Is a Division Title the Rough Equivalent of a Shared Big Ten Title in the Old Days Before Divisions?

[ChosenChildren]

In 1981, Iowa tied for the Big Ten Title (10 team league) but did not play the other co-champ, Ohio State.
In 1990, Iowa tied for the Big Ten Title with 3 other teams (10 team league).
In 2002, Iowa tied for the Big Ten Title (10 team league), but did not play the other co-champ, Ohio State.
In 2004, Iowa tied for the Big Ten Title (10 team league), but lost to the other co-champ, Michigan.

I believe an outright Division Title is roughly equivalent to a shared Big Ten title prior to Division play.

Rationale:

1. A 7 team league where you play everyone in your division is roughly equivalent to a 10 team league in the old days when you did not play everyone (in the 50s and early 60s, only 6 conference games were played).
2. Prior to division play, they awarded co-championships in the Big Ten; now they do not (only outright championships are awarded).

Since division play began in 2011, Iowa has captured 2 Division Titles in 11 years. They should be celebrated as a significant achievement.

 

[HuckFinn]

Really good post. Thanks.

 

[okeefe4prez]

In 1981, Iowa tied for the Big Ten Title (10 team league) but did not play the other co-champ, Ohio State.
In 1990, Iowa tied for the Big Ten Title with 3 other teams (10 team league).
In 2002, Iowa tied for the Big Ten Title (10 team league), but did not play the other co-champ, Ohio State.
In 2004, Iowa tied for the Big Ten Title (10 team league), but lost to the other co-champ, Michigan.

I believe an outright Division Title is roughly equivalent to a shared Big Ten title prior to Division play.

Rationale:

1. A 7 team league where you play everyone in your division is roughly equivalent to a 10 team league in the old days when you did not play everyone (in the 50s and early 60s, only 6 conference games were played).
2. Prior to division play, they awarded co-championships in the Big Ten; now they do not (only outright championships are awarded).

Since division play began in 2011, Iowa has captured 2 Division Titles in 11 years. They should be celebrated as a significant achievement.

No. Not even close. The Big Ten West is devoid of a powerhouse program and Iowa went 4-2 against it, plus we avoided the two traditional powers of the conference, until of course we lost by 39 points to one of them. To think this is anywhere near the ballpark of sharing a conference title is absurd.

 

[NorthKCHawk]

I am not saying a division title is nothing. It is a great accomplishment. But, its not the same as a shared conference title. Its just not.

 

[BlackNGold1982]

I reflected on the ass whipping Iowa took to Michigan. And then it occurred to me: Iowa is never going to win a B1G Title. They will usually be competitive with most B1G programs, win the majority of their games, put a ton of plays in the NFL, and when a faux West division title every 5 years or so. I That all being said, they do not portray an offense that will invite better offensive players to want to come to Iowa and Brian is doing the program no favors. 10-3 seasons are highly commendable but they don’t consistently move the needle to legitimately contend with OSU or UM for a B1G title in the eyes of recruits. Nwankpa is a fantastic addition but let’s be real - the defense isn’t the problem. I have no idea how they can land Kyler Kasper with an offensive coordinator that should be coordinating at Regina. The schemes suck and are predictable. Say want you want about Tracy, but it’s an indictment of Brian for him to transfer due to misutilization. Hayden’s offensive schemes looked more creative yet here we are in 2021. It just is what it is.

 

[Fryowa]

What you’re suggesting is trying to polish a turd.

The rules are written to prevent ties within a division and to establish a B1G champ with a showdown game which we lost by like 97 points.

There is absolutely, positively, 100% no goddamn way that we’re even close to being B1G champs. We would get beat by 115 by Alabama.

That’s not a knock on Iowa, it’s just a statement about the recruiting advantage that the 6-8 blue bloods have over a team like Iowa.

 

[okeefe4prez]

What you’re suggesting is trying to polish a turd.

The rules are written to prevent ties within a division and to establish a B1G champ with a showdown game which we lost by like 97 points.

There is absolutely, positively, 100% no fucking way that we’re even close to being B1G champs. We would get beat by 115 by Alabama.

That’s not a knock on Iowa, it’s just a statement about the recruiting advantage that the 6-8 blue bloods have over a team like Iowa.

We only lost by 39, shitlord. I feel bad. I need to atone. I always pick Iowa to get shit trucked in games like that. But for some reason, I don't know what it was, I just thought that maybe, just maybe, fate would be on our side just this one time. We backed in, Michigan was coming off a big game, set up for a let down. But no. Oh no.

I was calling an Iowa blowout in this game when deep down inside I knew, I knew that I needed to call this a 69 point loss for Iowa rather than a 69 point win.

I've been meaning to get that off my chest for close to a week, guys. I'm sorry.

 

[Fryowa]

In 1981, Iowa tied for the Big Ten Title (10 team league) but did not play the other co-champ, Ohio State.
In 1990, Iowa tied for the Big Ten Title with 3 other teams (10 team league).
In 2002, Iowa tied for the Big Ten Title (10 team league), but did not play the other co-champ, Ohio State.
In 2004, Iowa tied for the Big Ten Title (10 team league), but lost to the other co-champ, Michigan.

I believe an outright Division Title is roughly equivalent to a shared Big Ten title prior to Division play.

Rationale:

1. A 7 team league where you play everyone in your division is roughly equivalent to a 10 team league in the old days when you did not play everyone (in the 50s and early 60s, only 6 conference games were played).
2. Prior to division play, they awarded co-championships in the Big Ten; now they do not (only outright championships are awarded).

Since division play began in 2011, Iowa has captured 2 Division Titles in 11 years. They should be celebrated as a significant achievement.

You ever heard the expression, “When the rubber meets the road?”

Basically “When the rubber meets the road” describes a situation where all extraneous bullshit, conjecture, and hypotheticals have been eliminated and something has been decided with no grey area, and no question about the validity of an outcome has been left…

Well pardner, the rubber met the proverbial road in Indy last week and we showed where we are as a program against a legit blue blood. And that’s ok. We don’t recruit 5 and 4 star players on the regular. Michigan has those players in spades.

‘Tis what it is, mi amigo.

But in no uncertain terms are we in the same zip code, area code, or hemisphere as a team like Michigan, OSU, or even Cincinnati or Alabama. We are what we are, and we perform very well up to our potential. Anyone suggesting otherwise is either an idiot who doesn’t understand college football, or has pop bottle homer goggles on.

As an Iowa fan you either have to learn to deal with it, or jump ship to a legit team. Other wise you’ll wind up in a ridiculous, pissed off fantasy land like @Motigerhawk and @hawkinn3 where you get furious every week thinking the Hawk players and coaches are underperforming pieces of shit when in reality they are playing to the absolute peak of their ability. Don’t be that guy…

 

[Fryowa]

We only lost by 39, shitlord. I feel bad. I need to atone. I always pick Iowa to get shit trucked in games like that. But for some reason, I don't know what it was, I just thought that maybe, just maybe, fate would be on our side just this one time. We backed in, Michigan was coming off a big game, set up for a let down. But no. Oh no.

I was calling an Iowa blowout in this game when deep down inside I knew, I knew that I needed to call this a 69 point loss for Iowa rather than a 69 point win.

I've been meaning to get that off my chest for close to a week, guys. I'm sorry.

See above

 

[uihawk82]

In 1981, Iowa tied for the Big Ten Title (10 team league) but did not play the other co-champ, Ohio State.
In 1990, Iowa tied for the Big Ten Title with 3 other teams (10 team league).
In 2002, Iowa tied for the Big Ten Title (10 team league), but did not play the other co-champ, Ohio State.
In 2004, Iowa tied for the Big Ten Title (10 team league), but lost to the other co-champ, Michigan.

I believe an outright Division Title is roughly equivalent to a shared Big Ten title prior to Division play.

Rationale:

1. A 7 team league where you play everyone in your division is roughly equivalent to a 10 team league in the old days when you did not play everyone (in the 50s and early 60s, only 6 conference games were played).
2. Prior to division play, they awarded co-championships in the Big Ten; now they do not (only outright championships are awarded).

Since division play began in 2011, Iowa has captured 2 Division Titles in 11 years. They should be celebrated as a significant achievement.

I follow on what others have said, No not usually and most times. Both Mich and OSU only had one loss. Iowa had two losses so in the old days Iowa would be in a tie with MSU for 2nd place.

In a year where OSU say in 9-0 and the West Div winner is 7-2 again it is not close.

Now if the lone Div champs are both 9-0 or 8-1 you could say they tied for the regular season title, like in the old days, but they play a Champ Game to see who goes to the best bowl (which is about the only reason to play another game).

 

[uihawk82]

In 1981, Iowa tied for the Big Ten Title (10 team league) but did not play the other co-champ, Ohio State.
In 1990, Iowa tied for the Big Ten Title with 3 other teams (10 team league).
In 2002, Iowa tied for the Big Ten Title (10 team league), but did not play the other co-champ, Ohio State.
In 2004, Iowa tied for the Big Ten Title (10 team league), but lost to the other co-champ, Michigan.

I believe an outright Division Title is roughly equivalent to a shared Big Ten title prior to Division play.

Rationale:

1. A 7 team league where you play everyone in your division is roughly equivalent to a 10 team league in the old days when you did not play everyone (in the 50s and early 60s, only 6 conference games were played).
2. Prior to division play, they awarded co-championships in the Big Ten; now they do not (only outright championships are awarded).

Since division play began in 2011, Iowa has captured 2 Division Titles in 11 years. They should be celebrated as a significant achievement.

Hey ChosenChildren, did you remember the really crazy thing about the the 1981 schedule where some teams played 9 league games and both OSU and Iowa only played 8 games. In that case a 7-2 Mich I think would have won the right to the Rose Bowl iirc because of their winning percentage even though Iowa beat Mich and had not been to the Rose Bowl in forever. That was the immense reason the hawks needed Mich to lose on that final weekend against OSU. The hawks would get the Rose Bowl with a tie in the loss column with OSU but not so sure about a tie with 2 losses with Mich.

 

[ssckelley]

They are West division champs and they got a nice trophy to add to their collection. Football is a tough sport to play, the sacrifices those kids make to entertain us is significant. So let’s celebrate their accomplishments instead of downgrading them. There are 6 other teams in Iowa’s division that would have loved to have taken that trophy home.

Yeah Iowa got the shit kicked out of them in the BTC and I love being reminded of the final score. But anyone that watched the game knows it was competitive until the 4th quarter.

 

[okeefe4prez]

I love being reminded of the final score.

42-3

 

[guffus]

Numbers wise winning a division means you were the best one of 7 teams.

An old big ten co-championship like 2002 and 2004 means you were in the top 2 out of 11 teams, or lets round that off to 1 out of 6.

Numbers wise it is roughly the same.

 

[Fryowa]

Numbers wise winning a division means you were the best one of 7 teams.

An old big ten co-championship like 2002 and 2004 means you were in the top 2 out of 11 teams, or lets round that off to 1 out of 6.

Numbers wise it is roughly the same.

Mental gymnastics.

Plus, even if someone bought into that, the three teams added since the expansion are the worst 3 teams in the conference by far.

 

[uihawk82]

But anyone that watched the game knows it was competitive until the 4th quarter.

This ^^^ is what a lot of hawk fans and others miss or forget. At halftime the hawks had given up 2 big plays but had really held Mich offense down the rest of the time on a yards per play basis. etc. At halftime is was 14-3 with an unfortunate rare miss for Shudak. Wow a 14-6 score and being behind by one score would have felt better to the players.

The hawks moved the ball on offense fairly well through 3 qtrs with 3 redzone drives, but just not finishing with TDs is a tough one. And the worst part was in the 2nd qtr with the defense making 2 or 3 stops and giving the offense the ball around midfield multiple times but then the playcalling was so bland that nothing happened. Take a shot, how about a flea flicker with max protection by TEnds who go out after a two count

 

[ssckelley]

This ^^^ is what a lot of hawk fans and others miss or forget. At halftime the hawks had given up 2 big plays but had really held Mich offense down the rest of the time on a yards per play basis. etc. At halftime is was 14-3 with an unfortunate rare miss for Shudak. Wow a 14-6 score and being behind by one score would have felt better to the players.

The hawks moved the ball on offense fairly well through 3 qtrs with 3 redzone drives, but just not finishing with TDs is a tough one. And the worst part was in the 2nd qtr with the defense making 2 or 3 stops and giving the offense the ball around midfield multiple times but then the playcalling was so bland that nothing happened.

Yep, and on that missed FG attempt was after a sure TD had been "tripped up". I also thought they should have kicked the FG when they had 4th down from the 5, instead they went for it. It was still the 3rd quarter and it would have made it a 2 possession game cutting it to 21-6.

The 4th quarter was a landslide, Michigan wanted style points at the 42 number for the tragedy, I had no problems with it. But Michigan wasn't THAT much better than Iowa.

 

[uihawk82]

Yep, and on that missed FG attempt was after a sure TD had been "tripped up". I also thought they should have kicked the FG when they had 4th down from the 5, instead they went for it. It was still the 3rd quarter and it would have made it a 2 possession game cutting it to 21-6.

The 4th quarter was a landslide, Michigan wanted style points at the 42 number for the tragedy, I had no problems with it. But Michigan wasn't THAT much better than Iowa.

I posted in the game thread at the time exactly what you said when it was 21-3 and the hawks went for it on 4th down at the Mich 5 yard line. Take a 99% positive chance at a FG to get within 2 scores (as you never know what can happen). My logic was that getting a TD at that time would still leave you two scores behind at 21-10. I know getting a TD there would have been a big boost but it turned out to be the last gasp.

 

[kicker22]

Yep, and on that missed FG attempt was after a sure TD had been "tripped up". I also thought they should have kicked the FG when they had 4th down from the 5, instead they went for it. It was still the 3rd quarter and it would have made it a 2 possession game cutting it to 21-6.

The 4th quarter was a landslide, Michigan wanted style points at the 42 number for the tragedy, I had no problems with it. But Michigan wasn't THAT much better than Iowa.

Michigan's offense put up 42 on our defense. The same defense that was the strength of our team. Watching that game I thought about so many of our games earlier in the year where we had a one or two score lead in the second half and even though the score was close I felt like it was over regardless. That's exactly how I felt watching Michigan do what we did to other teams.

Was it a 2 possession game at the half? Yep. Was it a 3 possession game after the 3rd quarter? Sure. Did I ever see our offense digging us out in the 3rd? Absolutely not. I saw 3 quarters of us collectively trying to get out of a hole and our defense trying to keep us in the game. In the 4th quarter I saw that defense run out of steam and absolutely get torched, style points or not. You see it as Michigan not being that much better than us, but I see it entirely differently. Not saying your wrong and I'm right or vice versa, just acknowledging two totally different perspectives.

 

[ssckelley]

Michigan's offense put up 42 on our defense. The same defense that was the strength of our team. Watching that game I thought about so many of our games earlier in the year where we had a one or two score lead in the second half and even though the score was close I felt like it was over regardless. That's exactly how I felt watching Michigan do what we did to other teams.

Was it a 2 possession game at the half? Yep. Was it a 3 possession game after the 3rd quarter? Sure. Did I ever see our offense digging us out in the 3rd? Absolutely not. I saw 3 quarters of us collectively trying to get out of a hole and our defense trying to keep us in the game. In the 4th quarter I saw that defense run out of steam and absolutely get torched, style points or not. You see it as Michigan not being that much better than us, but I see it entirely differently. Not saying your wrong and I'm right or vice versa, just acknowledging two totally different perspectives.

Had Iowa scored a touchdown on that "trip" the game could have completely changed. Not saying Iowa would have won but momentum does have an impact. If you really think that Michigan is that much better than Iowa then whatever.

I knew the offense wasn't going to dig us out in the 2nd half, when has it all year? When you look at the games Iowa did come back from it was typically a huge play either on defense or special teams that sparked the come back and that didn't happen.