Kirk Breaks Down Position Battle



At this point, how much is this Kirk's decision and how much is it Phil's, who is starting on defense?

I mean, sure, I know Kirk has the power to veto any decision by Phil and yes, Kirk can decide, Ok we are moving Logan Jones from DL to the OL, but other than that, who really decides who starts and plays on defense? Its got to be Phil Parker, right?
 


guffus said:
At this point, how much is this Kirk's decision and how much is it Phil's, who is starting on defense?

I mean, sure, I know Kirk has the power to veto any decision by Phil and yes, Kirk can decide, Ok we are moving Logan Jones from DL to the OL, but other than that, who really decides who starts and plays on defense? Its got to be Phil Parker, right?
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Yup. Phil. And increasingly, Tim Lester.
 


A good leader hires good people, assigns their responsibilities, and trusts them to carry them out. Posters are always debating how much control KF has over this or that. The reality is that he is the boss, but if his coordinators and position coaches feel a certain way, he is almost always going to trust their judgment. Its a collaboration. If there is not agreement and its a close call, he is the one that settles it. Usually who should be playing is relatively obvious to the coaches as a whole.
 


NorthKCHawk said:
A good leader hires good people, assigns their responsibilities, and trusts them to carry them out. Posters are always debating how much control KF has over this or that. The reality is that he is the boss, but if his coordinators and position coaches feel a certain way, he is almost always going to trust their judgment. It’s a collaboration. If there is not agreement and its a close call, he is the one that settles it. Usually who should be playing is relatively obvious to the coaches as a whole.
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Everybody should read this. Very good stuff.
 




The other thing is that position coaches and even coordinators can have blind spots. You really like a kid and see he has such potential, but when he gets on the field he makes the same mistakes over and over again. KF has to look at the bigger picture and help his assistants see things they may not want to see.

That all said, I cannot imagine a universe in which the OC says, I 100% believe in this guy as our starting QB, and KF says, "nah, play the other guy." If that happens, you have the wrong OC. You gotta let the chef pick his own ingredients, and I believe that KF is the kind of coach that might try to persuade his coordinators who to play, but not order them to do so against their will.
 


NorthKCHawk said:
The other thing is that position coaches and even coordinators can have blind spots. You really like a kid and see he has such potential, but when he gets on the field he makes the same mistakes over and over again. KF has to look at the bigger picture and help his assistants see things they may not want to see.

That all said, I cannot imagine a universe in which the OC says, I 100% believe in this guy as our starting QB, and KF says, "nah, play the other guy." If that happens, you have the wrong OC. You gotta let the chef pick his own ingredients, and I believe that KF is the kind of coach that might try to persuade his coordinators who to play, but not order them to do so against their will.
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This is where the politics of NIL and transfer portal come into play. Say the kid they paid a lot to transfer in is getting outplayed by the 2 star sophomore recruit kinda thing. I kinda think we ran into that last yr with Cade and Brenden Sullivan. Does anyone think that Cade was out playing him in practice? Then you have style of play with one being a mobile QB and the other wasn't.

OSU just picked Sayin to be their starter over Kienholz. One would like to think it's as cut and dry as the 'best' player gets the nod. But there's just more that goes into it sometimes. Having a HC and OC that work together is just imperative. We the public shouldn't be hearing about differences of opinions they may have as they debate those decisions. Those are behind closed door meetings and we find out the results later. Only hindsight as time goes on is how we find out if decisions were right or not.
 


NorthKCHawk said:
A good leader hires good people, assigns their responsibilities, and trusts them to carry them out. Posters are always debating how much control KF has over this or that. The reality is that he is the boss, but if his coordinators and position coaches feel a certain way, he is almost always going to trust their judgment. Its a collaboration. If there is not agreement and its a close call, he is the one that settles it. Usually who should be playing is relatively obvious to the coaches as a whole.
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That was perhaps Hayden Fry's best trait as a HC.
 


#1DieHardHawk said:
That was perhaps Hayden Fry's best trait as a HC.
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To this day still has the most unreal coaching tree. He knew how to hire good assistants that had aspirations of being HCs themselves down the road. He had a mix of young guys and older guys you name it. Bill Snyder followed Fry from North TX he'd originally been his QB coach there before becoming the OC at Iowa. When one thinks of Snyders career they often forget just how long he was an assistant and OC before he even got the KSU gig. He was Chuck Longs OC and at Iowa like 10 yrs I bet I'd have to look it up.

And Snyder was just the tip of the iceberg most of his staff went on to do great things. Stoops Alvarez KF etc. It's pretty ridiculous. The story of college football can't really be told without going back to Fry and his long lasting impact from his coaching tree.
 


Hawkfnntn said:
To this day still has the most unreal coaching tree. He knew how to hire good assistants that had aspirations of being HCs themselves down the road. He had a mix of young guys and older guys you name it. Bill Snyder followed Fry from North TX he'd originally been his QB coach there before becoming the OC at Iowa. When one thinks of Snyders career they often forget just how long he was an assistant and OC before he even got the KSU gig. He was Chuck Longs OC and at Iowa like 10 yrs I bet I'd have to look it up.

And Snyder was just the tip of the iceberg most of his staff went on to do great things. Stoops Alvarez KF etc. It's pretty ridiculous. The story of college football can't really be told without going back to Fry and his long lasting impact from his coaching tree.
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Agreed. And the second levels to the tree are crazy too Bill Snyder alone: Mangino, Leavitt, McCarney, Bielema, Stoops. And Stoops' tree is pretty crazy as well, and there are a lot of commonalities between the various trees of the Fry tree.

Hayden is one of most underrated influencers in the history of the sport.
 


Hawkfnntn said:
To this day still has the most unreal coaching tree. He knew how to hire good assistants that had aspirations of being HCs themselves down the road. He had a mix of young guys and older guys you name it. Bill Snyder followed Fry from North TX he'd originally been his QB coach there before becoming the OC at Iowa. When one thinks of Snyders career they often forget just how long he was an assistant and OC before he even got the KSU gig. He was Chuck Longs OC and at Iowa like 10 yrs I bet I'd have to look it up.

And Snyder was just the tip of the iceberg most of his staff went on to do great things. Stoops Alvarez KF etc. It's pretty ridiculous. The story of college football can't really be told without going back to Fry and his long lasting impact from his coaching tree.
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How does Ferentz' coaching tree compare?
I'm having difficulty recalling any of his assistants, etc. who have gone on to comparable success as those in Fry's coaching tree.
 


SCHawkeye2 said:
How does Ferentz' coaching tree compare?
I'm having difficulty recalling any of his assistants, etc. who have gone on to comparable success as those in Fry's coaching tree.
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Not all that well, but in fairness, KF's assistants really don't leave. He has had 3 OCs and 2 DCS in his 26 years at the helm. That is insane!

Joe Philben is by far the most successful of the coaches who left. He was HC for the Dolphins and has otherwise had a good career in the NFL after he left Iowa.

I guess you can count Bielema, but that is a bit of a stretch. He is more of the Snyder side of the Fry tree.

Coach Fry wanted his assistants to move up, move out, and succeed elsewhere. KF has always valued stability and has obviously created incredible loyalty in his coaching staff, for better or worse.
 


Hawkfnntn said:
To this day still has the most unreal coaching tree. He knew how to hire good assistants that had aspirations of being HCs themselves down the road. He had a mix of young guys and older guys you name it. Bill Snyder followed Fry from North TX he'd originally been his QB coach there before becoming the OC at Iowa. When one thinks of Snyders career they often forget just how long he was an assistant and OC before he even got the KSU gig. He was Chuck Longs OC and at Iowa like 10 yrs I bet I'd have to look it up.

And Snyder was just the tip of the iceberg most of his staff went on to do great things. Stoops Alvarez KF etc. It's pretty ridiculous. The story of college football can't really be told without going back to Fry and his long lasting impact from his coaching tree.
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And, don't forget Barry Alvarez
 


NorthKCHawk said:
Agreed. And the second levels to the tree are crazy too Bill Snyder alone: Mangino, Leavitt, McCarney, Bielema, Stoops. And Stoops' tree is pretty crazy as well, and there are a lot of commonalities between the various trees of the Fry tree.

Hayden is one of most underrated influencers in the history of the sport.
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Including the influence to recruit African American football players…in Texas
 




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