all accuracy and falls apart. That is scary to me.
my biggest concern is JVB. He looked like he had no clue what to do anytime there was pressure, and sometimes even when there was faux pressure. Any pressure and he loses all accuracy and falls apart. That is scary to me.
BALDIES7980
Well-Known Member
No one does something well that they never practice.
Before last year those of us that were being objective said JVB still needed to show he could handle pressure, because he hadn't by that point. Now it appears as if he might just not have the temperament to ever quite get it down.
hawkfarmer
Well-Known Member
tha is what is scary. One thing to think about is that he likely rarely saw any pressure in high school, and compare that to the competition JR saw, I'm hoping that his pocket presence is more instinctual than JVBs is.
DarthKinnick
Well-Known Member
Regarding next year's offense:
We are losing OLs. This, despite KF being the OL guru, right? But I digress.....Would it even matter WHO the hell was blocking if Iowa could feature WRs and TEs who could get downfield in 2-3 seconds?
Iowa's scheme is actually smart IF IT HAS THE RIGHT PLAYERS at virtually ALL positions simultaneously. Can't have everyone stacked up across the line, which ALL defenses can do if they feel no threats downfield. Iowa plays automatically right into that.
Now, the question IS: Why does Iowa almost always lack a downfield threat? And why 13 years into this project has KF produced NO legitimate gamebreaking receivers?
Our TEs are always projects. WRs are always even MORE developmental projects. They all have substantial flaws that negate their pass-catching or route-run abilities.
This year, CJF was apparently lost (in his mind? is he not really that bright? WTF?) on the field most of the time. Herman is slower than many guards and tackles! FBs just do not catch well these days at Iowa. Remember Lew Montgomery? We don't have one.
Keenan Davis.......whatever he "is", he ain't "it". He cannot catch. He is not fast. He is not precise on routes, and he seems to have no X-factor. Seems to disappear for long stretches of the game even when he DOES play.
McNutt......tall, slow, bad hands. Great when he is wide open, reliable possession receiver. NOT a downfield game-breaking threat.
Martin-Manley: short, not that fast, etc. Great hands? Dunno. Great routes? Dunno.
Is Iowa a system in which you can even analyze most WRs?
Judging from the roster, it seems that KF prefers to field a team of 6-2 to 6-5 TEs and LBs at every position, and recruits with that in mind. Almost like he doesn't envision football as a game of interlocking separate pieces with guys of different sizes, speeds, etc. KF seems to want a completely redundant system where each part can simply be plugged into every other part. So we have LBs and TEs as these stem-cell players that are plugged into every position.
It is intensely frustrating as an alumnus and as a fan to watch Iowa on one hand, and then see Ok. State and Oregon use a huge variety of different-sized guys in all sorts of novel ways. I get it now.
We are losing OLs. This, despite KF being the OL guru, right? But I digress.....Would it even matter WHO the hell was blocking if Iowa could feature WRs and TEs who could get downfield in 2-3 seconds?
Iowa's scheme is actually smart IF IT HAS THE RIGHT PLAYERS at virtually ALL positions simultaneously. Can't have everyone stacked up across the line, which ALL defenses can do if they feel no threats downfield. Iowa plays automatically right into that.
Now, the question IS: Why does Iowa almost always lack a downfield threat? And why 13 years into this project has KF produced NO legitimate gamebreaking receivers?
Our TEs are always projects. WRs are always even MORE developmental projects. They all have substantial flaws that negate their pass-catching or route-run abilities.
This year, CJF was apparently lost (in his mind? is he not really that bright? WTF?) on the field most of the time. Herman is slower than many guards and tackles! FBs just do not catch well these days at Iowa. Remember Lew Montgomery? We don't have one.
Keenan Davis.......whatever he "is", he ain't "it". He cannot catch. He is not fast. He is not precise on routes, and he seems to have no X-factor. Seems to disappear for long stretches of the game even when he DOES play.
McNutt......tall, slow, bad hands. Great when he is wide open, reliable possession receiver. NOT a downfield game-breaking threat.
Martin-Manley: short, not that fast, etc. Great hands? Dunno. Great routes? Dunno.
Is Iowa a system in which you can even analyze most WRs?
Judging from the roster, it seems that KF prefers to field a team of 6-2 to 6-5 TEs and LBs at every position, and recruits with that in mind. Almost like he doesn't envision football as a game of interlocking separate pieces with guys of different sizes, speeds, etc. KF seems to want a completely redundant system where each part can simply be plugged into every other part. So we have LBs and TEs as these stem-cell players that are plugged into every position.
It is intensely frustrating as an alumnus and as a fan to watch Iowa on one hand, and then see Ok. State and Oregon use a huge variety of different-sized guys in all sorts of novel ways. I get it now.
hawkfarmer
Well-Known Member
Here you go darth. Please go make good use of it
WTH are you even talking about here? Losing Reiff (high 1st round) and Zusevics (possible draft choice) is evidence that KF is not an OL guru?
What's your point here? Moeaki was not a project. This has been the first year in quite a while that we were not very good at TE.
McNutt does not have bad hands.
Until Iowa gets their own Phil Knight or T Boone Pickens, you're probably going to continue to be frustrated.
superfan12
Well-Known Member
Tobin is terrible. He should not be starting on the line next year. Shouldn't have been starting and he wouldn't have if MacMillan was healthy.
spudhawk
Well-Known Member
This year, CJF was apparently lost (in his mind? is he not really that bright? WTF?) on the field most of the time. Herman is slower than many guards and tackles! FBs just do not catch well these days at Iowa. Remember Lew Montgomery? We don't have one>>>> from DarthKinnick
Your analysis of Iowa's players sucks. But to say Herman is slow is just damning. I am going to go out on a limb and say you don't work in player personnel for any football league, including your kids pee wee league. Herman is one of the better athletes Iowa has had at TE and if he would have stayed at LB likely would have had a shot at being a three year starter.
Your analysis of Iowa's players sucks. But to say Herman is slow is just damning. I am going to go out on a limb and say you don't work in player personnel for any football league, including your kids pee wee league. Herman is one of the better athletes Iowa has had at TE and if he would have stayed at LB likely would have had a shot at being a three year starter.
