Lickliter regrets leaving Butler for Iowa
- Thread starter HawkeyeHypnosis
- Start date
1977Hawkeye
Well-Known Member
I expect at UCLA, that Alford will be able to get enough talent where he would be able to pull it off. Thing is, he is going to find that Sweet 16's are not going to be enough with that program. Just ask Ben Howland. He took UCLA to how many Final Fours and still got fired after a couple of off years?
1977Hawkeye
Well-Known Member
Same here. Alford is clearly more hated by the fan base, but I don't care what anyone says, Lick did far more damage to the state of the program. Things slipped a little under Alford, but Lick took us to historically bad levels, losing 22 games his last year. I believe he also finished with the worst winning percentage of any coach in program history. There ya go.
Fran had one heck of a rebuilding job on his hands, cleaning up Lick's mess.
hawkeye12345
Well-Known Member
I'm sorry but Lick did not harm the Iowa program nearly as much as alford did.
Pre-alford, Iowa appeared in the NCAA Tourney 9 out of 13 years under Mr. Davis, 2 out of 3 years under Raveling, and the last 5 years under LUTE!!!!! For those of you that are mathematically challenged, that's 16 out 21 years Iowa was in the tournament pre-alford. That's pretty astounding when you think about it.
Boob Bowlsby f'ed up when he didn't renew Mr. Davis's contract and we went into a lame duck season - that was not alford's fault and I tried to cut the guy some slack when he first arrived on campus.... alford was a flash in the pan hire with very little real coaching experience and only 4 seasons of what some would loosely consider D1 coaching experience. He got lucky by taking a 12-seed on an epic sweet 16 run before Iowa hired him. In other words, the guy had no real coaching experience and it showed when he arrived at Iowa.
It didn't take long for players to start transferring...I think it was his second recruiting class that had Cortney Scott who left after his freshman year...that guy went on to help Oakland make the tourney. Then year after year players would defect or get kicked off the team....PP anyone?
Once alf let his dad go and actually brought in a decent staff it was really almost too late, the damage was already done. Noodle$ tried to save the day by bringing in the first 4* recruit since the Raveling days but they couldn't keep him happy.....
The writing on the wall for alford was when Vanderbeken and Crawford didn't show up on campus and Smith left...The AD had warned alford that any more player defections would not be a good thing for the program.....alf knew Tyler Smith was not coming back and jumped ship before he got canned (fact).
Lick got lucky with Gatens being from Iowa City...hell Daffy Duck could have coached Iowa and Matt would have stuck around. But Lick was in way over his head too. The program was already in a downward spiral and only Fran the Man himself could save it. Fortunately we only had to endure 3 years of Lick my %&$ ball before White Lightning arrived to save the day.
Anyway, long story short, Boob Bowlsby and alford destroyed a pretty damn good basketball program, Lick buried it, and Fran has pumped life back into the program.
Pre-alford, Iowa appeared in the NCAA Tourney 9 out of 13 years under Mr. Davis, 2 out of 3 years under Raveling, and the last 5 years under LUTE!!!!! For those of you that are mathematically challenged, that's 16 out 21 years Iowa was in the tournament pre-alford. That's pretty astounding when you think about it.
Boob Bowlsby f'ed up when he didn't renew Mr. Davis's contract and we went into a lame duck season - that was not alford's fault and I tried to cut the guy some slack when he first arrived on campus.... alford was a flash in the pan hire with very little real coaching experience and only 4 seasons of what some would loosely consider D1 coaching experience. He got lucky by taking a 12-seed on an epic sweet 16 run before Iowa hired him. In other words, the guy had no real coaching experience and it showed when he arrived at Iowa.
It didn't take long for players to start transferring...I think it was his second recruiting class that had Cortney Scott who left after his freshman year...that guy went on to help Oakland make the tourney. Then year after year players would defect or get kicked off the team....PP anyone?
Once alf let his dad go and actually brought in a decent staff it was really almost too late, the damage was already done. Noodle$ tried to save the day by bringing in the first 4* recruit since the Raveling days but they couldn't keep him happy.....
The writing on the wall for alford was when Vanderbeken and Crawford didn't show up on campus and Smith left...The AD had warned alford that any more player defections would not be a good thing for the program.....alf knew Tyler Smith was not coming back and jumped ship before he got canned (fact).
Lick got lucky with Gatens being from Iowa City...hell Daffy Duck could have coached Iowa and Matt would have stuck around. But Lick was in way over his head too. The program was already in a downward spiral and only Fran the Man himself could save it. Fortunately we only had to endure 3 years of Lick my %&$ ball before White Lightning arrived to save the day.
Anyway, long story short, Boob Bowlsby and alford destroyed a pretty damn good basketball program, Lick buried it, and Fran has pumped life back into the program.
jacknicholson
Well-Known Member
Despite Alford's arrogance, HAIR, and extremely poor judgement concerning Pierre, he had some very good teams a few years and did very well in the Big, got us to the tournament a few times, losing in the first round every time except beating Creighton his first year, I believe, but still making the Dance. His most despicable disgrace was the unforgettable and unforgivable loss to NW State in the last second, blowing two 17 point leads.....
His inability to call time outs at critical times was a major deficit. Noodles helped in that failure for the most part.....
He was much better than Lick who couldn't turn the money down and thought he had the ability to coach and recruit in the Big.....
The Pierre Pearce situation and his incredible arrogance turned the students and fans off and they stopped going to the games. That has finally been corrected in fine fashion....'
I remember watching Alford at Drake when we were rated very high with Recker and Evans. He strutted onto the court like a freaking King. It was embarrassing to see......
jacknicholson
Well-Known Member
Another thing, he would blame the players for a loss with the press. I remember one time Sean Sonderliter at ISU received his second foul with about a minute to go in the first half. ISU shot free throws. Alford made a substitution and I assumed Sean would take a seat. Not so. He left him in and he got his third foul on a rebound after a missed free throw.....
Unfortunately Sean received his fourth foul early in the second half, and had to sit most of the half, we lost and Alford blamed the loss on Sonderliter getting his fourth foul so soon in the second half.....
It was pitiful coaching that lost the game, why leave a player with two fouls in the last minute of the first half.....
Unfortunately Sean received his fourth foul early in the second half, and had to sit most of the half, we lost and Alford blamed the loss on Sonderliter getting his fourth foul so soon in the second half.....
It was pitiful coaching that lost the game, why leave a player with two fouls in the last minute of the first half.....
I think Alford just wasnt ready to run a big time program. I always thought he would end up being a good coach. He just learned a lot at Iowas exspense. I also think he thought he could come in and be treated at Iowa like Knight was treated at Ind. People didnt like his attitude. Should of won a couple National Tittles and he would have been able to pull off the act.
linus19
Well-Known Member
Alford is a whiz at landing the NIT bids too. I can't imagine the UCLA fan base would put up with more than one of those.
hawkeye12345
Well-Known Member
Iowa's first appearance in the NCAAs with alford as the coach was the 00-01 season (alf's 2nd). We were a #7 seed and beat Creighton in the first round. We then got smoked by Kentucky. Do you remember how we made it into the tournament? That's right, a 4-day run in the Big10 tournament, a tournament championship and an automatic bid. Otherwise we were not playing in the post-season.
lightning1
Well-Known Member
Agreed. I also think Barta failed to realize the recruiting issues inherent at Iowa and that failure reared it's head when Licks best recruiter wasn't coming with him. The word around the message boards was that Stephens was the Ace in Lick's deck at Butler. Lick without Stephens was an unknown. That came from the Indiana and Purdue boards at that time. That would have meant little if Lick had some other Aces to slide into the spot Stephens held....but he didn't.
lightning1
Well-Known Member
Yep. 7-9 in conference play that season. Needed that run to get into the tourney. Also won it in 05-06' season but they finished 2nd in conference play. Went on to get upset in first round of NCAA tourney.
ibahawkeye
Well-Known Member
I have little to no hard feelings for Lick. To be honest, it's hard to feel strongly about a guy with such a BLAH personality.
Lick's tenure will always be known for the inability to retain players. I'm not saying he would have ever gotten the job done but I think his results would have been better had he kept palyers. Obvioulsy that is part of the responsibility as a head coach is to keep players happy and competiting hard. Obviously we are lucky that things happendd the way we did and to end up with Fran.
Lick's tenure will always be known for the inability to retain players. I'm not saying he would have ever gotten the job done but I think his results would have been better had he kept palyers. Obvioulsy that is part of the responsibility as a head coach is to keep players happy and competiting hard. Obviously we are lucky that things happendd the way we did and to end up with Fran.
atomicblue224
Well-Known Member
And you bow to the "King"? Just Kidding! I know what you mean ....
Take care.
bcl20
Well-Known Member
Anyone with knowledge of that season knows that's debatable. They were a bubble team and probably in once they got to the finals of the BTT.
Alford blew and was a disappointment but let's face it, that team struggle once Recker got hurt. They were a lock until that.
hawkinn3
Well-Known Member
He wanted a "basketball school" he got it. Historic program, great facilities, easy recruiting. I'd like to see how he spins his eventual failure at this job.
hawkeye12345
Well-Known Member
Recker getting hurt totally unwound that season that's for sure. It doesn't invalidate the fact that we would not have made it to the NCAAs without winning the conference tournament. We were not a bubble team as we lost 7 of our last 8 that season (all without Recker). The conference wasn't going to get 7 in without us winning the tournament. (See 2001-2002 season if you think we would have made the tournament)
So you think that Iowa went from not in the tournament to being a 7 seed by beating Indiana on Selection Sunday back in 2001?
That may be the stupidest thing I have read today.
