Players Sharing Revenue

[eyekwah]

There are not lot of pragmatist these days. Pragmatist: One who acts in response to particular situations rather than upon abstract ideals; one who is willing to ignore their ideals to accomplish goals.

A lot of mud is going to be thrown at the wall while this revenue sharing gets sorted out. How much sticks and is adopted is unclear. In observing the participants you can see every negative form of behavior because the money incentives are too great to be ignored. Right now there are not clear goals. If one of the goals is financial equity among conferences and colleges it isn't going to fly. Witness the animosity that broke up the Big XII. When one of your own conference members can't agree on how much of the pie they deserve it is a recipe for failure.

I'm not sure you can get the 4 conferences to sit down and write a Nicene Creed for College sports. Finding a person to accomplish that would be challenging. At this point you really need an agreement for the parties involved to accept an arbitrator to establish the framework for revenue sharing. If congress legislated it to NLRB appointed arbitrator you most likely would get something done.

 

[Fryowa]

This might be the most intelligent thread I have read on a sports board, ever.

Fry, not liking this particular change does not mean old people don't understand and want change because not all change is good. For example, outside of a few ultra wealthy bankers does anyone think the banking industry is either safe or solid in the US, and frankly most Western/Middle Eastern nations? I'd like repeal Dodd-Frank and Gram Leach Bliley. Return to Glass Steagall, from 1933 and the New Deal-and I'm a Republican.

Or smaller issues. I'd like to see a four-square block new arena starting where Book & Supply and working toward Burlington. That's big change.

Old White men have seen a lot in the world. We've been sold on "change" countless times and it turned out to be change for the worse.

I come across a lot more people in daily life than I do online of on HN, and I talk a lot of college sports because I'm a boring person and don't have a lot of interesting stuff going on.

The older crowd are overwhelmingly the ones who are against NIL and transfers. By far and away. This board is not your typical demographic because most people here are 99% more informed than the general public, so I get the bristling about me saying what I said.

But the fact still remains that most of the folks railing against NIL and free transferring are white guys over 60. And they're railing against it for no reason other than it messes with their idyllic version of what college sports should be and can't come up with a substantive argument that doesn't eventually circle back to, "Because I said so..."

 

[Fryowa]

...NIL is a problem that needs fixing.

It's not a "problem" that affects you in any way other than your own nostalgic longing. You have no stake in any college athletes' lives, no stake in a college sports team, no stake in any of it. If college sports disappeared altogether or if it thrived it would make zero material difference in your life. NIL and transferring has no affect on the public good whatsoever, either. It's all paid for with privately generated money.

But yet you think that even though it has no effect on you or society (other than your moral perception) that you should be able to dictate how these kids' personal lives go. That's total bullshit. It isn't any of your business whether a kid transfers or leaves a school for more money or gets 5 cars and a house given to him to play sports. You are free to not like it (I don't either), but that's where it ends. If enough people stop watching because of it...it'll go away on it's own. But guess what...that' ain't happening.

It isn't a problem. You just think it's a problem.

 

[Teddy]

Traditions are important for every culture. They cleave us. They distinguish us from the somewhere else people. Funding college athletics isn't Christmas either. The Rubicon has been crossed on player payment, there is no going back on that. We need a fix in place for the portal, and there are many options, before the current combination of constant free agency and no team salary caps does destroy college sports for all but the most addicted of fans.

 

[eyekwah]

Recently the number $30,000,000 per year/per school for damages related to NIL. Below are revenue figures and expenses for B1G teams in 2023. From some reports roster sizes are going to be imposed to mitigate the problems of cutting out sports and dealing with title IX scholarships for women. I don't think even B1G teams can avoid cutting some team sports. What sports do you keep?

1	Ohio State	Big 10	$251,615,345	$225,733,418	$0*	0.00%
4	Michigan	Big 10	$210,652,287	$193,559,375	$153,059*	0.07%
9	Penn State	Big 10	$181,227,448	$170,542,050	$0	0.00%
12	Michigan State	Big 10	$172,799,513	$156,449,795	$1,358,948*	0.79%
13	Indiana	Big 10	$166,761,471	$132,392,596	$2,708,975	1.62%
19	Oregon	Pac-12	$153,510,555	$140,565,297	$530,816	0.35%
21	Iowa	Big 10	$151,483,092	$151,144,861	$650,000	0.43%
22	Wisconsin	Big 10	$150,100,977	$147,807,183	$3,028,185*	2.02%
24	Illinois	Big 10	$145,735,330	$129,119,247	$10,145,405*	6.96%
25	Washington	Pac-12	$145,184,864	$149,458,923	$15,082,998	10.39%
26	Nebraska	Big 10	$143,423,944	$131,181,951	$0*	0.00%
29	Minnesota	Big 10	$135,198,272	$130,285,463	$7,986,732	5.91%
37	Purdue	Big 10	$115,139,432	$93,025,810	$0	0.00%
42	Rutgers	Big 10	$109,601,529	$138,439,077	$24,034,296	21.93%
43	Maryland	Big 10	$107,526,374	$114,385,462	$15,252,530	14.18%
47	UCLA	Pac-12	$103,061,344	$131,106,913	$2,577,213	2.50%
NA	USC
NA	NW

 

[Teddy]

That is a tough call after the obvious. Football, basketball, wrestling, baseball/softball seem clear keeps. We have a very good tradition in field hockey, so that's probably a keep.

The AD has a tremendous pressure to raise money. As I have been saying since the Barta replacement that Goetz's first job was to raise more money. This development isn't new but it's becoming desperate already.

 

[NCHawker]

When its all said and done, I suspect the bag man will still be there. Its a damn shame but I don't think it can be avoided. Tax Free Cash, Confidential Bonus to Sweeten the deal

 

[Teddy]

When its all said and done, I suspect the bag man will still be there. Its a damn shame but I don't think it can be avoided. Tax Free Cash, Confidential Bonus to Sweeten the deal

I couldn't agree more. Of course there will be cheating on a massive scale. These kids may be huge and talented, but they are still immature and juvenile high school kids. Many from poor backgrounds will be influenced by parents or family members that plan to benefit from the money. The already functionally limited regulatory power the NCAA will become an entirely a toothless tiger.

My opposition to NIL has nothing to do with a preference for nostalgia. It stems from opposition to corruption, chaos and confusion that will be ultimately fatal to schools like Iowa.

 

[thedukeofearl]

That is a tough call after the obvious. Football, basketball, wrestling, baseball/softball seem clear keeps. We have a very good tradition in field hockey, so that's probably a keep.

The AD has a tremendous pressure to raise money. As I have been saying since the Barta replacement that Goetz's first job was to raise more money. This development isn't new but it's becoming desperate already.

 

[BigD]

I wonder if academics will still play a part in the requirements to be eligible to play. Also if this still holds true how will that work with contracts. A player signs a contract and receives money to play but then are declared ineligible to play because their grades keep them from playing. Take away the academics requirement and what they hell does wearing any teams logo mean? It defeats the total meaning of college athletics as it will have nothing to do with the college uniform you put on. “Show Me The Money.”

 

[eyekwah]

I wonder if academics will still play a part in the requirements to be eligible to play. Also if this still holds true how will that work with contracts. A player signs a contract and receives money to play but then are declared ineligible to play because their grades keep them from playing. Take away the academics requirement and what they hell does wearing any teams logo mean? It defeats the total meaning of college athletics as it will have nothing to do with the college uniform you put on. “Show Me The Money.”

I've wondered about the academic side long before NIL came along. I have a difficult time with how transfers can immediately become eligible. The admission offices must be pretty lenient accepting credits from other institutions. Once upon a time students had to be making progress toward a degree. Typically a person would want 32 credits per year to stay on pace to graduate in 4 years. If a transfer comes in with only 45 credits and they are in their 3rd year I don't see that as making progress toward a degree.

 

[Fryowa]

Take away the academics requirement and what they hell does wearing any teams logo mean? It defeats the total meaning of college athletics as it will have nothing to do with the college uniform you put on. “Show Me The Money.”

LOL.

The meaning was taken out of college sports a looooooong time ago, my friend.

 

[NorthKCHawk]

LOL.

The meaning was taken out of college sports a looooooong time ago, my friend.

I get that things have changed, but these kids have always been young men who are students at the university they represent. To my understanding, the settlement and revenue sharing is not intended to change that. Again, if it does, and these kids are no longer students at the school, I am out. At that point CFB is just a second tier professional league. I don't watch the XFL and I would not watch CFP if it moved away from students under the helmet. Pay them. No problem there. But, they need to go to class and work towards a degree. Most of these young men won't be making a living playing football after college.

I get others may disagree, but that's my line in the sand.

 

[Hawkfnntn]

I get that things have changed, but these kids have always been young men who are students at the university they represent. To my understanding, the settlement and revenue sharing is not intended to change that. Again, if it does, and these kids are no longer students at the school, I am out. At that point CFB is just a second tier professional league. I don't watch the XFL and I would not watch CFP if it moved away from students under the helmet. Pay them. No problem there. But, they need to go to class and work towards a degree. Most of these young men won't be making a living playing football after college.

I get others may disagree, but that's my line in the sand.

Yeah 5-10 yrs ago I'd have cared about this more. Now I've evolved on it. I just can't bring myself to anymore. Everyone just uses everyone. $ is all that matters at the end of the day so long as the schools are making $ why should they pretend to care if they are educating anyone (that doesn't want to be) or not? I mean sure keep the option there for those that do. But for the some that don't so be it.

These players are all gonna be ending up being unionized employees pretty much. Maybe not in the next yr or so but we'll live long enough to see it. The title IX ramifications of it all and how the pie gets split up what sports are kept and cut are what'll interest me. Will football teams have unlimited roster spots by cutting down the scholly count yet having unlimited 'walk ons' that are still paid for. I bet that 85 scholly number won't stay the same.

 

[NorthKCHawk]

Yeah 5-10 yrs ago I'd have cared about this more. Now I've evolved on it. I just can't bring myself to anymore. Everyone just uses everyone. $ is all that matters at the end of the day so long as the schools are making $ why should they pretend to care if they are educating anyone (that doesn't want to be) or not? I mean sure keep the option there for those that do. But for the some that don't so be it.

These players are all gonna be ending up being unionized employees pretty much. Maybe not in the next yr or so but we'll live long enough to see it. The title IX ramifications of it all and how the pie gets split up what sports are kept and cut are what'll interest me. Will football teams have unlimited roster spots by cutting down the scholly count yet having unlimited 'walk ons' that are still paid for. I bet that 85 scholly number won't stay the same.

The only clean way to regulate this is from Congress. Antitrust, Title IX, NLRB/unions. The NCAA and conferences can't find a path without Congress giving them authority to sidestep those issues. While the settlement and revenue is all about football, Title IX does not allow the schools to just give the money to the football players. Even through they are the ones that earned it. Absent a change in the law, the biggest winners in this deal will be the women's field hockey team because female athletes are going to get half the damn pot....

 

[Hawkfnntn]

The only clean way to regulate this is from Congress. Antitrust, Title IX, NLRB/unions. The NCAA and conferences can't find a path without Congress giving them authority to sidestep those issues. While the settlement and revenue is all about football, Title IX does not allow the schools to just give the money to the football players. Even through they are the ones that earned it. Absent a change in the law, the biggest winners in this deal will be the women's field hockey team because female athletes are going to get half the damn pot....

Yeah Title IX is gonna have a whole lot to say about how this goes. They won't lay down. They won't settle for a nickel less then 50% of everything that comes in. Nor should they just based on how the law sits now. For some schools that'll mean the cutting of more mens sports. Footballs body count being so high skews it so much. At Iowa what would be on the chopping block if it came down to it? Baseball?

 

[Teddy]

Much of the interest is school loyalty. I mean, be true to your school like you would to your girl, right. Unlike the pros most of college sports is meant for the people that aren't ND, tOSU and Alabama fans, but all the people that support their alma maters and/or the locals. A few schools will have the money to keep going but most will simply eschew pointless attempts at competition with the 30 or so schools that are preserved for some lower-level pro league.

 

[BigD]

LOL.

The meaning was taken out of college sports a looooooong time ago, my friend.

Yeah I know. The SEC was the model school on this. Some of the Big Ten schools were trying to do things right, but there were also schools that at least made an effort to not go to far over the top. I know of former Iowa players who told me of $100 dollar hand shakes with booster. Nothing like what USC was doing under Pete Carrol.

I just don’t understand the Clarett (?spelling) situation. Why did Ohio State have to stoop to cheating when their reputation garnered them top recruits? Oklahoma and Texas were always playing dirty between themselves. Also Alabama mysteriously after being down for several years suddenly is king of the hill under Saban. I am not pointing fingers at anyone associated with any coaching staffs, but more at their wealthy boosters. I certainly would not be shocked to know how many coaches were deeply involved with their boosters.

 

[Teddy]

Yeah I know. The SEC was the model school on this. Some of the Big Ten schools were trying to do things right, but there were also schools that at least made an effort to not go to far over the top. I know of former Iowa players who told me of $100 dollar hand shakes with booster. Nothing like what USC was doing under Pete Carrol.

I just don’t understand the Clarett (?spelling) situation. Why did Ohio State have to stoop to cheating when their reputation garnered them top recruits? Oklahoma and Texas were always playing dirty between themselves. Also Alabama mysteriously after being down for several years suddenly is king of the hill under Saban. I am not pointing fingers at anyone associated with any coaching staffs, but more at their wealthy boosters. I certainly would not be shocked to know how many coaches were deeply involved with their boosters.

The head coaches usually have insulated themselves using agents and other negotiating entities.

 

[Fryowa]

I get that things have changed, but these kids have always been young men who are students at the university they represent. To my understanding, the settlement and revenue sharing is not intended to change that. Again, if it does, and these kids are no longer students at the school, I am out. At that point CFB is just a second tier professional league. I don't watch the XFL and I would not watch CFP if it moved away from students under the helmet. Pay them. No problem there. But, they need to go to class and work towards a degree. Most of these young men won't be making a living playing football after college.

I get others may disagree, but that's my line in the sand.

I'm actually starting to lose interest for lots of reasons. The first is that I just have things to do that bring me just as much joy as Hawkeye football, and I can't justify the amount of time and money it takes to go to games with what KF has done to the program with his son and his stubbornness to cut bait. Driving 11 hours round trip and paying for a motel, gas, food, etc isn't as fun anymore as it was a few years ago. There's just no excitement anymore, and I've given it more than a fair chance. KF has taken the Saturday morning electricity out of the air in Iowa City with what he's done trying to make Brian the president elect. We'll see how this year goes but I won't be at more than maybe one game. I have plenty in the fall to keep me busy with my weekends free.

The other big reason is free transfers. It's not fun to me to follow the sport because everyone can leave willy nilly, so it takes some of the fandom out of it for me. To be clear, I am not against transferring or NIL in any way. I think it's totally fine and athletes deserve the money. When I say I'm out and that I don't like it so it makes me less interested, that's me moving along on my own and not decrying what's going on or saying there needs to be a change. I'll consume what's interesting to me, and pass on what isn't. If college football gets to the point where it isn't fun to watch (for me), I'll just walk away. What I won't do is come on a message board and bitch about how kids are entitled and don't deserve to get paid or transfer, and give 20 bullshit reasons why they need to change the rules to restrict kids I've never met and have no stake in. Not aiming that at you, btw, I'm aiming at people who do that stuff...of which there are plenty here.