That’s the lineup I finally settled on after going back and forth on it for a long while. Baer can get 24-28 minutes off the bench which is the perfect amount for his playing style.I still say (and prefer) that Baer comes off the bench. He will still play a starters share of minutes, but I think last year validated that Baer coming off the bench is the best thing for the team.
Bohannon
Moss
Wagner (with a quick hook for baer)
Cook
Garza
That's what I want to happen
That’s the lineup I finally settled on after going back and forth on it for a long while. Baer can get 24-28 minutes off the bench which is the perfect amount for his playing style.
I look at it as Baer’s 3pt shooting pairs better with Williams on the “second unit.” Plus Wagner isn’t really out there looking to score, which makes some sense when we have Cook, Moss, and JBo on the first unit who all need shots. Not to mention Garza. Baer on the second unit will be asked to score a little bit more than he would be as a starter, which is something I think he can handle.
I wouldn’t go so far as saying Wagner is a better defender than Baer, however I do think he is more versatile which could be a nice asset in the starting 5, allowing him in essence to guard the best wing on the other team, say a Bridges or a Vince Edwards. If he gets a couple fouls, so what, here comes Baer.
Wagner starting at the “3” also opens up the front court in a way that also makes some sense. I don’t see Wagner getting more than 10-15 MPG, his role as a starter may be similar to Moss’s last year.
That’s the logic behind that lineup to me.
If Baer doesn't start but gets 28 minutes per game, he could only get about 2 minutes of rest per half after coming in. If he starts, he can get 6 minutes of rest per half playing 28 minutes per game. This is all with the assumption that 4 minutes will go by before he comes in, which is at least the average. A guy like Baer needs to play, rest, play, rest, in bursts to be effective. That's hard to do when you don't start.
If Baer doesn't start but gets 28 minutes per game, he could only get about 2 minutes of rest per half after coming in. If he starts, he can get 6 minutes of rest per half playing 28 minutes per game. This is all with the assumption that 4 minutes will go by before he comes in, which is at least the average. A guy like Baer needs to play, rest, play, rest, in bursts to be effective. That's hard to do when you don't start.
Baer played just under 24 minutes per game last year coming off the bench. Usually Fran is quick with the trigger and brings a sub in after the first tv timeout...sometimes sooner if he doesnt like what he sees. So Baer plays the 16-10 minute marks and then the 6-0 minute marks and theres 24 minutes per game.
Baer started the first 6 or so games last year and he (and Iowa) really struggled. Then Fran brought him off the bench and things started clicking. He's a spark that provides instant energy when starters are starting to get tired.
I like Wagner starting in that he's not a score-first player. Iowa's offense always needs a guy on offense to set screens.
If Baer doesn't start but gets 28 minutes per game, he could only get about 2 minutes of rest per half after coming in. If he starts, he can get 6 minutes of rest per half playing 28 minutes per game. This is all with the assumption that 4 minutes will go by before he comes in, which is at least the average. A guy like Baer needs to play, rest, play, rest, in bursts to be effective. That's hard to do when you don't start.
A couple points here.Great point. Plus why not try to get off to the best start you can, with your best players.
A couple points here.
1. The get your best players on the floor to start the game thing kind of falls short for me. Baer was one of our top guys last year and he didn’t start. Was he not better than Wagner last year? Did Fran have the lineup wrong?
2. Another point is just because Wagner starts the game does not mean he needs to start the second half. Say Wagner, Cook, or Garza are in foul trouble, slide Baer in to start the 2H (I know this would take a philosophy change by Fran on sitting guys with 2 fouls, which is another topic of discussion). Or if Baer has the hot hand in the 1H, let him start the 2nd.
I like the idea of Wagner starting for the reasons I mentioned in my previous post. I’m not sure that it will actually happen but I do think it makes some sense.
I still say (and prefer) that Baer comes off the bench. He will still play a starters share of minutes, but I think last year validated that Baer coming off the bench is the best thing for the team.
Bohannon
Moss
Wagner (with a quick hook for baer)
Cook
Garza
That's what I want to happen
I agree the decision is not black or white. We can all agree we want Baer out there at the end of the game, it’s just a matter of how we get there.Baer had times last year where he was ineffective because he was exhausted, but still in the game because we needed him. It's easier to give a player "starter minutes" if he's a starter. Not every decision is black and white so it's hard to say Fran was flat out wrong. I would say he was wrongish.
I could see Wagner starting but playing less mins then Baer too. Or even Wagner at the 4 and Cook at the 5 while Garza comes off the bench. He's got a ton of options to play with it'll be interesting to see how it plays out. But the two guards and Cook you can put that in ink.Barring injury or other oddities, I expect the lineup to be:
1. Bohannon
2. Moss
3. Baer
4. Cook
5. Garza
Iowa struggles the first 6 games had nothing to do with Baer starting. It had to do with two of the worst players on the team starting.
He can do 24 a game, but more than that is really hard coming off the bench. We both agree with subs coming in around the first tv timeout which is 4 minutes in. If he starts and gets 28 minutes, he can play 5, rest 3, play 5, rest 3, play 4. If he comes off the bench, he needs to play 7, rest 2, play 7. That's tough to do while playing at hos pace.
I agree the decision is not black or white. We can all agree we want Baer out there at the end of the game, it’s just a matter of how we get there.
Here are a couple more potential reasons to have Baer coming off the bench.
- Maybe due to his playing style, 24 minutes is really the most he should be out there. We certainly have the depth and other options to support that. Bring him in at 16 take him out at the under 8, then bring him back in with around 4 minutes in each half to close it out.
- Ball handling. If the idea is that Wagner is going to play 3 this year, I think we will have a ball handling issue if Wagner and Williams are on the court at the same time. Baer can help alleviate some pressure from Williams who as we know isn’t the best ball handling PG out there.
- There is also a school of thought out there that he is actually a more effective player when coming off the bench, and there could be something to that.
In 8 games starting he was:
6.75 PPG/ 39.5 FG%/ 34% 3P%/ 5.25 REB
His season averages were:
7.5PPG/ 49.6 FG%/ 39.4% 3P%/ 5.8 REB
I could see Kriener over Garza, particularly early in the seasonBarring injury or other oddities, I expect the lineup to be:
1. Bohannon
2. Moss
3. Baer
4. Cook
5. Garza
What 8 games did he start again. I can't remember.
Did he do that last year some? Leave guys in foul trouble on the bench to start 2nd halves I mean? I think that's a good idea depending on the foul situation and player involved. We are so deep in the front court I feel go with the hot hands and run with them as much as possible. If Cook, Wagner or Pemsl fouls out with 5 mins to go or so so what? I have faith in the other guys, there just isn't that much of a drop off.A couple points here.
1. The get your best players on the floor to start the game thing kind of falls short for me. Baer was one of our top guys last year and he didn’t start. Was he not better than Wagner last year? Did Fran have the lineup wrong?
2. Another point is just because Wagner starts the game does not mean he needs to start the second half. Say Wagner, Cook, or Garza are in foul trouble, slide Baer in to start the 2H (I know this would take a philosophy change by Fran on sitting guys with 2 fouls, which is another topic of discussion). Or if Baer has the hot hand in the 1H, let him start the 2nd.
I like the idea of Wagner starting for the reasons I mentioned in my previous post. I’m not sure that it will actually happen but I do think it makes some sense.