Fran & Defense

BGOLD said:
I missed the first 10 minutes of the game, and by then Purdue was already off to their big lead. Were they hitting contested shots during that run? Because from when I watched they were open looks, and most teams are going to knock them down. Pemsl was even out of position on a 3/4 trap and got beat on a baseball pass to Haass standing right under the hoop.
Lets not act like this is a Purdue thing. This is and Iowa thing. We've given up 90+ to UNO, Memphis, Seton Hall. That's a trend, regardless of whether Purdue just shot well last night.
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Did you miss the part of my post where I said the defense was pretty bad?
 
HawkGold said:
Rarely is it used as a true tool. Lute Olson was one who could teach it. A team that can play high end zone is likely also able to play man up effectively. Fran has never really had teams do that. Olson's teams could play man up quite effectively.

If Fran truly was an effective D coach, we wouldn't be discussing how bad the D is over the years.
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I'm not saying he is. I'm saying zone defense is very effective if emphasized and taught correctly. Not saying you, but it gets the perception that if you're zoning, you aren't quick enough which isn't true for everyone.

Iowa's issues are they're terrible fundamentally defensively and it doesn't matter what you're in. if you don't close out correctly, going under screens, getting hung up on screens, etc.....you're gonna struggle no matter what you're trying to do.

This team needs to get to the basics of good solid team defense and excel at them before even worrying about changing defenses. It's been a struggle since Mccaffrey has been at Iowa.
 
eveningnewsteam said:
I'm not saying he is. I'm saying zone defense is very effective if emphasized and taught correctly. Not saying you, but it gets the perception that if you're zoning, you aren't quick enough which isn't true for everyone.

Iowa's issues are they're terrible fundamentally defensively and it doesn't matter what you're in. if you don't close out correctly, going under screens, getting hung up on screens, etc.....you're gonna struggle no matter what you're trying to do.

This team needs to get to the basics of good solid team defense and excel at them before even worrying about changing defenses. It's been a struggle since Mccaffrey has been at Iowa.
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Totally agree about the defensive fundamentals. A few on here will vigorously disagree though. I do think when you have a point guard that is not defensively quick, it puts the whole D at a disadvantage. That would help, but the issues are on body position, feet movement and what to do with the hands. The Hawks also don't position well to take advantage away from the opponent. They seem oblivious to the strong hand of the opponent. I'm not sure how it happens, but then again this team is made up of a lot of players who didn't play quickness in high school.
 
Hillcrest1981 said:
Kernel needs to go on the Haas/Dolph Lundgren workout plan. "Whatever he hits, he destroys!"
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I choose number 5 and hope it happens. :)
Kernel
—noun
​
  1. the softer, usually edible part contained in the shell of a nut or the stone of a fruit.
  2. the body of a seed within its husk or integuments.
  3. a whole seed grain, as of wheat or corn.
  4. South Atlantic States. the pit or seed of a peach, cherry, plum, etc.
  5. the central or most important part of anything; essence; gist; core: His leadership is the kernel of the organization.
  6. Mathematics. the set of elements that a given function from one set to a second set maps into the identity of the second set.
  7. Also called rumpf. Physical Chemistry. the remainder of an atom after the valence electrons have been removed.
 
BGOLD said:
No. You mentioned that in between heaping praise on Purdue's shot makers. You'll be doing a lot of that if you're impressed by Big Ten players knocking down wide open shots.
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Purdue is a really good basketball team. One that I think will compete for the B10 title. I think they have a great shot at winning it. I wasn't surprised at all by what happened to this inexperienced Hawkeye team. They got steamrolled by a very good team, and didn't help themselves at all with their poor defensive performance.

Sorry I'm not gonna go out of my way to blast the Hawkeye players as much as you'd apparently like me to. Yes, they played bad defense, but Purdue is really good also. The answer is usually somewhere in between.
 
I would say, at Purdue, Iowa would beat them about 1 in 25 games. Purdue looked good...big guys were huge...NBA bodies. No shame in that beat down...Purdue is just much better and was highly motivated to bury Iowa early.
 
Our defense looked lost on D. Standing watching the ball move around them or guarding shadows and not rotating.
 
revkev73 said:
I would say, at Purdue, Iowa would beat them about 1 in 25 games. Purdue looked good...big guys were huge...NBA bodies. No shame in that beat down...Purdue is just much better and was highly motivated to bury Iowa early.
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I would say 1 in 10ish. They are nowhere near as good as they played that game. They probably played as good as they can play and we probably played slightly below average. In 10 games, normally one game would be them playing bad at the same time we played good.
 
Possible...but Iowa was never remotely in the game...and Purdue, like most teams with huge leads, and playing inferior teams, let up a bit as Iowa had a few runs to avoid a 40 point spread...IMHO...

At Iowa...I could see an upset happening...in a dream...
 
A lot of people act like this game will be the blueprint for every game the rest of the way. Seasons still young and this team is young. If Purdue plays that well all year, they will be final 4. These hawks have proven they can put up points, but having a young team there will be inconsistencies. I expect they forget about this one and move on.
 
HawkeyeHypnosis said:
A lot of people act like this game will be the blueprint for every game the rest of the way. Seasons still young and this team is young. If Purdue plays that well all year, they will be final 4. These hawks have proven they can put up points, but having a young team there will be inconsistencies. I expect they forget about this one and move on.
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Yep, you can't base an entire season on a blowout road loss to a ranked team. I think we'll see a few more of these this year, but it doesn't mean there won't be some good nights as well, or that the team won't improve.

Defense does seem to be an issue at times, though, with Fran's teams. The stats might show that some years the D has been OK, but last year's melt down, and 2 years before that - I could be mistaken, but I was thinking the defense really went MIA during those stretches, so the defense during the stretches was probably far worse than the "overall" season stats. Correct me if I'm wrong, but that's what I was thinking.
 
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Knight78 said:
This is absolutely true. All you have to do is look at Michigan St. Over the years, the 2-3 matchup has been their staple on defense, and it is very difficult to beat.
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Seems like Syracuse was always known for pretty stingy zone D, as well, if I'm thinking right.
 
HawkGold said:
I still think, that when you have players poking others in the eye, it a sign of improper positioning/body placement. Fran has never been good at teaching solid defense. Zone is what you do when you can't play man up. Defensive footwork has always been terrible.
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Who are the multiple players poking people in the eye during Fran's tenure? I remember Woody doing it a couple times in his 4 years at Iowa. I've seen Iowa play excellent defense in recent years under Fran. If anything, it's been another scorer that his teams have lacked.
 
CPHAWK82 said:
Who are the multiple players poking people in the eye during Fran's tenure? I remember Woody doing it a couple times in his 4 years at Iowa. I've seen Iowa play excellent defense in recent years under Fran. If anything, it's been another scorer that his teams have lacked.
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When you're 7 foot and have T-Rex arms - you're at perfect eye poke height - it's gonna happen.
 
CPHAWK82 said:
Who are the multiple players poking people in the eye during Fran's tenure? I remember Woody doing it a couple times in his 4 years at Iowa. I've seen Iowa play excellent defense in recent years under Fran. If anything, it's been another scorer that his teams have lacked.
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Agree about the scorer. Players can be used in that sentence but should have emphasized more that players dont have disciplined body control. Woody was the most noticeable due to size and lack of quick.
 
revkev73 said:
Possible...but Iowa was never remotely in the game...and Purdue, like most teams with huge leads, and playing inferior teams, let up a bit as Iowa had a few runs to avoid a 40 point spread...IMHO...

At Iowa...I could see an upset happening...in a dream...
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I agree. Purdue's just pretty good. To beat them their big guys would have to get in foul trouble really early and their shooters would all have to be terribly off. Two things I don't see happening. That's not to mention Iowa would have to play better offensively...
 
Hawkfnntn said:
I agree. Purdue's just pretty good. To beat them their big guys would have to get in foul trouble really early and their shooters would all have to be terribly off. Two things I don't see happening. That's not to mention Iowa would have to play better offensively...
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If there big guys got in foul trouble, their shooters were terribly off, AND we played better on offense,we would kill them. The final score would be about 80-40.
 
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