David Schwartzs ranking of players...

H

Hawkfnntn

Well-Known Member
My takes on it.
As far as the top 2 go I think they are no brainers.
He sure has JO pretty darn low considering he's more then likely going to start and play big mins....
And Dickerson pretty darn high considering nobody knows what he's capable of or what his role will be.
I wouldn't be surprised if Woody is a lot better and has averages of close to 10 pts and 5 or 6 boards or better.
GO should have a great year too. Seeing that big guy fill the lane on fast breaks is fun. Not to mention protecting the rim.
Gesell however I'm not as big a fan of. He's going to have to show me. He isn't or at least hasn't been clutch and even his good games he's not been that great. And if he's playing the 2 spot more because of Dickerson then I wonder how effective he'll be there against the taller and more athletic 2s in the league. If Gesell is getting mins at the 2 that means Iowa is playing zone D and they stink at that. I tend to think with JO and Jok he won't need to play the 2 that much.

Dominique Uhl is a huge question mark. He's not built in the same mold as Basaabe or McCabe but he will be getting those mins and asked to do alot as a true frosh. I hope White and Uthoff stay healthy and play alot of mins so we don't have to find out too much about Uhl.... So having him ranked above JO-(a starter) and Jok seems like a reach to me.
Clemmons is a big question mark too after last year. But I wouldn't have him above JO that's for sure.
I hope Ellingston red shirts.

Him having JO that low just makes me wonder what he knows that we fans don't. Coach seems to absolutely love JO and has given him the green light every trip. So I don't see how if he's getting more mins and theoretically more shots how he can't be higher on his list... I think he'll have his off nights yet sure all shooters will. But I think he'll be given closer to ten shots a game and he can do alot of damage with that. With the other weapons Iowa has I think he'll get open looks.

I am very hyped for this team to have a good year and go dancing. I think they have a fairly deep team. I'm as curious as everyone else how coach will define roles and how they'll do. The BIG and their schedule is brutal so they'll have to earn it that's for sure.
 
I agree with all of this. While we all have high hopes for Dickerson and Uhl, I think they are ranked too high. It's true that Uhl may get a fair amount of minutes because we are not deep at the forward position, but I'd expect Jok to get major minutes at the 3. Three guard lineups are not that rare in this day in age. And you're not giving up much length if you play Jok at the 3. As for Dickerson, I think it's going to take him a year to get up to speed. I don't expect him to star this year. Plus, the Mike Gessell at the 2 experiment failed last year. I expect Gessell to get most of his minutes at PG and for Dickerson and Clemmons to compete as his backup. We already have plenty of depth at the 2 with Jok and Oglesby, and that's assuming a redshirt by Ellingson.

Here's my ranking:

1) White (obvious choice)
2) Gessell (PG play is very important, needs to make free throws and finish at the rim)
3) Uthoff (can score a lot of points if he plays aggressively)
4) Jok (has the talent, simply needs to take less bad shots and play better defense)
5) Woodbury (let's hope for NCAA tournament Woodbury)
6) Ogelsby (if he shoots 40% from the 3 like last year, he'll play a lot of minutes)
7) Olaseni (should play as much as Woodbury with little drop off)
8) Clemmons (a return to freshman form make him a valuable PG backup)
9) Dickerson (could easily take Clemmons minutes)
10) Uhl (the B1G could be rough for him, as it was for newcomers Jok and Uthoff last year)
11) Ellingson (likely redshirt)
 
I couldn't believe he had Jok as #8 on his list.

Maybe it's me but I have high expectations for Peter. I like his game and see a ton of potential.
 
Hawkfnntn said:
My takes on it.
As far as the top 2 go I think they are no brainers.
He sure has JO pretty darn low considering he's more then likely going to start and play big mins....
And Dickerson pretty darn high considering nobody knows what he's capable of or what his role will be.
I wouldn't be surprised if Woody is a lot better and has averages of close to 10 pts and 5 or 6 boards or better.
GO should have a great year too. Seeing that big guy fill the lane on fast breaks is fun. Not to mention protecting the rim.
Gesell however I'm not as big a fan of. He's going to have to show me. He isn't or at least hasn't been clutch and even his good games he's not been that great. And if he's playing the 2 spot more because of Dickerson then I wonder how effective he'll be there against the taller and more athletic 2s in the league. If Gesell is getting mins at the 2 that means Iowa is playing zone D and they stink at that. I tend to think with JO and Jok he won't need to play the 2 that much.

Dominique Uhl is a huge question mark. He's not built in the same mold as Basaabe or McCabe but he will be getting those mins and asked to do alot as a true frosh. I hope White and Uthoff stay healthy and play alot of mins so we don't have to find out too much about Uhl.... So having him ranked above JO-(a starter) and Jok seems like a reach to me.
Clemmons is a big question mark too after last year. But I wouldn't have him above JO that's for sure.
I hope Ellingston red shirts.

Him having JO that low just makes me wonder what he knows that we fans don't. Coach seems to absolutely love JO and has given him the green light every trip. So I don't see how if he's getting more mins and theoretically more shots how he can't be higher on his list... I think he'll have his off nights yet sure all shooters will. But I think he'll be given closer to ten shots a game and he can do alot of damage with that. With the other weapons Iowa has I think he'll get open looks.

I am very hyped for this team to have a good year and go dancing. I think they have a fairly deep team. I'm as curious as everyone else how coach will define roles and how they'll do. The BIG and their schedule is brutal so they'll have to earn it that's for sure.
Click to expand...

He's not ranking the players by just their ability; he's not saying JO is only the 10th best player on the team. At this point, it's almost all about each player's importance, which will likely change once they start actually playing. He said that if JO started hitting 2-4 triples a game, like he hopefully will, then he'll move up. But if he's not doing that, he's just a solid defender who's great at moving without the ball but doesn't hit enough shots when he has it. That's not going to make him all that important.

Same goes for Gesell and Dickerson being ranked so high. You might not be a fan of Gesell's and Dickerson is a newcomer, but the position they play and the roles they're going to be asked to fill make them both very important this season.
 
I have a much different looking list.

1) Uthoff - we need to find a go to player and no one has the skill set he has.

2) gesell - he has the ability to be go to. He just needs to put it all together.

3) Dickerson - if Gesell can't be the answer at pg it will be him.

4) jok - he has scoring ability that is only matched by Uthoff on this team.

5) white - at this point he is who he is. If he is more consistent awesome but I wouldn't put the ball in his hands in big moments.

6) Woody - premier defender who looks ready to make a leap as a scorer.

7) olaseni - he is still learning the game but boy is his learning curve fast.

8) oglesby - need a sharpshooter off the bench. He probably starts at first but jok or Dickerson will end up in the starting lineup ahead of him.

9) uhl - could be really good from the sound of it. Like what I have heard about the athleticism. He will play and I think more than most think.

10) clemmons - he isn't the pg or defender people thought he was. Has raw skills but looks lost too much. If he can figure things out he has the tools. I just don't think it will happen.

11) ellingson - he would have been 10 if not for an injury that may redshirt him. He may be the best sharpshooter on the team from what I hear. Too bad it looks like we won't find out for another yr.
 
lightning1 said:
White
Woody
Uthoff
Gesell
Jok
Olaseni
Dickerson
Clemmons
Oglesby
Uhl
Ellingson
Click to expand...

OK......here's mine as of end of October, before seeing anyone play this season.

Aaron White: Most consistent Hawkeye, for a couple of seasons. Have a Big year, Whitey!!
Uthoff: He's a huge key for Iowa, this year.
Gesell: Floor general, hard worker, who I expect to make people forget last season
Woody: Could be #1 on this list.......I sure hope he blows Up. He has the potential, (see Tenn game)
Pete Jok: Personally, I hope he makes me forget Dev's up & DOWN play. Peter can shoot the rock.
Gabe O: Best athleticism on this list..........could vault to #1 on this list. Tremendous upside.
Ogelsby: Every team today needs a streaky 3 pt shooter. Josh can burn up the nets
Clemmons: Can really help the Hawkeyes if he plays like he did as a Freshman. Do it Anthony Sapp!
Dickerson; Quicks will help this team Win some games. Good passer too
Uhl
Baer

Ellingson: I expect him to Redshirt and then shoot lights out next year.
 
Foval21 said:
I have a much different looking list.

1) Uthoff - we need to find a go to player and no one has the skill set he has.

2) gesell - he has the ability to be go to. He just needs to put it all together.

3) Dickerson - if Gesell can't be the answer at pg it will be him.

4) jok - he has scoring ability that is only matched by Uthoff on this team.

5) white - at this point he is who he is. If he is more consistent awesome but I wouldn't put the ball in his hands in big moments.

6) Woody - premier defender who looks ready to make a leap as a scorer.

7) olaseni - he is still learning the game but boy is his learning curve fast.

8) oglesby - need a sharpshooter off the bench. He probably starts at first but jok or Dickerson will end up in the starting lineup ahead of him.

9) uhl - could be really good from the sound of it. Like what I have heard about the athleticism. He will play and I think more than most think.

10) clemmons - he isn't the pg or defender people thought he was. Has raw skills but looks lost too much. If he can figure things out he has the tools. I just don't think it will happen.

11) ellingson - he would have been 10 if not for an injury that may redshirt him. He may be the best sharpshooter on the team from what I hear. Too bad it looks like we won't find out for another yr.
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I will say you do have a much different way of looking at it.
See your looking at Gesell the way I look at White. I think Gesell isn't that great. I think last year was pretty much his ceiling and that White without Marble around is going to be a much bigger contributer at the offensive end. I think it's a coin flip between White and Uthoff for the top spot I have no qualms with Uthoff being up there he could really blow up.

MG is just too inconsistent with his shot and he's not the most athletic guy out there. Now I like him as a player I think he'll start and play pg all year. And I can be wrong maybe he'll have a monster year wouldn't hurt my feelings at all if he does. I just can't have him over White right now no way no how.

I don't think Jok is ready for starting yet. I think JO will have a big year. He's a senior and Coach loves him. He's not flashy but plays defense good enough. He takes good shots. Knows how to get his feet set. You rarely see him take an off balance shot where you say NOOOO. He's an underrated passer too. Jok is going to have to show me something before I predict it. So far yea we know he can get hot shooting. But can he take good shots with more mins and play defense better?
 
Jok
uthoff
woody

the scoring we will miss from Marble will need to be replaced by these 3 upping their production.

Mikey
Whitey

These 2 wi start and play big minutes so thus they fall here in importance but I don't have expectations for a big improvement.

ogelsby
olaseni
Clemmons/dickerson

We need Ogelsby to shoot 40+% from downtown.
Olaseni should see more minutes this year with some time coming at the 4. I'm not sure who comes out ahead between our backup PGs. I know some have high hopes for Dickerson but I haven't seen him play and nobody has seen him play against Big 10 talent so I would bet he has a year to adjust to the comp level, the traveling and such that comes with playing in this league.

I don't want to have to expect anything from either of the true fresh.
 
If we can get JO 10 3 pt. shots per game and he makes an average of 3.5-4.0, which would add 10 1/2 to 12 points per game, that would be huge. Can we get him 10 three point tries??
 
Hawkfnntn said:
I will say you do have a much different way of looking at it.
See your looking at Gesell the way I look at White. I think Gesell isn't that great. I think last year was pretty much his ceiling and that White without Marble around is going to be a much bigger contributer at the offensive end. I think it's a coin flip between White and Uthoff for the top spot I have no qualms with Uthoff being up there he could really blow up.

MG is just too inconsistent with his shot and he's not the most athletic guy out there. Now I like him as a player I think he'll start and play pg all year. And I can be wrong maybe he'll have a monster year wouldn't hurt my feelings at all if he does. I just can't have him over White right now no way no how.

I don't think Jok is ready for starting yet. I think JO will have a big year. He's a senior and Coach loves him. He's not flashy but plays defense good enough. He takes good shots. Knows how to get his feet set. You rarely see him take an off balance shot where you say NOOOO. He's an underrated passer too. Jok is going to have to show me something before I predict it. So far yea we know he can get hot shooting. But can he take good shots with more mins and play defense better?
Click to expand...

My question on white is simple...what have we seen from him that makes anyone believe he will be different this year. He isn't a ball handler. He can't shoot anything outside a drive to the basket. He is a very good 4 I really like his game but he isn't going to all of a sudden develop a three point shot because marble is gone. Where as no marble means Gesell has the ball in his hands more and he has shown flashes of being a good all around guard as a scorer and distributor. But marble stunted his growth in marble had to have the ball in his hands and could at times stop the ball movement.

Btw Gesell can jump out of the gym and is pretty darn quick. In fact he is more athletic than marble and marble did alright in his career.

jok is a guy that I think needs the minutes and he will figure things out. Some need to just get minutes and he has more upside than anyone else at the 2 guard. JO found a good niche for himself last year and I don't think he should be taken out of that. Kind of like how may found a good spot as a bench player who could provide a spark. JO can do that with his shot. Jok needs to get better at defense but if he has Woody behind him that should help as he can gamble a little and play sucker defense with Woody there to clean up some mistakes.
 
doclee said:
If we can get JO 10 3 pt. shots per game and he makes an average of 3.5-4.0, which would add 10 1/2 to 12 points per game, that would be huge. Can we get him 10 three point tries??
Click to expand...
That seems high for an average but I'm sure he'll have some games where he will. He's also a great free throw shooter if there's anyway they can get him there. He's a crafty guy he'll go back door when over played on too. I look for him to have a big year.
 
Foval21 said:
My question on white is simple...what have we seen from him that makes anyone believe he will be different this year. He isn't a ball handler. He can't shoot anything outside a drive to the basket. He is a very good 4 I really like his game but he isn't going to all of a sudden develop a three point shot because marble is gone. Where as no marble means Gesell has the ball in his hands more and he has shown flashes of being a good all around guard as a scorer and distributor. But marble stunted his growth in marble had to have the ball in his hands and could at times stop the ball movement.

Btw Gesell can jump out of the gym and is pretty darn quick. In fact he is more athletic than marble and marble did alright in his career.

jok is a guy that I think needs the minutes and he will figure things out. Some need to just get minutes and he has more upside than anyone else at the 2 guard. JO found a good niche for himself last year and I don't think he should be taken out of that. Kind of like how may found a good spot as a bench player who could provide a spark. JO can do that with his shot. Jok needs to get better at defense but if he has Woody behind him that should help as he can gamble a little and play sucker defense with Woody there to clean up some mistakes.
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I dunno about that.... I haven't seen Gesell dunk on anyone... Ever. Not that thats the end all be all for measuring athleticism but Marble scored in a lot of athletic ways that Gesell hasn't come even remotely close to doing. Not to mention his defense. The move he made on that Michigan guy last year where he sized him up for that mid range floater was sick. You don't need to see this whole thing to disbunk what your saying... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I-jcf8y0QPw

I like Gesell. He's going to have a lot on his shoulders this year without Marble that's for sure. How he'll do we'll see but he's not going to magically turn into a guy like Paige at NC...
 
Hawkfnntn said:
I dunno about that.... I haven't seen Gesell dunk on anyone... Ever. Not that thats the end all be all for measuring athleticism but Marble scored in a lot of athletic ways that Gesell hasn't come even remotely close to doing. Not to mention his defense. The move he made on that Michigan guy last year where he sized him up for that mid range floater was sick. You don't need to see this whole thing to disbunk what your saying... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I-jcf8y0QPw

I like Gesell. He's going to have a lot on his shoulders this year without Marble that's for sure. How he'll do we'll see but he's not going to magically turn into a guy like Paige at NC...
Click to expand...

If you are talking pure athleticism you have it wrong. Gesell,would out perform marble in measured feats of athleticism...such as: cone drills, vertical leap, sprints, etc.
 
Foval21 said:
If you are talking pure athleticism you have it wrong. Gesell,would out perform marble in measured feats of athleticism...such as: cone drills, vertical leap, sprints, etc.
Click to expand...
I wouldn't be so sure about that.... And that's not even what all I mean. I'll tell you what if you can find a video of MG at this time next yr on an NBA roster with a video like this then I'll agree. If MG is more athletic not as athletic but more athletic then Marble then shouldn't he be invited to a draft camp and have himself go through the paces like this? Time will tell... I'm sorry but Marble has way more basketball athleticism then MG it's not even close. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kqkKf7NomLE
 
Hawkfnntn said:
I wouldn't be so sure about that.... And that's not even what all I mean. I'll tell you what if you can find a video of MG at this time next yr on an NBA roster with a video like this then I'll agree. If MG is more athletic not as athletic but more athletic then Marble then shouldn't he be invited to a draft camp and have himself go through the paces like this? Time will tell... I'm sorry but Marble has way more basketball athleticism then MG it's not even close. Ohttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kqkKf7NomLE
Click to expand...

If you think athleticism is determined by a video and a invite you are wrong. Gesell is a better athlete whether or not. He is 6 ft and can get off the floor higher than marble he is quicker with the ball in his hands. 6'6 has something to do with marble getting the looks he does. By your system Kyle korver is a better athlete than Eric May and mike gesell. Look for videos of Gesell dunking and remember he is half a foot shorter than marble. Marble is probably a better basketball player. But that doesn't mean better athlete.
 
If Gesell was such a great athlete, he wouldn't struggle finishing as much as he does. He's a decent athlete, maybe better than some people give him credit for but he's definitely not a "jump out of the gym" type of guy.
 
In 2009 mike gesell high jumped 6'2. So basically the kid high jumped over himself. I am going to stick with the fact he has hops.
 
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