Athleticism Does Not Equal 'Jumping High'

wundergrape said:
I already provided it: a collection of attributes which allows one to succeed at athletics.

Card playing ain't athletics.
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but you said coordination is part of athletics... what about a golfer is that athletic? or a Nascar driver?

I'm not saying I agree or disagree but what constitutes "Athletic" isn't as easy as you are pretending.

I'd say a golfer is athletic but many people will argue that's its not.
 
To address the theory of the OP: It is true that there is MUCH more to athletic ability than ability to jump (vertical). But the way I see it, athleticism is a term that relates to the physical ability of an athlete to do stuff.

And how we define athleticism should vary depending on what we're talking about. So in basketball, for a center, jumping and the ability to control the area around the rim is vital. He doesn't have that ability. So you can say "athleticism does not equal jumping high", but in hoops it actually sort of does.

Also the real key here is establishing that there's a huge difference between being athletic and being good. Woodbury is good, but he's not very athletic. I'm struggling to find the inverse example... but Doug Thomas was athletic and not very good.

I think the sports world needs a word which describes the physical skills AW does have, because they do not fall under the realm of pure athleticism. I can't think of that word. Maybe it's savvy or we could call it court vision. Because he understands what is going on around him and he can move his feet to where he needs to be, but this is not athleticism. Gabe has athleticism.
 
Bigtenchamp said:
but you said coordination is part of athletics... what about a golfer is that athletic? or a Nascar driver?

I'm not saying I agree or disagree but what constitutes "Athletic" isn't as easy as you are pretending.

I'd say a golfer is athletic but many people will argue that's its not.
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Of course being coordinated is part of athleticism. That doesn't mean that everything that requires coordination is, by extension, athletics.

Athletics, as defined by OED, is "physical sports and games of any kind." You cited two fringe sports to purposely muddy the waters - how much physicality is required to play these?

However, I would argue that, for the most part, athletics demands pretty much the same type of skill sets with varying degrees of particular emphasis. For wrestling, strength is emphasized. For basketball, leaping. But as I explained in my original post, regardless of it being an accentuated skill, leaping does not define "athletic" in basketball. Just as "coordination" does not define a golfer.
 
What makes someone good at basketball? that's not so hard to define but the exact term "athleticism" can be argued around in circles about
 
IowaTeddy said:
To address the theory of the OP: It is true that there is MUCH more to athletic ability than ability to jump (vertical). But the way I see it, athleticism is a term that relates to the physical ability of an athlete to do stuff.

And how we define athleticism should vary depending on what we're talking about. So in basketball, for a center, jumping and the ability to control the area around the rim is vital. He doesn't have that ability. So you can say "athleticism does not equal jumping high", but in hoops it actually sort of does.

Also the real key here is establishing that there's a huge difference between being athletic and being good. Woodbury is good, but he's not very athletic. I'm struggling to find the inverse example... but Doug Thomas was athletic and not very good.

I think the sports world needs a word which describes the physical skills AW does have, because they do not fall under the realm of pure athleticism. I can't think of that word. Maybe it's savvy or we could call it court vision. Because he understands what is going on around him and he can move his feet to where he needs to be, but this is not athleticism. Gabe has athleticism.
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No, it doesn't. It's part of what defines athleticism in basketball. How high can Steve Nash jump? He's one of the most athletic players I've ever seen.

....and just to clarify: this thread is not about Adam Woodbury. My point was as much about Marble, McCabe, Oglesby and Jok as it was about Woody.
 
exactly and I think that argument won't get us anywhere and i don't want to have it. But one thing I do think is that athleticism can be defined and viewed differently for varying sports and games. So instead of debating whether or not a golfer is athletic, we could just say that there are physical skills that relate to golfing and can make a golfer athletic (for golf).

leaping ability is one of the most important physical skills that relates to basketball athleticism
 
wundergrape said:
No, it doesn't. It's part of what defines athleticism in basketball. How high can Steve Nash jump? He's one of the most athletic players I've ever seen.

....and just to clarify: this thread is not about Adam Woodbury. My point was as much about Marble, McCabe, Oglesby and Jok as it was about Woody.
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You highlighted part of my post, but did you read anything after it? And steve nash has a way higher vertical than AW (or had in his prime)
 
dwh5er said:
Did you see him run the floor, catch the pass from White and take it to the rim in one fluid motion? Yes, fluid. That was an athletic play.

Furthermore, I doubt you can contribute at a d1 level without being athletic. If you want to argue he is not AS athletic as others, I'll buy in. But to say he is not athletic is ludicrous.
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I was watching him on the play you referenced in your post. The guy I sit next to has a pretty good basketball background...better than mine, for sure. When Woodbury made that move, my neighbor and I just looked at each other and said, "Wow. Just Wow." I know one snowflake don't make a blizzard, but, the times I see Woody look "not athletic" is when he tries to think through his moves, rather than just playing basketball. I am guessing (just guessing) that Fran continues to start him and talks about his upside consistently is that like many big guys...football is the same way...it takes some time for them to grow into that big ol' body that often bumps into things because he don't know how big he is.
 
doclee said:
I was watching him on the play you referenced in your post. The guy I sit next to has a pretty good basketball background...better than mine, for sure. When Woodbury made that move, my neighbor and I just looked at each other and said, "Wow. Just Wow." I know one snowflake don't make a blizzard, but, the times I see Woody look "not athletic" is when he tries to think through his moves, rather than just playing basketball. I am guessing (just guessing) that Fran continues to start him and talks about his upside consistently is that like many big guys...football is the same way...it takes some time for them to grow into that big ol' body that often bumps into things because he don't know how big he is.
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Perhaps, then, his overthinking is what makes him appear to be unathletic. I think as the game slows down for him we will see him make more athletic plays.

I think many used to argue that James Morris wasn't athletic enough early in his career. This year, he looked much more athletic - making athletic plays. Maybe a result of less thinking and just reacting?
 
You either have "ups" or you don't.....plain and simple......doesn't mean you're athletic or not......I believe, in basketball anyways, you react to tendencies within the game......anticipation is the key....players always have a "tell", and if you can anticipate those you will succeed....
 
so wunder you ever answered my question - is a golfer, bowler, ect athletic?

Agree to disagree isn't really an answer.
 
Bigtenchamp said:
so wunder you ever answered my question - is a golfer, bowler, ect athletic?



Agree to disagree isn't really an answer.
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Could they be athletic? Yes. Is it a prerequisite to being successful in those sports? Debatable. Does it hurt to be athletic in those sports? Probably not at all.
 
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