Josh 3 point Oh...
- Thread starter ForeverHawk
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22hawkeyes
Well-Known Member
Splitting hairs. But yes, I think you are right
tm3308
Well-Known Member
I consistently defended JO, as well as Fran's decision to keep giving him significant minutes through all of last season.
A guy who misses shots when they really matter, but nails them with ease when the pressure's off and consistently shoots the lights out in practice, is probably a guy who's got a problem between the ears. Clearly, he's gotten past whatever was holding him back.
The kid looks way more comfortable taking big shots than he did in his first two seasons, which is great news for everyone except the rest of the B1G, because we're seeing the guy Fran saw all along.
hawkeyebob62
Well-Known Member
Look at his shooting form now vs. last year.
This year he is consistent on his jump, release, follow-through, etc. Last year he had some "hitch" on his jump, and his feet were "off". Not seeing that this year. Consequently, he is shooting over 60%.
HawkfaninWA
Well-Known Member
Yes. Of course, this can be said when ANY of our guys get hot. Just like Marble getting it going gets more open looks for White, etc., etc., etc.
wundergrape
Well-Known Member
gohawkz
Well-Known Member
Last year I thought he was a liability. Although I believed Fran when he said how good of shooter he was, for whatever mental reason he wasn't doing it consistently during the games. Seemed like many times he would come in and chuck up bricks and we'd have wasted possessions. I really didn't want to ever see him play again, glad I was wrong! If he keeps playing this well we'll be a hell of a team, and if he was playing at the beginning of the year I'm not sure we would have a loss.
ssckelley
Well-Known Member
There were a couple of games where I felt the same way, but he was generally an asset defensively (although there are a few matchups he struggles with). But now that Oglesby has gotten off to this hot start he forces opposing coaches to account for him in their game plan, which can open up other opportunities. This Iowa team has so many ways they can beat you that they have to be a nightmare to create a defensive game plan against. I am sure Beilein is reviewing the Minnesota game and telling his team they have to find Oglesby when he comes into the game, I doubt last season coaches worried about Oglesby to much.
DP5555
Well-Known Member
I was stoked to see Oglesby light it up yesterday. No one is more deserving considering the criticism he has taken (from myself as well). I love Fran as much as the next Hawk fan, but in a lot of ways I think the criticism Oglesby was subjected to was because of the amount of hype Fran put on him with all of his comments to the media about him being the best pure shooter he's ever seen. You hear comments like that from a head coach then you expect to see results from the player. That's pretty lofty expectations to live up to.
I'm really happy that he finally seems like he's settling down on the court. The announcers kept making comments about his body language, and I couldn't agree more. Once he hit those first couple of shots he looked like a monkey fell right off his back. He was launching everything in an effortless and confident manner. Exactly what you want to see from a sniper.
I'm really happy that he finally seems like he's settling down on the court. The announcers kept making comments about his body language, and I couldn't agree more. Once he hit those first couple of shots he looked like a monkey fell right off his back. He was launching everything in an effortless and confident manner. Exactly what you want to see from a sniper.
sodakhawkeye
Well-Known Member
I will gladly eat crow with him. I am very excited for Josh for his play. I have always felt he was a great teammate by how excited the team gets when Josh does something well. Seems to me the big monkey off his back is gone.
In the past, I have continually yelled "shoot that" at him countless times during the game. that has not been the case the past 2 games. Continue to let it fly JO
In the past, I have continually yelled "shoot that" at him countless times during the game. that has not been the case the past 2 games. Continue to let it fly JO
deanvogs
Well-Known Member
Ok Tm, I don't want to seem like I'm bashing on you, but this whole line of reasoning has always driven me nuts. You know I love ya, but I'm gonna take you to task on this.
So what is a big shot and what isn't? I mean now you are saying that hitting (4) 3's yesterday in a 20 point blowout are shots when the matter? Deceiving isn't it if you only look at a box score. It is such a subjective thing, and completely misleading. Why aren't shots when you are down 15 trying to make a comeback big shots as well? Just because you don't ultimately make the comeback isn't a reflection of just Ogs. And if we lost that game yesterday by 15 it doesn't change that Josh made those buckets. I have never seen you or anyone else debate another players shooting % "when it matters". The fact is you either hit the shot when you take it or you don't.
tm3308
Well-Known Member
It's really pretty simple. In the Indiana game, he hit three of his shots after Iowa was down by 24 with 6:25 to play. The game was already decided at that point. He also had a couple more in the second half when Indiana held a 15-20 point lead, but it was early enough that you could argue the game wasn't decided (but a comeback against that IU team on their floor was unlikely). He hit 5 threes against MSU as a freshman, but four of them came after Iowa was down by 26 with 5:34 to play. Against Clemson, all three of his made 3-pointers came after Iowa was down by 22 with 9:58 to play. Against Creighton, all three of his made 3-pointers came after Iowa was down by 30 at the 10:26 mark.
Statistically speaking, those four games made up 21 of his 45 made 3-pointers, and most of them were hit in garbage time. The "he doesn't hit big shots" narrative didn't come from nothing. Of his strong statistical nights as a freshman, the only game where he didn't seriously pad his numbers in garbage time was the Northern Illinois game (hit three treys in the first half). Then last year, he didn't hit much of anything at any point of the game.
Yesterday, all of his 5 threes came in big spots. He didn't keep raining threes after Iowa took a commanding lead; he rained them when we were down by 9 and up by 6. He kept hammering home dagger after dagger, which isn't something he did in his first two years.
It can be tough to draw a definitive line between what counts as a shot that matters, but in the case of his best freshman performances and his last two performances, the difference is pretty clear. Kind of like when you debate on how far over the speed limit is acceptable. That's sometimes tough to figure out, but you know that 30 over is probably a bad idea.
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ForeverHawk
Well-Known Member
It might just be me, but I think every three pointer made in a college basketball game is a shot that matters regardless of the score. If some didn't matter than anyone could do it, but I bet about 99.9% of us on this board never made a shot that mattered in D1 college basketball?
tm3308
Well-Known Member
He's always had the physical ability to shoot the lights out. But if what you say is true, then there's no such thing as being affected by pressure. Which is complete BS.
deanvogs
Well-Known Member
I'm not sure this is worth wasting time debating. You feel that taking away his best shooting performances make sense, cause it came in at meaningless time. I'm sure you do the same for Naz long, and his 8-11 performance in a "meaningless" game. I will be looking forward to future altered stats to reflect only "games that matter".
tm3308
Well-Known Member
If a guy racks up most of his success in situations where it doesn't really matter, then he's not bringing a lot of value. Guy hits a grand slam when his team is already up 10 runs in the top of the ninth inning. That doesn't do the team anywhere near as much good as hitting a grand slam in the bottom of the ninth when his team is down by 3 runs.
Hitting a slew of threes, even when they have little impact on the game, tells me that a guy is physically capable of shooting well. Hitting those shots when they DO have an impact on the game tells me that he's a weapon. Oglesby is absolutely looking the part of a weapon, and he's doing that for the first time in his career.
A lot of shooting is confidence and JOg has itmand when he does, Iowa has yet another offensive weapon.
But it also changes the rotations, Dev at point and JOg @ shooting guard w/ Utoff at shooting forwad.....which reduces Clemons/Jok time and fills it with another tremdous offensive and defensive efficiency guy....
But it also changes the rotations, Dev at point and JOg @ shooting guard w/ Utoff at shooting forwad.....which reduces Clemons/Jok time and fills it with another tremdous offensive and defensive efficiency guy....
OUTofTOWNHAWK
Well-Known Member
Well it doesnt matter unless you can tell me how much of every players stats actually had impact.
Also let me know the next time you hear somebody say "He has five grand slams but only 2 of them really should count because the score was close at the time"
Also let me know the next time you hear somebody say "He has five grand slams but only 2 of them really should count because the score was close at the time"
