Iowa offers Pat Ingram

PalmettoHawkFan said:
a six two shooting guard who plays below the rim

pardon me if I'm not enthused
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We actually have offered quite a few quality SG's for 2012. Staff must not have a ton a faith in them coming. Looks like they are starting to offer some fallback guys. Early signing period is less than 4 months away.
 
I will never understand recruiting and don't know how coaches have the patience for it. It seems that regardless of what we do (new coach, style, practice facility, etc.,) kids don't want to come here. Other programs change coaches, get placed on probation, etc., and they still land kids. I thought Pearl getting canned would hurt TN's recruiting, but Martin comes in and keeps all the Pearl recruits and lands a couple others that were on the fence.

You would think our coaching staff would win a kid or two over here and there based on their personalities, but we must be perceived as spam and other programs as steak.
 
hawkIhoops said:
I will never understand recruiting and don't know how coaches have the patience for it. It seems that regardless of what we do (new coach, style, practice facility, etc.,) kids don't want to come here. Other programs change coaches, get placed on probation, etc., and they still land kids. I thought Pearl getting canned would hurt TN's recruiting, but Martin comes in and keeps all the Pearl recruits and lands a couple others that were on the fence.

You would think our coaching staff would win a kid or two over here and there based on their personalities, but we must be perceived as spam and other programs as steak.
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First of all, Martin didn't keep all of Pearl's recruits. Secondly, Martin is recruiting players who are also getting recruited by mid-majors and we all know how that works out. He isn't going to last long in TN with that strategy. Clemson, who's coach was at Wright State previously, does the same thing. This may be why Iowa is getting into recruiting battles with them lately.
 
Good point Jay.

Unless Fran pulls a rabbit out of the hat in recruiting this year, I expect what will need to happen to turn the program around is for Barta to go out and pay to bring in a big name. There is no way you can spend the type of cash Iowa has spent on the practice facility and not end up getting results.

Obviously Iowa isn't going to get a top guy from a top institution, but they might be able to have a guy like Huggins fall into their lap like what happened at KSTATE. Or perhaps they can find a guy who retired and is interested in one more go around. You really only need to keep a guy like that around for a couple to a few years as long as you make sure you have the heir apparent ready.

Of course, BY FAR the best option would be for Fran to hit the bullseye with recruiting this year.

My only hope is that, with six open scholarships, Fran doesn't panic and stick the program with guys that are going to doom the program to mediocrity or worse for the foreseeable future.

It is interesting to think about Lick's second class with Brommer, Davis, Bawinkle, Gatens, and Tucker. That is five scholarships with really only one guy who has contributed at a marginal B1G starting level. Can't have the 2012 class end up the same way.
 
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CAARHawk said:
Good point Jay.

Unless Fran pulls a rabbit out of the hat in recruiting this year, I expect what will need to happen to turn the program around is for Barta to go out and pay to bring in a big name. There is no way you can spend the type of cash Iowa has spent on the practice facility and not end up getting results.

Obviously Iowa isn't going to get a top guy from a top institution, but they might be able to have a guy like Huggins fall into their lap like what happened at KSTATE. Or perhaps they can find a guy who retired and is interested in one more go around. You really only need to keep a guy like that around for a couple to a few years as long as you make sure you have the heir apparent ready.

Of course, BY FAR the best option would be for Fran to hit the bullseye with recruiting this year.

My only hope is that, with six open scholarships, Fran doesn't panic and stick the program with guys that are going to doom the program to mediocrity or worse for the foreseeable future.

It is interesting to think about Lick's second class with Brommer, Davis, Bawinkle, Gatens, and Tucker. That is five scholarships with really only one guy who has contributed at a marginal B1G starting level. Can't have the 2012 class end up the same way.
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I was not worried about Fran's ability to recruit with the initial hire and the staff he put together. However, especially with Hubbard gone I am very worried again. I was thinking he would be able to go back east and bring some athletes with him. Yes, he got Basabe, but I was envisioning some of those long wings who can get up and down with ease.

Like it or not, this is a make or break class for Fran since people have been making excuses for him as it was all supposedly leading up to the '12 class. A whiff with this many open scholarships means serious trouble. This team is still in need of a serious talent infusion to reach the NCAA Tournament, especially when you think that their are no returning PG's next season.
 
I am not saying that by themselves any of these moves would radically change our situation, but they wouldn't hurt.

Washpun-In hindsight, not sure what the deal was here.
Glover-Hindsight is 20/20, but he is still at PSU and Hubbard is on Facebook
Peterson-Did we make an earnest run at him or did the Hubb love affair curb our interest?
Niang-The dude talks to Francis every week but signs with ISU?
Transfers-Lots of guys mentioned in the spring due to coaching changes and we apparently didn't pursue them. Again, Hubbard blinders?
JUCO's- We really can't come up with any viable juco players to plug holes?

McCaffrey really stepped in it with this Hubbard deal. I am less concerned that Hubbard is gone and more concerned about what this says about the staff's ability to recruit. As referenced by CaarHawk, we enter yet another campaign next season with no experience at PG, which is vital to a team winning games.
 
If Iowa fails to land a decent 2011 class, it might be time to considering opening up the checkbook for some better assistants. That's what Iowa is missing with this staff. We don't have a real dynamite recruiter like Fred inherited with T.J. We have hard working assistants but none that have that WOW factor when it comes to recruiting.
 
CAARHawk said:
Good point Jay.

Unless Fran pulls a rabbit out of the hat in recruiting this year, I expect what will need to happen to turn the program around is for Barta to go out and pay to bring in a big name. There is no way you can spend the type of cash Iowa has spent on the practice facility and not end up getting results.

Obviously Iowa isn't going to get a top guy from a top institution, but they might be able to have a guy like Huggins fall into their lap like what happened at KSTATE. Or perhaps they can find a guy who retired and is interested in one more go around. You really only need to keep a guy like that around for a couple to a few years as long as you make sure you have the heir apparent ready.

Of course, BY FAR the best option would be for Fran to hit the bullseye with recruiting this year.

My only hope is that, with six open scholarships, Fran doesn't panic and stick the program with guys that are going to doom the program to mediocrity or worse for the foreseeable future.

It is interesting to think about Lick's second class with Brommer, Davis, Bawinkle, Gatens, and Tucker. That is five scholarships with really only one guy who has contributed at a marginal B1G starting level. Can't have the 2012 class end up the same way.
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Fran could win zero Big Ten games this year and next and we aren't making another coaching change. CAARHawk, I appreciate your research on coaching turnarounds, but what your statistics miss is that the vast majority of those coaches are on a much shorter leash than McCaffery is. Unlike those coaches, he will get time, for the simple fact that no school wants to have five basketball coaches in 15 years. If you fire Fran at any point in the next three seasons here is what prospective coaching candidates will see: Successful coach with no NCAA problems fired, successful coach run out of town, coach fired before a full four-year recruiting cycle, coach fired before a full four-year recruiting cycle. Do you really think Bob Huggins, Rick Majerus, or any similar coaches are going to walk through that door? What kind of money would it take to get guys like that into such a horrible situation, and where is that money going to come from? How many big-name coaches were lined up up after Lick was fired, even though it was obviously the right decision from a basketball perspective? All those coaches could see was a bad program that didn't even give a coach an opportunity to go through a full recruiting cycle.

The NIT in year 2 and NCAA in year 3 talk was always irrelevant. Fran is going to be evaluated on years 4, 5, and 6. If he doesn't commit some sort of major NCAA violation or get in legal trouble, I fully expect to see him complete his contract regardless of on-court results (that is, unless he wants to leave).

As to your point about panic recruiting, it seems to me that Fran was avoiding panic by pulling offers on marginal guys like Glover and not going all-out after Washpun. Now he's getting savaged for it... I'd still rather take the shot for a potential program-changing guy rather than just bringing in warm bodies. This one was a miss, but if any coach who can hit 70% of those guys is going to be a success. We'll see how it develops. Maybe it will be this year, maybe the year after, maybe the class of 2014. But Fran will get multiple opportunities to bring in better players-- as he should.
 
burky247 said:
If Iowa fails to land a decent 2011 class, it might be time to considering opening up the checkbook for some better assistants. That's what Iowa is missing with this staff. We don't have a real dynamite recruiter like Fred inherited with T.J. We have hard working assistants but none that have that WOW factor when it comes to recruiting.
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T.J is certainly good, but Abdelmassih and Mann have landed some of our best recruits, and many recruits are saying that Fred himself has been recruiting them the hardest. Abdelmassih has been on a tear on the East Coast.
 
CyChamp said:
T.J is certainly good, but Abdelmassih and Mann have landed some of our best recruits, and many recruits are saying that Fred himself has been recruiting them the hardest. Abdelmassih has been on a tear on the East Coast.
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Understood, but you get the point right.
 
CyChamp said:
Yes, but I just don't think T.J is the primary recruiter anymore. I think he's being groomed for a HC job elsewhere down the road.
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I don't really give a flying **** about the Cyclones. I'm just saying that Fred was able to land(both by inheriting and by hiring) a better crop of assistants than Caff did and it's showing early on. Now, conversely, Iowa hired better developing assistants(in my opinion) so we will see which strategy works out better.
 
OC: I agree you are right about Fran getting more time. However, my point is that if it doesn't happen now in recruiting it won't happen for Fran in the future. So, in most likelihood it will mean five bad years.

Of course a possibility would be to hire an AAU or high school guy as an assistant (If he could bring in a program changing recruit) but there hasn't been precedent for that as a way to turn around recruiting.
 
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CyChamp said:
Coulda swore you brought them up in this thread. Just trying to correct some misinformation. Testy, testy.
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I brought up the ISU staff as a point of reference. The comparison of hiring "recruiting assistants" instead of "developing assistants". The point was there without you going into your entire staff's pubic hair records. Your post went away from the point of the thread which is why I called you out.
 
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