Agree, both great golfers. Tiger probably more into fitness (excluding the endeavors with the ladies) than Jack but different times, just like 1970s NFL to today's NFL.
Kirk Ferentz: Living Legend
- Thread starter JonDMiller
- Start date
Agree, both great golfers. Tiger probably more into fitness (excluding the endeavors with the ladies) than Jack but different times, just like 1970s NFL to today's NFL.
BigD
Well-Known Member
You forgot a few things;
Fry was surrounded by national power teams, Nebraska, Michigan, Notre Dame and had to recruit against them. During KF’s tenure all three of these programs were down.
Fry beat Wisconsin 15 out of 17 years and now Wisconsin appears to be in the drivers seat. That one is EYE bulging. We would be lucky to to make it two years in a row now.
Fry had to compete against the entire conference for bowl appearances. You finished fifth you sat at home.
Fry’s football program didn’t get laced with $30 million dollar gifts from the BTN every year. Now it’s up to $60 million a year. For Fry all the moneys from bowl games was divided up amongst all the Big Ten teams and that was after all the travel expenses for the bowl games which really left very little.
The program Fry inherited was much worse than what Kirk inherited.
Now having said that Jon is right in that both coaches will go down as Iowa coaching legends. They both did great things. I don’t like KF’s boring style of offense and some of the bone headed mistakes he has made (all coaches make them) but he will be remembered as a great coach at Iowa.
Unfortunately Ohio State fans also will love him because for the most part he was never a threat to compete against their program (you don’t know how much it pains me to say that). Would have loved to be more of a thorn in OSU’s side than just this past season.
If we would have won the Northwestern and Purdue game this year I would have been much happier as we would have reached that 9-3 mark I picked at the beginning of the season and be playing somewhere this New Year’s Day. I didn’t just pulled that record out of my hat either. I explained back then why Inthought we could be that good.
- Hoping for better next year and will be very pissed off if we don’t do better. I hope you 7-5 ers won’t be out next year telling us how satisfying the season was.
JonDMiller
Publisher/Founder
In the Fry era, there were four teams in the Big Ten that had winning records over the span of those 20 years, who were in the league for that entire time: Michigan, Ohio State, Iowa and Wisconsin. The Badgers were two games over .500.
That's it. Northwestern had the 5th worst winning percentage among FBS teams, at .274. ISU was 95th out of 106 teams. Minnesota 86th. Michigan State was sub .500.
In the Ferentz era of Big Ten football, Ohio State, Wisconsin, Penn State and Michigan State have a winning percentage of at least 60%. Iowa is at 59.4. Northwestern and Minnesota are also above 50%.
Nebraska is also above 50%.
These debates just seem a bit silly, and a stretch, either way.
What is obvious is that there are those who love Kirk and always will, and there are those who don't, and won't.
The constant fighting of the factions is tiring...and those who feel like they have to come in and piss all over things just because something positive is being mentioned about someone they don't care for, go find someone else to irritate.
That's it. Northwestern had the 5th worst winning percentage among FBS teams, at .274. ISU was 95th out of 106 teams. Minnesota 86th. Michigan State was sub .500.
In the Ferentz era of Big Ten football, Ohio State, Wisconsin, Penn State and Michigan State have a winning percentage of at least 60%. Iowa is at 59.4. Northwestern and Minnesota are also above 50%.
Nebraska is also above 50%.
These debates just seem a bit silly, and a stretch, either way.
What is obvious is that there are those who love Kirk and always will, and there are those who don't, and won't.
The constant fighting of the factions is tiring...and those who feel like they have to come in and piss all over things just because something positive is being mentioned about someone they don't care for, go find someone else to irritate.
ArvadaHawk
Well-Known Member
To be clear, in this context, a legend: is a person or thing that inspires. being a legend doesn't make you good or bad. it only means that you "inspire." so yeah, kirk certainly inspires both pro and con. he is a legend.
SpiderRico
Well-Known Member
He could afford to because the B1G at the time was literally Mich & OSU and no one else.
We beat NW something like 18 straight and Wisky something like 20 straight.
Fry would almost always beat the patsies (Tulsa excluded), but we often got our assed handed to us by elite teams.
KF has issues with lower level teams, but is uber competitive against elite teams, and often beats them.
Different sides of the same coin....
Ben Rumson
Well-Known Member
Biggest reason for this is Iowa doesn't have a homer network i.e.( ESPN) like the teams you mentioned.
hawkeyebob62
Well-Known Member
Excellent points. And lest people forget, it was Fry who WANTED the "juggernauts" off the non-conference schedule (with good reason, IMO). We went into conference season down numerous players each year. Teams like Nebraska, Oklahoma and Penn State were stockpiling guys on their rosters just to keep them away from opponents' rosters. Between the 1968 and 1981 season, one team aside from O$U and Michigan went to the Rose Bowl, Iowa in the 1981 season. MSU was "champion" in 1978 or 79, but was on probation, thus ineligible for postseason play. Fry broke that stranglehold, but it wasn't like the floodgates opened. Between 1981 and 1990, add Illinois and MSU. And again, it wasn't like there was a logjam atop the conference. Other teams were occasionally in the hunt, but until Alvarez got to Wisconsin and PSU joined the Big Ten, rare was the season O$U or Michigan wasn't the conference participant. And when they weren't the conference representative, it was definitely rare for a school OTHER than O$U/scUM to be a conference representative in one of the other major bowls of the time (Cotton, Sugar, Orange, later the Fiesta).
Frankly, Fry's descent was brought about by both losing assistants AND the ascension of other schools. KF has definitely faced more "parity". But again, though KF didn't inherit a "robust" team, he had Fry's blueprint. Without Fry, there is no KF "discussion". KF would probably the first person to point that out...like he did in a postgame interview when the Fry-tying win question was brought up to him.
SpiderRico
Well-Known Member
He played patsies in 6 out of 8 B1G conference games...
tksirius
HN's Love Doctor
Without looking it up, I'd imagine Fry played more top 5 & top 10 teams while Kirk played more teams in the 10-25 range. I'd also imagine that Kirk played more ranked teams in bowl games as well.
tksirius
HN's Love Doctor
This is absolutely not true. That whole shtick is way overplayed. Yes, the B1G is better than it was during Fry's time, but not nearly as much as you think. Hell, I know Fry played an Indiana team that was ranked in the top 10 and I think he played NW when they were ranked 4 or 5 in the country. Also, Fry pretty much had to play Ohio St & Michigan every year. The same can't be said for Kirk.
HawkeyeWalker
Well-Known Member
Having to play very good OSU and Mich teams every year is a solid point.
Ultimately, we are pretty lucky with the coaces we've had for 40 years. The fact there's even a debate who was better speaks volumes.
Go Hawks.
DMLadyhawk
Well-Known Member
I was in college when Hayden Fry became the Hawkeyes coach. I had not known a winning season in my lifetime before him and I went to my first game at age 8. We have been fortunate beyond words to have coaches the calibur of Fry and Ferentz.
I get impatient when people try to compare them. They coached in different eras. Hayden brought the Hawks back from football purgatory, There is much more parity in college football now. Ferentz is going to finish near the top of all time Big Ten Coaches. However, it was not Jon's intention to compare the two:
This isn’t an article about which coach is better than the other
Kirk and Mary Ferentz are two of the most generous, compassionate people you would ever want to meet. Listen to the words his players said about winning game 143 for him. He makes a lifelong impression on many of the young men he coaches. He is very well thought of by other coaches as well. Everyone is entitled to his/her opinion about his coaching ability. I think Jon's point is valid and I think the idea of a statue waving at the hospital is fantastic. Go Hawks
"
I get impatient when people try to compare them. They coached in different eras. Hayden brought the Hawks back from football purgatory, There is much more parity in college football now. Ferentz is going to finish near the top of all time Big Ten Coaches. However, it was not Jon's intention to compare the two:
This isn’t an article about which coach is better than the other
Kirk and Mary Ferentz are two of the most generous, compassionate people you would ever want to meet. Listen to the words his players said about winning game 143 for him. He makes a lifelong impression on many of the young men he coaches. He is very well thought of by other coaches as well. Everyone is entitled to his/her opinion about his coaching ability. I think Jon's point is valid and I think the idea of a statue waving at the hospital is fantastic. Go Hawks
"
MiniMoeHawk
Well-Known Member
You also didn’t get the glorified bye week vs Rutgers back then. Maryland hasn’t really been a powerhouse either. Nebraska was still relevant when they first joined the b1G
Ree4
Well-Known Member
Most of these same people likely can't locate the state of Iowa on a map, and if they try, probably point to the state in the NW between Montana and Washington.
judzeehawk
Well-Known Member
The look on Urban's face when he said Their throwing the ball on us! That says it all. Things don't just change over night. One step at a time. So hopefully we'll see a lot of steps next year.
ArvadaHawk
Well-Known Member
Serious question. I wonder why there are few that don't "dislike" hayden fry? is that generational? because i've seen almost every game under both fry and kirk. if i was going to choose a coach to change the mindset of a program from complete losers who didn't have a winning season in almost 20 seasons, I'd pick fry over kirk. if i wanted a coach to continue the already built winning program, i'd probably take kirk. but kirk has under performed from a W/L perspective and Fry didn't.
ArvadaHawk
Well-Known Member
Hayden Fry took Idaho City, Ohio off the map. I can guarantee you that.
hawkeyebob62
Well-Known Member
In one sense, it's apples to oranges. Basically, B1G hasn't had non-P5 bowl opponents since Kirk has been coach (only at the very "loser" bowls, which Kirk hasn't played--until this year). Hayden got three non-P5 teams (all WAC), San Diego State, Wyoming and BYU. At that time, only BYU was "consistently" good, but going out West to play is never easy for most B1G teams.
BigD
Well-Known Member
As a coach sometimes I love KF and other times I want to strangle him. As a human being I like the things he and his family does. Class act most of the time as a coach and human being. In the grand scheme of things it’s the way we conduct our lives in all aspects of our lives that’s important. Winning or losing doesn’t make someone a good or bad person. It can sometimes however affect the way you are perceived as being a successful coach or unsuccessful coach by those who follow the sport.
Over-all I would give Kirk a successful rating. I would like to see him pick up in recruiting a little better and maybe the next two or three years will show that he has. The next three years could be pretty fun to watch (fingers crossed).
It was a well written article and I enjoyed reading it. It puts Kirk in a very nice light. I will say this however, just a few years ago you were pretty hard on KF and would have fitted in with some of the more negative posters on here. You were humble enough to admit it so I am not going to dwell on that. You have to remember though that not everyone has made that leap and it may take time for others to do that. I am at a love hate position right now. Winning the bowl game helped some for me.
I happen to agree with you that given the spirit of your article this was not the time to be pissing all over an article that celebrates KF’s achievements. As Hawkeye fans we all should be proud to be apart of the things our coach has represented and what successes he has had.
