Lick & Point Guards

drew003

Well-Known Member
From my (admittedly distant) perception of Lick's interaction with his point guards, his treatment seems paradoxical.

First, Lick needs a good point guard to run his offense. The point guard is in large part responsible for the dribble penetration needed to initiate his offense. The point guard must be able to penetrate off ball screens, probe the lane, collapse the defense, and find the open man--all against Big 10 athletes. This requires a talented point guard, a guard with above-average athleticism, good-to-great handles, and high basketball IQ (this combination of skills does not grow on trees).

But second, Lick appears to give his point guard absolutely no discretion, freedom to improvise, or freedom to play fast. He coaches the heck out of them, and seems to make it generally unpleasant to be his point guard (see Freeman, Peterson, and at times Payne).

This paradox seems to create a problem. He needs a highly skilled & talented player, but is unwilling to loosen the reigns on this player, which in turn creates frustration in his point guard. This frustration leads to transfers or point guards simply not electing to play for Iowa.

I guess an argument could be made that Lick has never had this highly skilled point guard, and that Lick would give discretion if he ever recruits/finds/develop this point guard. But it seems constructing an offense dependent on a talented point guard, who is willing to tolerate being extensively micro-managed, and willing to exclusively play slow-it-down penetrate & kick basketball is not a good strategy. I think Lick is finding it is hard to find this point guard.
 
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I thought he gave Kelly quite a bit of free rein last season. It takes a PG with good quicks and good decision-making to get the green light to freestyle out there. Kelly is really the only PG Lick has had who possessed both of those qualities, IMO. Cully is a little faster than he's given credit for, but still below average speed compared to a typical B10 PG. And he's still a freshman, so it's understandable that Lick would be reluctant to just hand him the keys and let him drive.
 
Like the orignal OP, I'm not that versed in nueances of Bball. However, Drew's post makes a lot of sense to me from a logic perspective.

I'd like to hear more "experts" (i.e. Spank's et al) thoughts on Drew's post.

Is he in left field or is it a fair observation.
 
if he means by letting the reigns loose and turning the game into a run and gun game then he is wrong. the reigns are pretty loose as is, all players on the floor have freedom to take shots at any point during a possession. what team wouldn't want a "highly" skilled pg, but there are less than a handful of such players. there is more to being a pg then being a lightning slasher. for cully, in terms of full-time pg for a frosh, its one of the better jobs i've seen that isn't named rose, wall, or conley jr
 
Al Nolen,Lew Jackson,Demetri McCamey,JR Richardson,Battle,Verdell Jones, Mike Thompson are pgs in the conference now who played well as frosh...at least as well as Cully, who I do like, but who has a ton of bad turnovers..unforced variety.
Cully is struggling,but he should not be starting at pg as a frosh, like Kalin Lucas had Walton ahead of him and Hughes of wisky had a jr, ahead of him..
 
I don't know, boneshq.

There are plenty of freshmen PGs every year that play at a high level. Dean Oliver for one and even Armistead, who we tried for late last year is dong pretty good. He has less TOs, more assists and more points in one less minute per game. You don't have to be a once or twice in a generation player to be a better freshman PG than Payne. I am not dogging him, I'm just pointing out your statement is off.
 
I wonder what he would do with a point guard like Ronnie Lester? Would he clear out a side like Lute used to and just turn Ronnie loose? No one was able to stop Ronnie. Would he change his offense because of Ronnie?

If he wouldn't be willing to adapt to a player of Ronnie's ability, I can see why those players will never play for him nor should they. They should play for a coach that wants to utilize their skills.
 
if u don't think cully payne hasn't played good bball for a frosh pg i don't know what to say, he has played just as well as those are the guys on the list, and some of those guys had a bit more help than cully at this point. i'm not calling him a world beater, but he has shown me than if he naturally progresses he will a fine pg, not a guy that doesn't belong at this level
 
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if u don't think cully payne hasn't played good bball for a frosh pg i don't know what to say, he has played just as well as those are the guys on the list, and some of those guys had a bit more help than cully at this point. i'm not calling him a world beater, but he has shown me than if he naturally progresses he will a fine pg, not a guy that doesn't belong at this level

There is no doubt Cully belongs at this level, just not as an underclassmen. The problem is right now our PG play is clearly the worst in the BT. If we had even Big Ten average PG play we would probably have 4 more wins at least. This is not all Cully either as most teams have 2 or 3 PGs on the roster and Lick only had Tucker and Cully and it was very obvious that Tucker is not a PG. Cully will be a good player with time but he needs help. That is why it is so strange to myself and others that not one true PG was recruited for next year.
 
if u don't think cully payne hasn't played good bball for a frosh pg i don't know what to say, he has played just as well as those are the guys on the list, and some of those guys had a bit more help than cully at this point. i'm not calling him a world beater, but he has shown me than if he naturally progresses he will a fine pg, not a guy that doesn't belong at this level


Actually you did call him a world-beater when you said that he has only fallen short of:
Conley- top 7 pick after his frosh year when he took OSU to the title game
Rose- #1 pick, rookie of the year,after one year where he took Memphis to the title game
Wall- projected #1 pick, after a frosh year where he probably takes Ky to the FF..

Now,to your credit, you did say Cully was not as good as these guys, but you basically said he was next in line with his play as a frosh pg...that is world-beater territory to me. Al Nolen led the big ten in steals as a frosh,for instance.
I agree that most good teams have more help for their pg...and if Jeff or Jake had stayed, Cully would have been much better off..

I feel badly for the young man...he is under a lot of pressure out there at that position,which results in some pretty agregious unforced turnovers that make him look worse than he probably is..
 

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