Doyel - Urban Meyer is a bad guy.

[Cyclones17]

Well, you're standing by something stupid then, but I guess it's your right to do so.

What is stupid about it? I have a laundry list of examples of players doing what Rainey did and still being a part of the program. For Doyle to call Urban Meyer a bad guy for this is idiotic. Meyer didn't do anything that Rhoads, Ferentz, Tressel, etc would do.

 

[tm3308]

What is stupid about it? I have a laundry list of examples of players doing what Rainey did and still being a part of the program. For Doyle to call Urban Meyer a bad guy for this is idiotic. Meyer didn't do anything that Rhoads, Ferentz, Tressel, etc would do.

You're right. Because they wouldn't bring back a player after a two game suspension, when the player was suspended for threatening to kill someone. And the "Time to die b*tch" message was not the only threatening message he sent her that night. When the cops were posted outside her place, he sent something along the lines of "Just wait 'til they leave...". If you're telling us that Ferentz or Rhoads would bring a player like that back after two games (just because the offensive firepower was lacking), then you haven't been paying attention. If Ferentz would do that, Douglass would have been brought back LONG before his incident at Wal-Mart.

 

[Cosity82]

Doyle isn't calling him a bad guy for this alone. I personally don't think it's that big of a deal that he is back playing, not a shocker by any means. He's using this as a catalyst to call him out on his track record as a whole. He mentions this, the absurd amoutn of arrests, his reaction to a reporter accurately quoting one of his players, etc. The guy is a ******, just because he talks about God and family values does not make him moral. Dont forget the teaching about the pharisees on street corners

 

[tm3308]

Doyle isn't calling him a bad guy for this alone. I personally don't think it's that big of a deal that he is back playing, not a shocker by any means. He's using this as a catalyst to call him out on his track record as a whole. He mentions this, the absurd amoutn of arrests, his reaction to a reporter accurately quoting one of his players, etc. The guy is a ******, just because he talks about God and family values does not make him moral. Dont forget the teaching about the pharisees on street corners

I do think that Rainey shouldn't be playing, though I'm not at all surprised that he is. But agreed, the writer was calling out Meyer's track record, not just his stance on this issue. If Meyer were just open about it, rather than spewing the crap about core values and then going against those values at every turn, then I wouldn't have as big of a problem with him.

 

[hawkfan340]

What is stupid about it? I have a laundry list of examples of players doing what Rainey did and still being a part of the program. For Doyle to call Urban Meyer a bad guy for this is idiotic. Meyer didn't do anything that Rhoads, Ferentz, Tressel, etc would do.

It's stupid to think that every coach in America would accept the best player back on their team after he threatens to kill someone, just because he's the best player. I think that's a stupid and crazy statement and one in which there would be a lot of exceptions.

I personally don't think Ferentz would, and I'd bet my bottom dollar JoePa wouldn't.

 

[Cyclones17]

It's stupid to think that every coach in America would accept the best player back on their team after he threatens to kill someone, just because he's the best player. I think that's a stupid and crazy statement and one in which there would be a lot of exceptions.

I personally don't think Ferentz would, and I'd bet my bottom dollar JoePa wouldn't.

Have you seen the players that JoePa has let back into the program the last 5 years? Where have you been living?

 

[5Hawkeyes]

Have you seen the players that JoePa has let back into the program the last 5 years? Where have you been living?

17, you seem to be pretty sure of yourself and you may be right. But you keep saying you can give us a laundry list and have we seen the players Joe Pa has let back on, but I haven't seen who you are talking about. Could you please provide the list and what the player did so I can get an idea if what you're saying holds any water. Since you specifically mentioned Ferentz, Rhoads, and Tressel, maybe you could start with them. I'm really interested, not trying to be a$$.

I'd really like to believe that KF would not do this and I'm pretty sure his record speaks for its self. But I'd be interested in what other coaches have done.

 

[whammer33024]

17, you seem to be pretty sure of yourself and you may be right. But you keep saying you can give us a laundry list and have we seen the players Joe Pa has let back on, but I haven't seen who you are talking about. Could you please provide the list and what the player did so I can get an idea if what you're saying holds any water. Since you specifically mentioned Ferentz, Rhoads, and Tressel, maybe you could start with them. I'm really interested, not trying to be a$$.

I'd really like to believe that KF would not do this and I'm pretty sure his record speaks for its self. But I'd be interested in what other coaches have done.

i will be an *** and demand the list. prove it all knowing cyclone17

 

[Cyclones17]

You guys must have short memories. Do you not remember the heat that Paterno was under 2 years ago? He had over 20 some arrests in a years time and there was that awful beat down that some football players gave to some students in an apartment. There was a whole story on ESPN about it. He only kicked one of the 5 kids off the team and these kids damn near killed the students. Here is the story

Report: Players sought revenge - The Daily Collegian Online

 

[tm3308]

You guys must have short memories. Do you not remember the heat that Paterno was under 2 years ago? He had over 20 some arrests in a years time and there was that awful beat down that some football players gave to some students in an apartment. There was a whole story on ESPN about it. He only kicked one of the 5 kids off the team and these kids damn near killed the students. Here is the story

Report: Players sought revenge - The Daily Collegian Online

And you continue to keep the focus away from Ferentz, Rhoads, and Tressel, now that you've been called out. Let's see the laundry list of guys there. You can bring up the rape case, but remember that none of those players ever saw the field again.

Rainey maybe doesn't deserve being dismissed from the team for his actions, but a season-long suspension would have been pretty appropriate.

 

[Cyclones17]

And you continue to keep the focus away from Ferentz, Rhoads, and Tressel, now that you've been called out. Let's see the laundry list of guys there. You can bring up the rape case, but remember that none of those players ever saw the field again.

Rainey maybe doesn't deserve being dismissed from the team for his actions, but a season-long suspension would have been pretty appropriate.

Read again buddy. I haven't brought up the rape case once. Not once. I got called out by the poster and he quoted my post about Paterno. So I answered with how Paterno has brought back his best players after they have done some bad stuff.

 

[tm3308]

Read again buddy. I haven't brought up the rape case once. Not once. I got called out by the poster and he quoted my post about Paterno. So I answered with how Paterno has brought back his best players after they have done some bad stuff.

I never said you brought up the rape case. But you said that Meyer didn't do anything that Ferentz, Rhoads, or Tressel wouldn't do. You've offered no evidence to support that claim.

 

[kuhntz]

Read again buddy. I haven't brought up the rape case once. Not once. I got called out by the poster and he quoted my post about Paterno. So I answered with how Paterno has brought back his best players after they have done some bad stuff.

Maybe you should read again. He said you can bring it up...not that you did. Fact of the matter is you're making general statements you can not back up with evidence. Why did I waste my time reading this thread.................

 

[bamahawkeye]

Very interesting topic.
I don't post much. I read threads quite often, but rarely does one push my buttons enough to post. But this one has me thinking.
I used to be a guy that didn't care what it took. I wanted a 'w' on Saturday. I wanted the best program in the nation. I wanted the perfect offense and defense every week.
Don't get me wrong, I still love watching Iowa highlights after a win, and I hate reading or watching anything after a loss. But I've changed my thinking quite a bit over the last 2 and a half years.
The character KF has and the leadership he provides is more important to me than anything else now. The way he reacts to wins. Remember the Illinois win in '07 and his interview on the field. Or the MSU and PSU wins last year. You can see the emotion. He loves his players. The 'love' and 'family' Urban Meyer talks about is really what you see when KF talks about his team and the university. I truly believe the development of his players as men and football players is more important to him and winning and losing. Now, with that being said, I believe KF wants to win. I think you can tell how special he thought this season was going to be by how hard he took the Arizona loss. But he has shown the University of Iowa exactly who he is and what he stands for. He values who he is and what he represents. That will buy him a few losses every year.
Will a 6-6 season, followed by a 7-5 and 7-6 season not have consequences? Absolutely it will. Winning is important. There is no doubt about that. But what KF teaches from hard work, to responsibility to leadership will build a foundation where winning follows. I think you are seeing the rewards from that foundation right now. KF and this staff have learned from the mistakes they made from '05 to '07. Will there be bumps in the road? Sure. It will be very difficult to stand on 10, 11 and 12 win mountains every year. Very difficult.
But I for one will take 9-4, 11-2, 10-3 and a 7-5 every four years if the man at the top is as special as KF. Florida can have 2 national titles in 3 years if this is what you have to go through after that.
You won't have a flawless 'off the field' squad. We all know what goes on in college and sometimes you are in the wrong place at the wrong time. You make mistakes. But as someone said, what kind of 'people' are those who are making mistakes. Do they give you anything which would lead you to believe there is hope. That the mistake wasn't who they are.
I don't know Chris Rainey. I don't know Meyer. I don't know KF.
I know what I've seen, read and heard about all of them.
Chris Rainey threatened someone's life. That is what we know about him. That's not a behavior issue, that is a character issue.
I believe KF practices what he preaches. Someone with that kind of character would not be playing this year (if ever) for KF. Obviously the same can't be said for Meyer.
To me, winning is about more than a W and L column. And I think I've learned that from KF.

 

[TChawk]

Have you seen the players that JoePa has let back into the program the last 5 years? Where have you been living?

Ok i will bite, who was the last guy JoPa let back on the team after THREATENING TO KILL somebody...my guess is zero which makes your point stupid again.

 

[VintageHawkeye]

What is stupid about it? I have a laundry list of examples of players doing what Rainey did and still being a part of the program. For Doyle to call Urban Meyer a bad guy for this is idiotic. Meyer didn't do anything that Rhoads, Ferentz, Tressel, etc would do.

The only things that Meyer, Ferentz, and Tressel do alike is win consistently.

Rhoads doesn't fit in that group. 35-7.

 

[ChosenChildren]

Very interesting topic.
I don't post much. I read threads quite often, but rarely does one push my buttons enough to post. But this one has me thinking.
I used to be a guy that didn't care what it took. I wanted a 'w' on Saturday. I wanted the best program in the nation. I wanted the perfect offense and defense every week.
Don't get me wrong, I still love watching Iowa highlights after a win, and I hate reading or watching anything after a loss. But I've changed my thinking quite a bit over the last 2 and a half years.
The character KF has and the leadership he provides is more important to me than anything else now. The way he reacts to wins. Remember the Illinois win in '07 and his interview on the field. Or the MSU and PSU wins last year. You can see the emotion. He loves his players. The 'love' and 'family' Urban Meyer talks about is really what you see when KF talks about his team and the university. I truly believe the development of his players as men and football players is more important to him and winning and losing. Now, with that being said, I believe KF wants to win. I think you can tell how special he thought this season was going to be by how hard he took the Arizona loss. But he has shown the University of Iowa exactly who he is and what he stands for. He values who he is and what he represents. That will buy him a few losses every year.
Will a 6-6 season, followed by a 7-5 and 7-6 season not have consequences? Absolutely it will. Winning is important. There is no doubt about that. But what KF teaches from hard work, to responsibility to leadership will build a foundation where winning follows. I think you are seeing the rewards from that foundation right now. KF and this staff have learned from the mistakes they made from '05 to '07. Will there be bumps in the road? Sure. It will be very difficult to stand on 10, 11 and 12 win mountains every year. Very difficult.
But I for one will take 9-4, 11-2, 10-3 and a 7-5 every four years if the man at the top is as special as KF. Florida can have 2 national titles in 3 years if this is what you have to go through after that.
You won't have a flawless 'off the field' squad. We all know what goes on in college and sometimes you are in the wrong place at the wrong time. You make mistakes. But as someone said, what kind of 'people' are those who are making mistakes. Do they give you anything which would lead you to believe there is hope. That the mistake wasn't who they are.
I don't know Chris Rainey. I don't know Meyer. I don't know KF.
I know what I've seen, read and heard about all of them.
Chris Rainey threatened someone's life. That is what we know about him. That's not a behavior issue, that is a character issue.
I believe KF practices what he preaches. Someone with that kind of character would not be playing this year (if ever) for KF. Obviously the same can't be said for Meyer.
To me, winning is about more than a W and L column. And I think I've learned that from KF.

This is very well said. This is why I love Iowa football; we seem to find a way to win the right way. I really believe that.

 

[Rawkhawk73]

I'm sorry, but from what I've seen, Urban Meyer is a terrible human being.

First, he retires at the urging of his wife and kids. But when his players beg him to come back, he turns his back on his true family and their wishes. What kind of husband and father does that?

Second, his players have been arrested something like 25 times in the last year. And we're not talking PAULA offenses here.

Finally, one of his best players is caught sending multiple texts literally threatening the life of another human being and that warrants a 2 game suspension? I'm sure it's just pure coincidence that he's coming back for the game following a 2 game losing streak.

Pretty pathetic.

 

[hawkfan340]

You guys must have short memories. Do you not remember the heat that Paterno was under 2 years ago? He had over 20 some arrests in a years time and there was that awful beat down that some football players gave to some students in an apartment. There was a whole story on ESPN about it. He only kicked one of the 5 kids off the team and these kids damn near killed the students. Here is the story

Report: Players sought revenge - The Daily Collegian Online

I do somewhat remember this, but my memory is that the guys that actually assualted people got kicked off the team. I know there were other charges that were dropped/reduced and I don't know what type of discipline those guys faced.

 

[WilcoHawk]

I say it all the time, I'd rather go 10-3 or 9-4 the right way with a coach like Ferentz than win NCs with guys like Meyer, Saban, Carroll, etc. Ferentz isn't perfect, but he sure as heck tries to do things the right way.

You know, I respect Tom Osborne a ton, but I'll never forget his decision to let Lawrence Philips back on the NU team. That was something Bowden would do--not him. I hope Ferentz never gets to the point where winning NCs causes him to make such a choice . . . and I don't think he will.