Betts or Greene?
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tm3308
Well-Known Member
If we were talking about in the NFL, I'd say Betts. Versatility is at much more of a premium in the NFL than in college. Guys who can only run, even well, aren't as in demand as guys who do a little of everything.
But, if we're talking about in college, I'd take Greene. He wasn't much of a receiver, but he was far more dominant on the ground than he could have ever hoped to be in the NFL.
But, if we're talking about in college, I'd take Greene. He wasn't much of a receiver, but he was far more dominant on the ground than he could have ever hoped to be in the NFL.
imported_ankle23
Well-Known Member
good question about starting a team today - college team? pro team?
the problem with comparing Greene to Betts while in college is that Betts was on terrible iowa teams (for the most part) and Greene was on great Iowa teams (for the most part). It would have been nice to see Betts run behind an OL that Greene ran behind.
tm3308
Well-Known Member
Their last years are what you have to look at. Greene's line was damn good, but Betts was running behind Steinbach/Nelson/etc. That's at least relatively comparable.
imported_ankle23
Well-Known Member
it is amazing that he is iowas 2nd leading rusher given the offensive lines he ran behind in '98,'99,'00, and '01. You are right, they were coming together in '01 for sure, but think of the pounding this guy took leading up to that year. that alone should make you pick Betts as the guy.
WinOneThisCentury
Well-Known Member
College team...Greene. Pro Team...Greene.
Certainly as far as college goes, when you win the Doak Walker in a landslide, you have a had a pretty big impact. I know the line was good, but let me tell you something, he made them look much better. I don't remember a back at Iowa that absolutely got the most out of every run that was there more than Shonn Greene.
He always seemed to make the right read on the zone scheme, and then he either punished you or made you look silly. oh, and he would also outrun you to the end zone. I loved watching him run in college.
Certainly as far as college goes, when you win the Doak Walker in a landslide, you have a had a pretty big impact. I know the line was good, but let me tell you something, he made them look much better. I don't remember a back at Iowa that absolutely got the most out of every run that was there more than Shonn Greene.
He always seemed to make the right read on the zone scheme, and then he either punished you or made you look silly. oh, and he would also outrun you to the end zone. I loved watching him run in college.
RocknRollface
Well-Known Member
Is this thread a joke?
Do a bit of everything vs unstoppable?
No offense to Ladell but my god its no question.
Greene wasn' t even in shape while at Iowa and the whole thing about not being able to catch is laughable. Albert Young had the best hands on his teams and got the ball thrown his way about 10 times in three years.
KF wont even pitch the ball more than once a season, he dost'n like throwing to the backs unless the running game is ineffective and he has allot of trust in the QB.
Do a bit of everything vs unstoppable?
No offense to Ladell but my god its no question.
Greene wasn' t even in shape while at Iowa and the whole thing about not being able to catch is laughable. Albert Young had the best hands on his teams and got the ball thrown his way about 10 times in three years.
KF wont even pitch the ball more than once a season, he dost'n like throwing to the backs unless the running game is ineffective and he has allot of trust in the QB.
tm3308
Well-Known Member
Like I said, Betts is my guy in the NFL. Greene is far from unstoppable in the NFL, and running the ball is his only real attribute. Betts, in his prime, could provide a solid option on the ground, but he was also a solid receiver.
Unless you have a guy that's unstoppable in one aspect (Greene in '08), it's typically better to have a back who has versatility (Betts).
And Young had 77 receptions in his final three years (he only had 2 in his injury-shorted '04 season), Betts had 31 in his final two years (NCAA stats don't go farther back than 2000). Greene had 11 in three years. And he didn't display good hands when he was thrown to, either. Young and Betts made it clear that they were solid options out of the backfield (and Young was a VERY good one).
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Herkyalert
Banned
I think that Betts is one of the greatest RB's in Iowa history simply based off what he did with so little talent around him for most of his Hawkeye career.
He sometimes looked like Barry Sanders out there fighting for yards and making things happen when nothing was there.
He sometimes looked like Barry Sanders out there fighting for yards and making things happen when nothing was there.
imported_ankle23
Well-Known Member
exactly.
it truly would be interesting to have watched Betts play behind Greene's lines.
I remember watching those early KF years - Betts got pounded.
it is really unfair to compare the two, given the teams they had around them.
ICHawk24
Well-Known Member
I believe the Hawks have pitched the ball TWICE already this season, so hold onto your hat!
All the things said about Betts are true, but Greene is the most dominant RB I have seen in the Big Ten in my life, not just Iowa. I'm only 32, but that guy had the best combination of vision, balance, power, and speed that I have seen in the 25 years that I can actually remember. I believe Shaw to be the next best Iowa back that I remember. Betts would probably be next, and I don't really remember Harmon very well. Tavian Banks would qualify as the most explosive Iowa running back that I recall.
hawkeye2011
Well-Known Member
I'm not sure. Obviously LB's ability to stay in the NFL for so long says something about him as a player.
However as good as SG was in 08, and as many accolades as he received, I believe Iowa fans still manage to underestimate just how good he was and how important he was to the football team that season.
He has incredible feet and I still enjoy watching the outside zone run cuts of that season. They are a thing of beauty. Watching those SG highlight videos also gives you some perspective to how good Rob Bruggeman was a center that year, but I digress.
However as good as SG was in 08, and as many accolades as he received, I believe Iowa fans still manage to underestimate just how good he was and how important he was to the football team that season.
He has incredible feet and I still enjoy watching the outside zone run cuts of that season. They are a thing of beauty. Watching those SG highlight videos also gives you some perspective to how good Rob Bruggeman was a center that year, but I digress.
RocknRollface
Well-Known Member
I am talking Iowa since this is a Iowa football board.
The RB position in the NFL is far less important. Its hard to even name running backs in the NFL anymore other than a couple.
Im surprised to see Young had that many receptions, I dont remember them throwing the ball to him nearly enough.
I still say Greenes poor hands were an exaggeration from lack of evidence. His hands have looked decent with the Jets.
As far as the NFL goes, Greene is a starter and I don't recall Betts ever being a full time one.
tm3308
Well-Known Member
That's what you're talking about, but the OP wasn't clear on whether we're talking about an NFL team or a college team.
As for Betts never being a full-time starter: it's not as though he couldn't have been. He was stuck behind Stephen Davis in his prime, and Clinton Portis (also in his prime) after that.
His statline:
3,361 yards
4.1 ypc
15 TDs
188 receptions
1,646 yards
8.8 ypr
3 TD
His 2006 campaign was pretty impressive. Rushed for 1,154 yards at a 4.7 ypc clip. Had 53 receptions for 445 yards (8.4 ypr).
He had the ability to be a solid starter once upon a time. He just had the misfortune of being on the same team as other running backs who were among the best in the league at the time.
And Greene hasn't done much in his time as a starter, so I don't think we can really hold the "he's a regular starter" over Betts at this point.
I love me some Greene, but the evidence just isn't there to say that he's a better guy to build around in the NFL than Betts (could have been). In today's NFL, Betts (in his prime) would likely be the more valuable player.
In college, a guy that was as unstoppable as Greene will always be more valuable than a jack of all trades.
